Navigation: Jump to content areas:


Pro Quality. Fan Perspective.
Login-facebook
Around SBN: Win or Lose, Boston Celtics' New Big 3 Era A Success

Ichiro Power Poll

Sometimes we post reader polls and I very quickly come to realize that I don't really care about the results. This one is different. With this one, I am genuinely curious - maybe the most curious I've ever been about any poLL on the site.

Note that the poll is subjective. Choose whichever answer you truly feel is best. Nobody's going to be checking which way you went so don't try to impress anybody with your choice.

Poll
I honestly believe that, if Ichiro decided to change and try to hit for power in 2012, he could cut it as a productive everyday outfielder.
True
912 votes
False
827 votes

1739 votes | Poll has closed

Comment 61 comments  |  0 recs  | 

Do you like this story?

Comments

Display:

I can defend my position:

Would you bet against Ichiro’s ability to do anything Ichiro committed himself to accomplishing?

by cwel87 on Sep 15, 2011 5:11 PM PDT up reply actions  

One would imagine that Ichiro set out this season to get 200 hits and to be a productive baseball player.

I wouldn’t ever bet against Ichiro’s will, but your argument doesn’t really hold water.

by abender20 on Sep 15, 2011 5:15 PM PDT up reply actions  

The poor luck Ichiro has been subject to has been well-documented

And, no. There’s no evidence for me to point to in the past, no precedence of this type of revamp in a player’s skill set being overly successful.

But this is Ichiro. And he’s earned my faith in whatever the hell he tries to do until he proves he cannot do it.

by cwel87 on Sep 15, 2011 5:19 PM PDT up reply actions  

I can't imagine what "Ichiro: successful power hitter" would look like.

That being said, I still voted yes because Ichiro does things everyday that I would have said were impossible beforehand.

by wetzelcoal on Sep 15, 2011 4:51 PM PDT up reply actions  

I think the question I ask myself would be, could he be more productive at this age if he changed his approach?

Considering where his production was at this season, I’d say that it could. Not that it would, but it’s feasible at this juncture.

follow @casetines

by Kenneth Arthur on Sep 15, 2011 5:44 PM PDT up reply actions  

He could

He’s losing speed, he’s not getting his usual infield singles, i think just one year of changing it up may be good for him. The thing is though, I was talking to the “tacoma news tribune” writer, ryan dvish, and he says that ichiro just cares too much about 200 hits a year, and 3000 total. which obviously, would mean he won’t go for power. also, what would make him change????

by ichirofan5197 on Sep 15, 2011 4:50 PM PDT reply actions  

124-124

This is actually quite fascinating

by UW2010 on Sep 15, 2011 5:06 PM PDT reply actions  

My problem is that the premise seems flawed

If a player – any player – could change their hitting approach so drastically just by sheer force of will, would we not have seen many players do this as their career longevities got up into the double digits? I haven’t done any research, but it seems like if it were that easy you’d have a whole slew of guys who started out as singles/doubles hitters who in the last years of their careers suddenly hit 25 HR’s, would you not?

And yes, I know, Ichiro has made mention of this several times. I just don’t really see him being able to re-tool his entire approach to the game at this point. I could be wrong, but I would be very surprised.

by pdb on Sep 15, 2011 5:10 PM PDT reply actions  

While I will vote "no" in the poll when I'm not on mobiLLe

I believe that it’s not a question of “sheer force of will”, but rather “using a tool that exists and is either unused or actively suppressed.” Now there’s doubt that Ichiro actually has power, but it makes sense (and he’s more or less said) that he sacrifices it in the aim of hitting for a higher average.

I’d relate it to a good-hitting pitcher converting to being a position player and working on developing that full-time (Ankiel). Or other players who are drafted as both possibly a pitcher or a hitter. Ultimately, they choose one path to refine it for a shot at the bigs, but if that fails, they still might be able to redevelop the other unused tool.

by Eyebrows on Sep 15, 2011 5:15 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions  

I get that in a player that is young

but a guy who has been doing what he has been doing quite successfully for 10+ years? I’m somewhat skeptical.

by pdb on Sep 15, 2011 5:15 PM PDT up reply actions  

As am I.

