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78-69

Said Horacio Ramirez after the game:

I gave up three singles and walked a guy...I was stunned when there was a runner on first and second and I turned around and saw somebody warming up.

Welcome to Seattle, the only city on the continent where a guy can run the worst ERA of any pitcher in baseball with more than ten starts and still be surprised when his manager has a quick hook. You know why he was surprised? Because he didn't expect it. You know why he didn't expect it? Because he's never had any reason to expect it. Horacio Ramirez has been granted so many undeserved opportunities this year that he takes to the mound thinking he's earned himself the manager's confidence.

Step back for a moment and consider how absurdly ridiculous this is. Horacio Ramirez has a 7.16 ERA over 20 starts. Only two pitchers have put up a worse ERA this year over at least 50 innings - both of them Devil Rays, and neither of them still in the Majors. In just seven of his starts has Horacio managed to see the sixth inning, and even that's only happened one time since July 28th. He walks more batters than he strikes out. He has a batting average against of .337. With more innings, his home run rate would rank tenth-highest in baseball despite groundball tendencies that should theoretically help him. The fans and media have been talking about how every successive start feels like "Horacio's last chance" for what seems like months now. And this man is surprised when his manager finally grows impatient?

Just think about the kind of organizational environment that must be in place in order to foster thinking like Horacio's. Of course this is a happy clubhouse. Why wouldn't it be? The people who've been around the game for a few years - the people who have voices - get whatever they want. For God's sake, this is the team that kept putting Richie Sexson in the lineup despite a leg problem that was allegedly killing his productivity. This coaching staff, led by John McLaren, just doesn't have anyone capable of sitting a player down and having a difficult conversation. They won't do it. Somehow, somewhere along the way, they came to believe that the mood in the dugout has more to do with performance than ability. The loyalty has paid off in some cases, but it's killed us in others, and at the end of the day this team just didn't stand a chance as long as it was getting a .200 average from first base and a combined 6.70 ERA from the back of the rotation.

With shorter leashes and a little more creativity, the Mariners might've found themselves in playoff position today. Instead they're left wondering where it all went wrong. It sucks to think about, but there's definitely a lesson to be learned here. Please, if nothing else, take this opportunity to learn from today's mistakes so that you don't repeat them tomorrow. At least that way we'll know we got more than just heartbreak out of this whole season.

Maybe we didn't have enough talent. Maybe this team was just never good enough to stay in contention. But without ever daring to rock the boat and shake things up a little bit, we'll never know for sure. When faced with hope, most teams try to squeeze every last drop out of their roster that they can. The Mariners become paralyzed with inactivity.

Learn. Learn, or continue to get left behind.

Biggest Contribution: Sean Green, +1.4%
Biggest Suckfest: Horacio Ramirez, -24.1%
Most Important AB: Ichiro single, +3.0%
Most Important Pitch: Young single, -10.0%
Total Contribution by Pitcher(s): -31.4%
Total Contribution by Hitters: -21.9%
Total Contribution by Opposition: +3.3%

(What is this chart?)

If this game had any redeeming value at all, it was that we got to see Jorge Campillo make the longest Major League appearance of his career. Not that Jorge Campillo is anything special aside from being a new log in a sea of rotting driftwood, but at least this gives me the opportunity to say my piece, which is probably long overdue given how frequently his name seems to come up.

Jorge Campillo is not a solid, Major League-caliber starting pitcher. That impression isn't borne out by either his repertoire or his performance. You already know about his arsenal - fastball around 85, changeup around 75, big looping curve around 70-72. That's not going to blow anyone's mind. Before you accuse me of having an unfair scout-style bias against a junkballing righty, though, his numbers aren't impressive, either. Observe:

PCL League Average:

K/9: 7.03
GB/FB: 1.51
LD%: 18.0%

Jorge Campillo:

K/9: 5.97
GB/FB: 1.21
LD%: 23.0%
OPS against on road: .818 (Cheney is a pitcher's park)

A flyball, contact pitcher with a rookie league fastball and no apparent ability to miss the fat part of the bat. Color me enthused. The ERA is shiny, but considering we've seen the same kind of PCL mastery by the likes of Brian Falkenborg, Denny Stark, and Craig Anderson before, I'm not going to give it much stock.

