Grading the Minors: The Unmentioned
In times of great Major League peril, attention turns to the Minor Leagues. Does any help exist there? What people are down there that we can grow attached to and ultimately watch fail to live up to our hopes and dreams? I am not a prospect maven, but I can use a search engine and I can evaluate numbers so here I go, doing both of those things. I went through the various top prospect lists that I could find* and compiled the names involved. My goal was not to assemble a consensus ordinal ranking of our prospects pre-2011 season, but rather to just get the names down that these more clued-in people felt worth following.
*Included are entries by Kevin Goldstein, John Sickels, the ProBallNW duo, Marc Hulet, Baseball America, Jason Churchill and Hardball Times. Could not find any specific top whatever post from either Marc or Jay.
With half(ish) the season past, I will now randomly grade and not randomly analyze the numbers for this blob of prospects. Note please that as stated above, I am not a person in touch with scouts. I cannot tell you how so-and-so's offspeed pitches or power are developing. The goal of a Minor League system is to develop Major League players and Minor League stats are a part of that, but not the whole of that. What follows is not the complete picture, only the part that I feel competent to assess.
First off I will go through some of the guys who went (by my count) unmentioned by the people above and could find themselves mentioned in the 2012 edition. These are not guarantees to make a top 10 or 20 list next Spring. I'm in no position to guarantee anything. Stop assuming that I'm an unreasonable person! It angers me when you do that. Some like Hultzen are near locks to do that while others are more dependent on how their second halves go. Overall, this is simply a list of guys with good seasons to date. You may have already seen my remarks on Forrest Snow and Willy Kesler. Here are some others. You might notice a pattern.
ANDREW CARRAWAY, SP RH 24
A round 12 pick in the 2009 draft, Andrew Carraway pitched really well in his inaugural half season and then showed acceptable numbers last year in High Desert as well. Carraway, another former Virginia Cavalier, sort of maintains a blog as well. He tossed some in the bullpen for Double-A Jackson this year, but the team has primarily used him in the rotation where he has a 56-16 strikeout/walk ratio in just over 70 innings pitched. The strikeouts shouldn't bowl you over, but the control might.
JAMES GILLHEENEY, SP LH 23
Owner of a surname far longer than it should be James Gillheeney is another pitcher from the 2009 draft, this time the team's eighth round selection. Gillheeney spent most of last season in Clinton where he did well enough, and then closed the year out with three starts in High Desert and four in West Tenn. He did well in both of those stops as well, but found himself back in High Desert this season. It can be difficult to impress there with the park factors and 19 home runs allowed already is not pretty, but he has 103 strikeouts in 94.1 innings with just 33 free passes given out.
DANNY HULTZEN, SP LH 21
What's to say? Regardless of whether you think the Mariners should have drafted someone else with the second overall pick this past June, you have to admit that Danny Hultzen is a very talented pitcher and sure to one of the better ranked prospects once he signs.
CESAR JIMENEZ, RP LH 26
I was surprised to find Cesar Jimenez's name on this list, but he is still only 26 and having a successful season in Triple-A. I'm more impressed by results than I am "projectability" (since I have access to numbers and not to scouts) so I am fonder of players who are succeeding at Double or Triple-A than the raw athletes in A-ball. Jimenez has a low ceiling and is only a reliever, but with over a strikeout per inning, Jimenez deserves a look in a big league bullpen. He's just on the wrong team to get it.
BRANDON MAURER, SP RH 21
The big problem with Brandon Maurer seems to be staying healthy and sure enough, he's spent time on the shelf this season. Maurer can actually bring it with the fastball, reaching to the mid-90s, but the health issues seem to hold him back. Despite this being his fourth professional season, he's just now reached High Desert. As with others though, he's done well there when he's been able to hurl that baseball.
JAMES PAXTON, SP LH 22
James Paxton might have made the lists before the season had he been signed. Paxton belongs in the high minors where he is pitching now, but made his pro debut in A-ball Clinton instead. While there, he struck out over one-third of all batters that faced. He also walked over a metric ton of them so it wasn't all peaches and pears. Now in Double-A, Paxton has had very early success. His talent level and newfound signed status means he's likely to be in the top 20 next year. He's done what would have been expected and despite the layoff before entering the pro ranks, is still only 22.
DENNIS RABEN, 1B/DH L/L 23
He lost all of 2009 and half of 2010 with microfracture knee surgery and wasn't all that impressive in his stint with Clinton once he got back on the field. There are legitimate concerns about him ever playing a defensive position. His bat needs to be terrific and there's nothing he can do at 23 in High Desert to show that, but Dennis Raben hasn't fallen on his face. His OPS there is near 1.000. He can draw a walk and hit for some average along with real power. This is what passes for an unexpected outburst from a hitting prospect in Seattle.