I just think it’s an important distinction to make: Those whole believe Ichiro can do this believe that it’s a talent he’s always had, and not one that he is willing into existence.

by Eyebrows on Sep 15, 2011 5:21 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions  

I'd say that's the best possible scenario

He’s not turning into Barry Bonds or something

Determined, Jonesing Commentor

by Corco on Sep 15, 2011 6:56 PM PDT up reply actions  

A guy who collects between 15 and 25 of each XBH

To go with 40 stolen bases… that guy would be reasonably productive. (Yes, I know those’re counting stats.) And Ichiro could do that if he drove the ball with more authority. And that does seem to be the best-case scenario, barring 74 HR.

by fiftyone on Sep 15, 2011 9:51 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions  

I'd love to see what he could do if he tried to hit for more power.

He’s always bailing out of the box trying to get to first quickly – what would happen if he stood in and slugged away? Would the change in approach result in a display of the power it appears that he has in batting practice? I voted ‘yes’ as I believe he’s talented enough of a hitter to change approaches and still be successful. The criteria was a ‘productive everyday outfielder’ – I think he’s got that ability.

by mwalter on Sep 15, 2011 11:08 PM PDT up reply actions  

For the record, I keyed on the word "productive".

I did not see “superstar” or “as good as” in the poll question, so I answered “yes” assuming Ichiro could be average to above-average in 2012.

by NWade on Sep 15, 2011 5:23 PM PDT reply actions  

I voted no, but...

if anyone can do it, Ichiro! can.

That’s just my love for Ichiro talking.

Realistically I think it’s more likely that he will (almost) return to form as the Ichiro we know next year and be a productive everyday outfielder. I think the “Power Hitter Ichiro” myth has always been fun and part of his mystique, but it’s insane. That’s also why it’s plausible because everything about Ichiro is insane.

Damnit! I just talked myself into going home to vote yes.

by pineda on Sep 15, 2011 5:34 PM PDT reply actions  

Absolutely. It would be completely irrational to believe he will suddenly become Jose Bautista, and I think some people took it that way because they have set the standard higher for Ichiro.

So they don’t believe Ichiro could be up to his standards if he tried to hit for power. But when compared to the rest of the league, if Ichiro set his mind to it, I believe he could be an average to good power hitter.

Post tenebras lux

by Archibald Cunningham on Sep 15, 2011 5:37 PM PDT reply actions  

My philosophy on this has always been that, if anyone were capable of doing this, it would be Ichiro.

But I still voted “False” since I think it’s impossible for any player to “forget” the same batting approach they’ve had their entire playing career. I think most of us can agree that Ichiro has many of the tools to succeed as a power hitter. He has a good eye, he generally has a very good idea of the strike zone, and he’s capable of turning on a pitch and hitting for some power to right field.

The issue has always been with the way he hits. He often drags the bat through the zone and it stays in the zone for longer than most other players. Instead of taking a full hack, he’ll “serve” the ball over infielders, almost like a tennis player would. His approach also causes his body and his momentum to travel down the 1st base line, which is specifically designed to get infield hits. When he hits for power, he pivots around a point and uses his lower body to muscle the ball out. That’s why he’s able to jack the ball out in BP or, theoretically, in a HR Derby.

I’m no scout, of course, but this is how I’ve always seen Ichiro. If he wants to hit for power, he has to completely drop his approach of high contact and infield hits. Can Ichiro do that in one offseason? Probably not, but it’s hard to bet against Ichiro. He’s so regimented and has (had?) such good bat control that I feel he might be able to.

by JLC on Sep 15, 2011 5:42 PM PDT reply actions  

This I agree with, but I'm still voting no. I think, of anyone, he might be able to do it, but I dont

think he will choose to even try, and frankly I don’t blame him a bit. He’ll be better in 2012 than he’s been this year, but only because he’s been horribly unlucky this year.

by TrustBaseball on Sep 15, 2011 9:28 PM PDT up reply actions  

I voted yes.