Incidentally, one of my favorite pitchers of all time was a former Orioles prospect by the name of John Stephens, an Aussie import who saw nerve damage drop his fastball from ML-caliber down to the 82-86mph range. And yet, despite the injury, Stephens was able to use his good command and quality offspeed stuff to just tear through the minors to the tune of a strikeout an inning and an ERA in the 2's. The amount of success he had was incredible, and at the age of 22 he was able to force his way into the Majors, where he threw the only 65 big league innings of his career. The debut was less than spectacular, and Stephens' story hasn't gone on to have a happier ending, but for as long as he was around, he was an awesome guy to follow. It was impossible not to root for someone who achieved so much statistical success with such an unusual skillset.

So, yeah, my issue with Campillo isn't the stuff. It's that he doesn't post good enough numbers to make up for it. No matter where he went, John Stephens was almost always near the top of the leaderboard in walks, strikeouts, and K/BB. He put up better stats in AA than Felix. Campillo doesn't have that going for him. His strikeout rate is near the bottom among regular PCL starters this year, and his K/BB doesn't crack the upper 20%. He throws a ton of strikes, but also allows a hit an inning, implying that he's more about hitting the zone than hitting a particular spot. The numbers that made me pull hard for John Stephens aren't there for Jorge Campillo.

To me, he has an awful lot of Greg Wooten coursing through his veins. You'll remember Wooten as a guy who had more wins than walks with AA New Haven back in 2000. The next season he went up to Tacoma and put up very similar numbers to Campillo, but nothing better ever materialized, and a year later he was out of baseball (that's where the comparison ends). Like Campillo, Wooten was a strike-throwing righty with a fastball that nicked the upper-80's in a strong wind, and so had to get by with his offspeed stuff. That kind of attack can succeed in the minor leagues, but rarely does it translate well.

Of course, rarely does it even get the chance, and this helps segue into my second point - for as little faith as I have in Campillo turning into any kind of solution as a starter, he deserved to get a look several weeks ago. Horacio Ramirez has been known to be a problem for a long, long time, a problem with but one three-letter solution. He should've been ousted from the rotation, and with Baek hurt, RRS relieving, and Feierabend still sorting things out, Campillo should've had the first shot at taking over. For as little as I think of Campillo's true ability, I do not think of him as a 7-ERA starting pitcher. At the very least he can throw consistent strikes, which gives him a leg up. This is the key point, here: we can compare Campillo to other average or replacement-level arms all we want, but in the end the only comparison that matters is Campillo vs. Ramirez, and whether making a switch would improve the rotation. Do I think Campillo is the better pitcher? How couldn't I?

To suggest otherwise underestimates just how staggeringly bad one has to be to post an ERA over seven. There are very few upper-level pitchers who could be as bad as Ramirez for as long as Ramirez. 7.16. 7.16! With a 7.90 RA! In 20 starts! Even swapping him out with a randomly-generated 6.00 RA would've saved us at least 20 runs by now. And even that level of crappiness is difficult to achieve, especially in a ballpark like ours. If all Campillo ever did was throw strikes and let Safeco help him out, he could manage an ERA around 5.50. An ERA of 5.50 isn't good. An ERA of 5.50 also isn't Horacio Ramirez.

Jorge Campillo is not a good Major League pitcher, but considering the Mariners paid $37m over four years for one rough approximation and $8m for another while giving away Rafael Soriano for a guy who sucks worse, it's remarkable that he hasn't been given a chance. How many times are you going to let Ramirez prove how bad he is before giving someone else the same opportunity? Your scouts may not think that Campillo's stuff will translate very well, and your analysts may agree. But we know beyond a shadow of a doubt what Horacio Ramirez brings to the table, and I damn sure don't think any replacement could possibly be worse. Make the switch. It'd be almost laughable for you to do it now, months too late, but make it anyway, just to prove to us that your minds aren't completely inflexible.

Horacio Ramirez was pulled after four batters today, without retiring a single one. His time has to be up, right?