ERASMO RAMIREZ, SP RH 21
Made somewhat famous for his insanely low walk totals in Venezuela, which is laughable really. Boy were we desperate for positive news. He came stateside last season and continued to not walk anyone, but did plunk 12 guys. What's up with our pitchers hitting so many people? Erasmo Ramirez skipped over High Desert and began 2011 in Jackson where he continues being himself despite the jump to the Double-A level. He has low strikeout rates (17%) which are fine if he can do that in Seattle, but are worrisome in Jackson. He still has the low walks (just 16 in 92.1 innings) and is still hitting people (seven so far). He gets a good amount of ground balls so maybe he's the next Blake Beavan, who's the next Doug Fister, who's the new Jamie Moyer. Forever, the Mariners seemed to try to replicate Jamie Moyer. The key seems to have been to stop drafting lefties that throw 85 and instead draft righties that throw 89.
MATT TUIASOSOPO, LF R/R 25
Haha, just kidding. Nobody cares.
MIKE WILSON, RF R/R 28
No way, right? Mike Wilson? He's not a prospect, but he is destroying Tacoma and I said I like it when players do well in Triple-A. Consider Mike Wilson my hitting version of Cesar Jimenez. The ceiling is low and he's not going to seismically change the fortunes of the Mariners, but he deserves a Major League shot. I hope two years from now I'm not still saying this about Mike Carp. Has Wilson shown any improvements this season? Not really. The strikeout and walk rates are similar, as is the home run power. He has hit for more doubles and his BABIP is over .400, but I doubt he's found a skill reason for it to be that high.
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Now if you've read through all this and are about to comment, "Hey, what about this guy?" and that guy is someone like Dustin Ackley or even Taijuan Walker than you have not comprehended this sentence:
First off I will go through some of the guys who went (by my count) unmentioned by the people above
I will now virtually slap you. Seriously, there's a couple more of these coming. Just hold off asking about players not yet mentioned here.
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"Still only"?
23 (almost 24) is fairly old for High-A ball. You mean because he seems to have been around forever? It is his 4th year in the minors, which isn’t a terribly long time, but you would usually see a guy like him promoted more quickly. That injury really set his timetable back, as well as the M’s apparent non-confidence in his potential. Not sure why they still have him in High Desert; from the looks of his stats, he’s clearly ready to move up.
by nathaniel dawson on Jul 18, 2011 11:02 AM PDT up reply actions
Yeah it seems as if he was considered a good doubles hitting outfielder like 5 years ago.
Then I knew he broke his leg but wow its been a long time since I heard anything so I assumed he was my age and nearly out of baseball.
Usually when you draft a guy out of college and he basically loses two full seasons to injury, you would assume he'd be 26 or so
it’s not a question of what level he’s playing at, it’s a question of “I’m surprised at this guys’ age, because it seems as if he would be much older”
by seattlebruin on Jul 18, 2011 11:06 AM PDT up reply actions
They're not going to move him up just so he can split time.
I know it sucks for Raben, but they’ve got Poythress at 1B in AA, and they’re getting ABs for Nate Tenbrink, Dunigan, Catricala, Savastano, etc. Adding another 1B/DH/maybe LF to the mix just cuts playing time for everyone.
Right, in that sense, he's not old for the level.
He is old for that level for what you would normally consider a legitimate prospect. Most players that go on to have any kind of decent career in the big leagues will generally pass through High-A at a younger age. Being 23 in High-A doesn’t mean a player won’t go on to have a good big league career, but it isn’t usually a sign of a guy that has a good shot at it.
by nathaniel dawson on Jul 18, 2011 11:43 AM PDT up reply actions
Ehh. I wouldn't think it would be all that unussual to graduate from college at 22, sign at the deadline, have your birthday in the first half of the year and play your first year at age 23 in one of the A balls.
Lots of college guys get drafted at age 21 (junior year)
by seattlebruin on Jul 18, 2011 11:53 AM PDT up reply actions
No, not unusual at all.
Which is why you see an average age of 23 for High-A. Raben actually got a bit of an early start, as he was only 20 when drafted, and started playing that summer before he turned 21. Which is why it may be surprising that he’s been in the minors for four years and is still only 23, as most college draftees are 21 or 22 by the time they start their professional career.
by nathaniel dawson on Jul 18, 2011 12:09 PM PDT up reply actions
Given that he's a college player who a season+ to injury, that's he 23 instead of 21/22 is a pretty worthless quibble
re: his future prospects. He hasn’t stalled developmentally which is what you should care about.