Ichiro projects to be, what, like a 2-2.5 WAR player next season?

If he completely changes his approach, even to a detrimental effect, I have to believe he’d still put up 1 WAR more often than not, and that’s definitely a productive MLB outfielder.

M's fan newly relocated to SF My homepage

by lailaihei on Sep 15, 2011 5:55 PM PDT reply actions  

But not for 18 million.

Well he’s productive still, but much more frustrating…

by WestCoastBias. on Sep 15, 2011 11:16 PM PDT up reply actions  

312-312 after my vote

Supreme court is gonna have to decide this one.

by JeffJ254 on Sep 15, 2011 7:21 PM PDT reply actions  

330-322

True takes the lead!

Post tenebras lux

by Archibald Cunningham on Sep 15, 2011 7:32 PM PDT reply actions  

I said yes

because I believe that Ichiro is a baseball playing robot and not actually human and he spends a lot of his time making outs on purpose as to not be suspected.

by Housedjbo on Sep 15, 2011 8:41 PM PDT reply actions   1 recs

I feel like this question is much like that point in your life when your starting to get to old to believe in Santa Claus.

No matter how hard your rational thoughts tell you he’s not real, part of you doesn’t want to be that asshole kid with no presents. Sanity tells you there’s no way in hell a 38 year old who has never hit more than 15 homers could blossom into a productive power hitter, but after everything Ichiro has accomplished, do you really want to be that asshole doubting him?

by edddgar on Sep 15, 2011 8:58 PM PDT reply actions  

My heart says he can do anything. My mind voted no based mostly on his age.

A complete 180 in your approach to hitting is incredibly hard at the big league level. Doing so in your late 30’s just seems really far-fetched and very likely to end badly.

by Big Jared on Sep 15, 2011 8:59 PM PDT reply actions  

I voted no

but I can’t help but think about the batting practice he took during the USSM event.

by Nate Dogg on Sep 15, 2011 9:08 PM PDT reply actions  

I voted yes.

Mostly because I believe Ichiro is a magic robot. And when i think of him more power, I think 10-15 hr not 30+.

How come you can do all this other great shit, but you can't lie the fuck down and sleep?

by JAH on Sep 15, 2011 9:13 PM PDT reply actions  

I vote yes.

I’m not sure why. It’s unreasonable. But I feel like if Ichiro hit the weights a little, and actually stepped into his swings more he could get 20. I feel like if his bat speed hasn’t slipped much he could do it. So I guess now I explained why. It still feels unreasonable.

by WestCoastBias. on Sep 15, 2011 11:19 PM PDT reply actions  

I voted false.

I think he could have done it earlier in his career, but at this point I just can’t picture it.

Doug Fister. :(

by Mothy on Sep 16, 2011 1:55 AM PDT reply actions  

I might have believed it a few years ago

Definitely don’t believe it now, unfortunately.

by OlSalty on Sep 16, 2011 4:53 AM PDT reply actions  

I voted true.

I don’t think he’d be worth his salary or produce at a superstar level, but that wasn’t what the poll asked. I think he could be a productive 38 year old corner outfielder with the assumptions that his defense doesn’t slip and the transition to hitting for more power would see an uptick in the number of walks.

No matter where you go, there you are.

by KC Mariner on Sep 16, 2011 6:51 AM PDT reply actions  

I voted yes, but with some trepidation

Ichiro! has always been a physical specimen at the service of a wizard’s mind. If he makes up that mind to alter his approach at the plate – and we are talking about a change of emphasis, not a switch to the right side or an adoption of Kevin Youklis’s stance – I would bet on his success. We were asked if he would be “productive”, not necessarily a super star. Chances strike me as good.