Right?

Late update: Horacio has indeed been pulled from the rotation. No word on his replacement.

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At this point I say fuck it, let him finish the
season. Might as well. It matters little really. At this point I'm actually interested to see how much harder he can suck.

Today's fun fact, I had to escort a gentlemen out of the casino today for being a pissed off rowdy drunk. He was being a dick for a good 20 minutes before we got tired of his ass and booted him. He started being a dick right after that first inning got over on the big tv above the bar.

So thanks Ho, for giving me a few minutes of excitement in what ended up being a pretty slow day.

These pretzels....are making me thirsty!

by Goose on Sep 16, 2007 4:37 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Why's the 40-man roster have so much deadweight?
Jorge Campillo, Cesar Jimenez, John Parrish, Horacio Ramirez, Jeff Weaver, Sean White, Bryan LaHair, Nick Green, Charlton Jimerson, and Jeremy Reed should all be designated for assignment today!

Furthermore, Chris Reitsma and Arthur Rhodes should be activated from the 60-day disabled list; in turn, they ought to be designated for assingment -- even though Reitsma would be due a $700,000 buyout come 2008 -- since neither of them has any value.

While I might be bearish on the non-prospect position players (i.e., Green, Jimerson, and Reed) -- as they're somewhat useful at this point -- there's no justifiable reason for those second-rate pitchers to take up precious roster space.

Right now, the lineup should be as follows:

VERSUS RIGHT-HANDED PITCHERS
CF: Ichiro Suzuki
LF: Adam Jones
3B: Adrian Beltre
1B: Ben Broussard
C: Kenji Johjima
DH: Raul Ibanez
RF: Wladimir Balentien
2B: Jose Lopez
SS: Yuniesky Betancourt

VERSUS LEFT-HANDED PITCHERS
CF: Ichiro Suzuki
LF: Adam Jones
3B: Adrian Beltre
RF: Jose Guillen
C: Kenji Johjima
DH: Jose Vidro
1B: Mike Morse
2B: Jose Lopez
SS: Yuniesky Betancourt

During the later innings, moreover, Jeff Clement deserves several pinch-hitting opportunities for Jose Lopez; subsequently, Willie Bloomquist can come in for Clement as a defensive replacement. Rob Johnson should receive a few chances behind the plate, too.

Lastly, it sucks that the Detroit Tigers weren't allowed to absorb Richie Sexson's exorbitant contract (2007: $14,000,000 & 2008: $14,000,000), which is 'cause somebody in the Seattle Mariners' front office revoked the waiver claim last month. That, without question, was an asinine decision.

by AK1984 on Sep 16, 2007 4:50 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

why cut them today?
you propose taking 12 players of the 40 man roster. Apart from the fact that this leaves the team with a three man starting rotation (four if count Feierabend), is there anyone who needs to be added to the 40 man roster right now?

by vj on Sep 16, 2007 6:42 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

The Ho is good at sucking
Good enough to crack the top 10 at hacking mass:
http://www.baseballprospectus.com/hm/

by PDXTai on Sep 16, 2007 8:30 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Interesting.
Lopez and Weaver are tied for 16th.

Go figure, out of 30 major league teams, we have 3 of the top 16.

Interesting though, that a so-called "stathead site" like bp uses ERA for determining how much pitchers suck. Not arguing with the results, though.

Interesting, I think is that Sexson at 54th is highly overrating him. I guess him sitting recently is killing his score.

by Faux on Sep 16, 2007 9:13 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Remember the snow game
Ho gave up 4 in 4 innings in that game, too.  I remember thinking at the time that the Mariners would conveniently forget the "unofficial" suck.  So, you can chalk up another crappy start.

by westfried on Sep 16, 2007 9:36 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

General rant
(I typed this up at Sportspot.net, ended up being quite long, and decided to post it here too)

This is just frightening to me.

My first thought the moment I read HoRam quote was not "gee, how can he not realize that he sucks"...it was "what is he being told that causes him to be stunned by these developments?"