Yes, that injury really set him back.
He’s done everything hitting-wise to this point to suggest that he might become a reliable Major League hitter. Defense and his injury history are a bit of a concern, he’s just got to convince the M’s that he needs to be moved along.
by nathaniel dawson on Jul 18, 2011 12:14 PM PDT up reply actions
I think he should start a blog and petition GMZ
by seattlebruin on Jul 18, 2011 12:15 PM PDT up reply actions
Hey, he could call it "Raben for Left", or something.
Kind of has a nice ring to it.
by nathaniel dawson on Jul 18, 2011 12:28 PM PDT up reply actions
Laughing at your computer screen at work makes you look strange.
That Matt Tuiasosopo comment made me laugh very loudly at my computer screen at work. Totally don’t care how dumb I look though.
Brett Gleason | Twitter | WSU Baseball Blog | Daily Evergreen
by Brett the 49er on Jul 18, 2011 10:23 AM PDT reply actions
Jimenez
One of the big criticisms has been that, as a left handed changeup artist with a BP fastball, he does not get enough of an advantage over lefties. I’ve heard rumblings (don’t ask me where) that he has picked up a few ticks on the fastball and now hangs out in the low to mid nineties. Anyone else hear something similar?
by Bearskin Rugburn on Jul 18, 2011 10:25 AM PDT reply actions
I think there are two main criticisms:
1: His ceiling is as a middle reliever. He’s in the low 90s now, but he was in the low 90s when he pitched for Seattle in 2008 too. Whatever his FB velocity is now (and I’ve certainly not seen mid-90s), it’s not a great pitch.
2: Injury history. Jimenez missed almost all of 2009, 2010 and a large fraction of 2007 with various injuries.
Huh
I thought he was 86-89. Nevermind.
by Bearskin Rugburn on Jul 18, 2011 11:11 AM PDT up reply actions
Well, he was as a starter, but he's been 89-92 or something as a reliever.
If he was suddenly 92-93, that’d be nice, but I haven’t seen it, and I’m not sure it would lead to significantly better results.
To most likely have 3 top 100 starting pitchers is pretty cool, but sadly the Rangers have had an incredible year with starting pitching prospects.
It will be interesting to see how many of them make the majority of top 100 lists and the ones that don’t will probably be just outside the top 100.
follow @casetines
by Kenneth Arthur on Jul 18, 2011 10:38 AM PDT reply actions
Yeah, but we have three top 100 starting prospects...
to go with the best young starter in baseball and the best rookie starter in baseball, plus two more effective, cost-controlled starters. What more do you want?
by seattlebruin on Jul 18, 2011 10:46 AM PDT up reply actions
Like our rotation is so good that I'm actually concerned about Hultzen - a big selling point was that he's near ML ready
but it’s not like we’re desperate for starting pitching. We could conceivably field a 2013 rotation consisting of James Paxton, Felix Hernandez, Michael Pineda, Danny Hultzen and Doug Fister at a total cost of under $21M
by seattlebruin on Jul 18, 2011 10:48 AM PDT up reply actions
Close
Fister, if still around, would probably be making a few million under his first year of arbitration. Felix will be owed $20 MM, about $1.5 for the three cost-controlled pitchers, and, say, $3.5 for Fister makes it something like $25 MM minimum. Plus any incentives that are built into their contracts.
by nathaniel dawson on Jul 18, 2011 11:10 AM PDT up reply actions
Do you actually agree with people?
by seattlebruin on Jul 18, 2011 11:21 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
Huh?
Sometimes I do, sometimes I don’t.
by nathaniel dawson on Jul 18, 2011 12:24 PM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
I'm very happy with how we've added depth and gotten a real boost in our starting pitching prospects this season. This isn't so much about us as, we couldn't catch up with the Rangers in that department either.
As we went up, so did they. But we don’t have Hamilton/Cruz/Kinsler/Andrus. I always hoped if we had an edge over the Rangers it would be run prevention, and just when that looks likely, they just happen to have 5 or 6 really good starting pitching prospects. That’s all. Also funny that while we had Nick Franklin, they potentially topped that with Jurickson Profar. Of course, we have the edge in terms of a 1/2 in the majors already and both being under 25, that’s really great for us.
follow @casetines
by Kenneth Arthur on Jul 18, 2011 11:59 AM PDT up reply actions
Yeah, and how many Cy Youngs have John Danks, