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Around SBN: Chan Sung Jung Wins Thriller Over Dustin Poirier

21-22

The finale was too typical - an early Sox lead, eroded near the end; a late Sox surge, almost but not quite enough. Ethan cried when it was all over - and this was only his first time. I tried to console him, but ended up joining him. It's a puzzle, isn't it? I don't know why grown men care so deeply about something that neither kills, nor starves, nor maims, nor even scratches in our world of woe. I don't know why we care so much, but I'm mighty glad we do.

-Stephen Jay Gould, The Best Of Times, Almost

Biggest Contribution: Jose Lopez, +15.8%
Biggest Suckfest: Sean White, -51.7%
Most Important At Bat: Johjima single, +10.5%
Most Important Pitch: Wigginton double, -15.7%
Total Contribution by Pitcher(s): -73.3%
Total Contribution by Position Players: +21.3%
Total Contribution by Opposition: +16.0%
Total Contribution by Carlos Garcia: -14.0%

(What is this?)

My Internet's giving me all kinds of trouble this afternoon, so I just want to say one thing before calling it quits for the day:

Too often, we see people attempt to infer qualities of character and attitude from performance on a baseball field. A dominating victory means a team is relentless and determined. A spirited comeback means there's no quit in the group, that no one's willing to give up until the final out's been recorded. A walkover loss means you've got a clubhouse full of spineless pussies who just want to go through the motions and cash in their paychecks. We've all seen it, and we're all probably guilty of doing the same ourselves at least once or twice. It's almost addicting to try and gain that kind of insight from an outside perspective, and since there's no one there to tell us we're wrong, we do it over and over again, asserting truths that we have no actual basis for believing.

Here's the problem with that - team psychology and team performance are so far away from each other that observing one in isolation gives us little or no legitimate knowledge of the other. We try anyway, because nobody's ever satisfied with unanswerable questions, but the conclusions we draw are meaningless and occasionally downright insulting. To the best of my knowledge, no baseball team has ever quit, and I think the players about whom such things have been said might want to have a few words with the accuser. Last year's Mariners lost 11 in a row at one point and were labeled with all kinds of unflattering adjectives, but then they came back to take seven of the next eight from superior opponents. The 2002 Orioles, who finished the year on a 4-32 slide, rallied back in the ninth to tie the Red Sox, and then did it again in the 14th before finally losing an inning later. Even the 2003 Tigers scattered a handful of dramatic wins throughout their hopeless season. Baseball teams don't quit, and it's offensive to think that any of them do.

Nor do I think that there are certain teams who're able to consistently ramp up their play in times of crisis. To do so implies that, at all other times, they're playing somewhere below their maximum ability, which is every bit as insulting as saying someone quit. These are all finely-tuned, highly-motivated professional athletes who stand to lose quite a bit if they're ever caught giving less than 100% effort. As such, on all but the rarest of occasions, players are always giving everything they have and looking out for the best interests of their team as a whole.

With this in mind, you're probably going to hear a lot of jibber-jabber about how "these Mariners never quit," how their alleged comeback ability is indicative of a newfound positive spirit that wasn't in the clubhouse last year, or the year before that, or the year before that. We've already seen it in a number of places, and after today's massive near-rally, there's almost certainly going to be more, as it's something encouraging to talk about on the heels of a loss. Hell, even coaches buy into that kind of stuff; Hargrove has said the same things on several occasions already this season. While it seems like Hagrove would be a good place to go to for this kind of information, though, since he's in the clubhouse every day, I guarantee you that if you ask the players, to a man they'd tell you that they're never giving less than everything they have, even if it may not seem like it to the naked eye.

Here's the thing: every team has games where they dominate, games where they rally, and games where they get their asses kicked. The 116-win Mariners lost that historic heartbreaker to Cleveland, while last year's Indians put a 19-1 hurting on the Yankees. Both of those things happen to everybody every season, and when it comes to identifying the character of the clubhouse, they don't mean a thing. What it comes down to is that good teams have more good games and bad teams have more bad ones. This year's Mariners don't have a "more positive energy" than last year's; they just have a better roster, and the result is that they perform better on the field. It's that simple. Sure, it might be fun to think about, but just like clubhouse chemistry, it's less about how good the members of the team are as people and more about how good they are as players.

Yeah, the Mariners almost mounted a spectacular rally this afternoon. It sucks that they didn't, especially since it seems like they could've won were it not for a few choice miscues, but it was still exciting to watch. It was also encouraging - not because it was indicative of a better team attitude, but because it was indicative of a better team construction. The pitching is horrible, but last year's lineup probably wouldn't have scored 12 runs today. That, more than anything else, is what you should take out of the game. Not that the Mariners feel better, but that the Mariners are better, period. Attempted psychology always takes a back seat to cold hard facts.

Felix and Meche tomorrow at 5:10pm.