It just amazes me how much the regulars are being protected.  The only way Horacio Ramirez responds the way he did at this point in the season is that he's being told the exact opposite of what everyone else sees.  My guess, something along the lines of "Your undefeated home record suggest that you're a very good pitcher at home.  Great job, buddy" and "You do good work on a road except for one or two bad pitches".

Richie Sexson gets booed at home...so they hold him off until the team gets on the road and resume playing him regularly.  The obvious excuse for protecting him and playing him so much is that "we gotta get his bat going for the stretch run".  And now, after all this time, we find out he's been harboring a knee injury since after the All-Star break which is being said is why he hasn't been hitting well.

We had a viable option off the bench in Ben Broussard who could've held the fort while Richie takes care of his knee.  Of course, someone within the organization would've had to call him out on it since he was playing like a li'l trooper that he is...fighting through it.  Our organization spent most of the time waiting for Richie's bat the come through instead of forcing the issue like actual contending clubs do.

But hey, all this camaraderie, team chemistry, and keeping a happy clubhouse by not messing up a good thing?  Yep, it paid off.  Mariners 2007 suffers one of the biggest collapses for a contending team in baseball history.  Even for this year, the 3-18 losing skid rivals only the Orioles and the White Sox in a stretch of such futility.

But hey, here's something I do find interesting.  What about McLaren's reaction to yesterday's loss?

-------------------------------------
SEATTLE (AP) -- Terse and upset, John McLaren smacked the podium leaving his postgame gathering, realizing that another chance to reclaim ground in the playoff chase was wasted.

"We try and give our guys a chance to work their way out of it. We don't have that luxury anymore," McLaren said. "We're fighting an uphill battle here."

Asked what Ramirez's future would be in the rotation, McLaren became agitated.

"I'm not going there tonight. I'm emotionally upset. I'm not talking about anything else," he said, before quickly exiting.
-------------------------------------

Oh?  Now he's feeling the pressure?  Now he's angry that we blew a chance to gain ground?  In an opportunity that means gaining said ground still leaves us with less than 0.5% chance of making the playoffs?

How very peculiar.  McLaren seemed more than okay with losing ground as long as everyone kept battling and "fighting through it".  McLaren himself decides that HoRam deserved another start....and then basically stabs him in the back by yanking him as early as he did.  HoRam sucks, yes, but he was clearly lured into a false sense of security.

John McLaren is way over his head as a Major League manager.  When it came time for him to step up and guide the team he chose to do nothing and let the team fight its way out of it.  He chose to coddle his players and made sure all of them felt good about themselves.  The end result is a happy and kind clubhouse that "fought through" their struggles to produce a 3-18 record.

This team is in serious trouble if it keeps McLaren around as the manager for 2008.  The Mariners were far from perfect this year and likely won't be much better next year.  If that happens, I can almost guarantee we're going to get a crappier version of Hargrove 2006 out of McLaren.  We need a manager, one that knows what they're doing.

The Mariners are a pretty unique team.  Strong bullpen, mediocre rotation, and the streakiest bunch of hitters on the block.  We badly need someone who knows how to make adjustments when necessary.  Someone like Ken Macha, for example, who will probably make necessary adjustments to the lineup but may end up leaving pitchers in too long.  Whatever, they don't have to be perfect, they just need to be more hands on with the team.

by ThundaPC on Sep 16, 2007 9:42 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Fearless Prediction
Your 2008 Seattle Mariners manager: Mike Hargrove.  M's don't want to humiliate MacLoser, Hargrove's vacation gives him a little rejuvenation, the M's try to recapture the "glory weeks" of early 2007.

by westfried on Sep 16, 2007 9:48 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Hmm
Clearly the clubhouse has to feel better with Sexson/Willie/Ibanez/Vidro/Ramirez/Weaver than Wlad/Jones/Lopez in the game, and LOSING a TON(yes, I said it)...over playing the young guys and having ego issues.

by Slica on Sep 16, 2007 12:02 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

quote recollection
The quote by Ramirez reminds me of when John Halama would have trouble in the first inning back in the day and Piniella would warm up Brett Tomko right away.  
Sports and Bremertonians. Because we can.

by wackomann on Sep 16, 2007 1:12 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

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