The trepidation comes in because even the wisest person is not exempt from the experience of having age pounce like a thief in the night to steal capacities previously taken for granted. It is always a shock. Fellow gray heads give me an “Amen.”

by HeWhoWatches on Sep 16, 2011 8:21 AM PDT reply actions  

BP <> PA

While I agree with “if anyone, Ichiro”, I don’t think it can happen.

I’ve seen Ichiro at BP in Peoria, and it’s amazing. Two balls in the air at the same time headed over the fence at the Padres parking lot. But, every one is identical, within 20’ of the same exit point. Same spot I’m betting the spray chart shows every in-game HR goes. I think it’s very likely a parlor trick by a baseball magician.

I would bet he could win the HR derby hands with someone chucking 50mph down the center. It would be an unbelievable spectacle. And, I’m betting he has never done the derby because he knows the reality is he gets 10 pitches a year in-game he where can get this hit.

by Filson on Sep 16, 2011 9:05 AM PDT reply actions  

I think he could hit 20-25 homers, with a .300-.320ish obp.

With average defense, that’s a fairly productive player. Not a superstar by any means, but good enough for this lineup.

I agree with the sentiment that he’d rather stick with the hit mentality, and go for 3000 hits though. I don’t think we’ll get to see a power oriented Ichiro.

by BigR on Sep 16, 2011 10:18 AM PDT reply actions  

Not so much as a power hitter, but I do think Ichiro could still be productive with a changed approach.

I also think he’d do better if we DH’d him, despite the mountains of evidence that DHing is harder than playing a position.

I like using semi-colons; they make me feel smart.

by Llewdor on Sep 16, 2011 11:15 AM PDT reply actions  

Go for it

I don’t know if he can do it or not, but he ought to try, given his aging age and mortal BA this year. It would give us something to look forward to next year.

by Badbadger on Sep 16, 2011 1:49 PM PDT reply actions  

I'm thinking of the situation from a tools standpoint.

I believe Ichiro has an incredible hit tool. I’m still amazed by his ability to make contact.

I believe Ichiro has a plus power tool. A couple days ago, Justin Smoak (he of the potential 30 homer power) “crushed” a pitch in his wheelhouse that landed about where Ichiro put a pitch he dug out of the dirt. We don’t often see Ichiro take that kind of swing, but he can absolutely murder the ball.

Ichiro has a very good eye. It’s hard to quantify this because of his low walk totals, but

by Jon S. on Sep 17, 2011 1:06 AM PDT via iPhone app reply actions  

Ficking mobiLLe. To continue:

when Ichiro takes issue with a strike call, we all take notice and if we get to see a replay, Ichiro is almost always right.

My only doubts about Ichiro, the patient power hitter, are about his pitch recognition. Sometimes he looks straight up stupid with some of the pitches he swings at. The visual similarities between Ackley when he’s been absolutely fooled and Ichiro all the time are quite striking. Sometimes I feel like Ichiro has no idea what’s coming and drags the bat through the zone like he does so he can make contact with whatever.

I don’t know. I voted true because I would like to trust he has at least average pitch recognition for a major leaguer and that’s my only hangup.

by Jon S. on Sep 17, 2011 1:18 AM PDT via iPhone app up reply actions  

Comments For This Post Are Closed


User Tools

By reading a game thread of your own volition you agree to accept all liability for any and all damage done to your delicate sensibilities.

FanPosts

Community blog posts and discussion.

Recent FanPosts

Small
Starlin Castro's fit with Seattle
Kawasaki80_small
Lists! So many lists!
M_s_hat_copy_small
OT -- May 22nd In Memoriam
Ichiro_small
Why do managers and media members hate walks?
Wbc_029_small
Friday Morning Music Thread
Small
Dustin Ackley BP swing vs game swing
Beastquakerwallpaper_small
More on the Struggles of Smoak
Randy2_for_sbn_small
Albert Pujols 2012: Three Retrospectives
Small
On Batting Orders
Niehaus_small
More on Dustin Ackley and the strikezone

+ New FanPost All FanPosts >

Yahoo_full_count

Sexy People

Wbc_029_small Jeff Sullivan

Small Matthew

Claw_small JY