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I really hope we win tomorrow.
I'd hate to see Meche beat Felix. Not that I hate Meche, just because it would seem wrong.
"Behold the gaseous stench of Skeletor's breakfast burrito!"

by Thingray on May 24, 2007 4:43 PM PDT reply actions  

frustrating but true
I couldn't agree more with your assessment of this 500 ball club.  Being 500 means good games and bad games.  Being 500 means winning some series and losing some series.  I've just got to get used to riding the wave.

But I do think that we have to remind ourselves that being 500 is better than the last couple of seasons.  This is a better team and they are more fun and more frustrating to watch because of it.

That said, I think that they'd be better served by a manager change.  And a 500 team is not worth the 108 million.

I'd like to see them fire Hargrove and effectively suspend Bavasi (then later fire him) and just admit they're a 500 club.  Because fighting for division contention (and their jobs) clouds their decisions and isn't good for the longterm health of the team.

by eagle on May 24, 2007 5:17 PM PDT reply actions  

Horray for self-awareness
Associated Press

Mariners third base coach Carlos Garcia blamed himself for the loss.

"We got beat by one run," Garcia said. "That was the difference. That's what (made me mad). Those guys battled their hearts out all day long. One decision turned it around."

by ThundaPC on May 24, 2007 5:57 PM PDT reply actions  

More Carlos
Ramirez hurt, plays at plate hurt Mariners

"It really hurts," Garcia said. "What most pisses me off is that they (the Mariners hitters) battled back and we wound up getting beat by one (expletive) run. That one play could have turned all that around."

Lopez, batting with the Mariners down 10-4, hit the wall in left-center on the fly, and he caught an angle of the wall that sent the ball flying past center fielder Carl Crawford as he tried to close on the ball.

"When that ball got past him, all his momentum was going away from the ball," Garcia said. "I thought there was no chance he would get him."

Crawford regrouped, got the ball to shortstop Brendan Harris, who relayed to catcher Dioner Navarro with time to spare.

"When the coach tells you to go, you go, and I never stopped," Lopez said. "When I got to the plate, Navarro was waiting them for me."

-------------------

"That really sucked," said Garcia, who was probably going to have a long talk with Hargrove on Thursday night's flight to Kansas City. "But we never gave up."

On this long afternoon, not giving up wasn't enough.

-------------------

Well, at least Carlos knows what he did wrong.

by ThundaPC on May 24, 2007 7:11 PM PDT up reply actions  

He can tell that story at the unemployment office
I'm sick of hearing about Lincoln, Bavasi, and the coaches saying how sorry they are that things haven't been working out. Try not making stupid decisions.
If you look around the table and you can't tell who the sucker is, and then you see Bill Bavasi, it's him.

by Rollo Tomasi on May 24, 2007 7:17 PM PDT up reply actions  

And here's some more from Garcia
On Delmon Young:

""It was the first time we played them,'' Garcia said. "I didn't know he had such a good arm. But now I know.''"

You didn't know? YOU DIDN'T FUCKING KNOW!? IT'S YOUR FUCKING JOB TO KNOW YOU DUMBFUCK! As a third base coach, it's is your job to tell the baserunners what to do, and your supposed to know this shit, so you can make the right decisions!

He just flat out admitted that he is incompetent. Fire Carlos Garcia.

Protect the enviroment, or I'll FUCKING KILL YOU! CAPTAAAAAIIIINNNN PLANNNNET! ~Ted Turner

by Goose on May 24, 2007 8:42 PM PDT up reply actions  

WORD
YOU FUCKERS HAVE SCOUTS AND HOURS OF VIDEO.  YOU SHOULD KNOW THIS.

by Gomez on May 24, 2007 8:53 PM PDT up reply actions  

EXACTLY!!!
Especially when Garcias says "...I'm really well-prepared when I go out there. I know the situation." and follows that up with "I didn't know he had such a good arm." I mean Jesus H Christ.  As a 3rd base coach, what else are you supposed to be prepared for???  A mild herpes infection?!?!?

For christ's sake, do a little research and figure out if the RF has a canon for an arm or not. These are the things that he should be prepared for an expected to know!!  What other responsibilities does a third base coach have, huh?

by dpdearing on May 25, 2007 12:22 AM PDT up reply actions  

I am still sick to my stomach from this game.
I will be at the sat. game, unfortunately I cannot get off work for Felix day, but with expected rain it is possible I can try for both saturday still. Hate to pray for another ppd but...

I will take every possible chance to heckle Garcia, I am thinkin of a big "stop" sign with some not so nice things about him in smaller print.

I mean come on, a leadoff triple? Even the m's can get that guy in 8 times out of 10 at least. And with the score what it was, a sustained rally was better than a fluke hr. i would've stopped him for that alone regardless of how it looked.

by hcoguy on May 24, 2007 9:59 PM PDT reply actions  

What a Ride
This team is at least exciting.  They have competed with good teams and lost in terrible ways, but can you ask much more from this mediocre team?

Hoping this wild ride continues.

don't be so easy on yourself

by MarinerNation on May 24, 2007 11:02 PM PDT reply actions  

Go Yankees
We need them this weekend.

by phil333 on May 25, 2007 8:43 AM PDT reply actions  

off topic
I've started a petition to tell Major League Baseball that a significant number of fans dislike interleague play and want it abolished.

Please visit Petition to End Interleague Play and read it. If you agree, please sign it and consider posting it on your blog.

http://www.petitiononline.com/mlb2007/petition.html

I'm hoping to spread the word among serious baseball fans. I realize it may do very little, but I thought it was time we stop complaining to each other and tell management how we feel. Thank you!

by Lgirl on May 25, 2007 10:22 AM PDT reply actions  

Spamalicious.
I reject your reality and substitute my own!

by Phil Hatzenbuehler on May 25, 2007 10:26 AM PDT up reply actions  

I like interleague play
We got to see Maddux pitch against us.  That would have never happened without it.

by Edgar for Pres on May 25, 2007 10:26 AM PDT up reply actions  

That's nice, but no thanks for the spam
I love interleague play.  We get to see teams we wouldn't see otherwise, and the Mariners get to beat up on the National League and remind us where we really belong... and where all of our favorite ex-Mariners are!

by Deanna on May 25, 2007 10:29 AM PDT up reply actions  

Not to mention
without it, I'd never get to see the Mariners without having to travel.

by Jeff Sullivan on May 25, 2007 10:31 AM PDT up reply actions  

Online petitions are a joke.
And everybody knows it.
Protect the enviroment, or I'll FUCKING KILL YOU! CAPTAAAAAIIIINNNN PLANNNNET! ~Ted Turner

by Goose on May 25, 2007 1:05 PM PDT up reply actions  

www.fireonlinepetitions.com
I reject your reality and substitute my own!

by Phil Hatzenbuehler on May 25, 2007 1:28 PM PDT up reply actions  

THAT'S IT
I'm starting a petition to stop petitions to stop online petitions!  ENOUGH IS ENOUGH (is enough?)!

by Gomez on May 25, 2007 2:00 PM PDT up reply actions  

Sign the petition?
And miss out on Felix Hernandez vs. Roy Oswalt?  Felix pitches to Ken Griffy Jr.?

Yea, no thanks. :)

by ThundaPC on May 25, 2007 4:28 PM PDT up reply actions  

Is it wrong that I'm starting to think
Vidro may be able to sustain his batting line.
.315/.365/.376   
OPS+ 104

Its not good and not anywhere close to great but I'll take it.  Now if only he could hit a couple HRs or doubles.

by Edgar for Pres on May 25, 2007 10:25 AM PDT reply actions  

Given the wealth of things to complain about
It's hard to pick on Vidro too much.  Seems other players are underperforming with even more gusto.

by johnbai on May 25, 2007 10:34 AM PDT up reply actions  

You have to wonder
How do you explain all the 2 hit games, all the slap singles that hit the grass day after day?  We keep saying it's just luck and variance, but we're near the end of May, two months into the season, and he's still doing it.  Perhaps this is something sabermetrics can't explain?

by Gomez on May 25, 2007 11:07 AM PDT up reply actions  

The infield singles are a fluke.
Without footspeed, it's not a repeatable skill. Knock Vidro's infield hit rate down to his career average and he's batting .287, not .315.

There's also the related fact that he's putting up the second-highest BABIP of his career despite his lowest line drive rate since 2002 (as far back as the numbers go). I don't see any non-anomalous explanation for that.

by Jeff Sullivan on May 25, 2007 11:33 AM PDT up reply actions  

So just hypothetically
how long do we need to wait to say this isn't repeatable.

by Edgar for Pres on May 25, 2007 12:01 PM PDT up reply actions  

I dunno.
People manage to fluke entire seasons sometimes. I think that's kind of what we're all hoping for, here.

I just don't see any reason to believe that Jose Vidro has suddenly developed some special attribute whereby he's able to hit balls so weakly that he gets to first before anyone can field it.

by Jeff Sullivan on May 25, 2007 12:17 PM PDT up reply actions  

If he did
we would have to call it the "Eckstein Chop" or something...

by jtopps on May 25, 2007 12:26 PM PDT up reply actions  

Dear Adrian Beltre,
You're not worth $64 million.

Signed,
2004

by Gomez on May 25, 2007 12:32 PM PDT up reply actions  

I guess I didn't realize he had
so many infield hits.  Thats really the only stat besides his utter absence of power that is really much different than what he's done in the past.

by Edgar for Pres on May 25, 2007 1:23 PM PDT up reply actions  

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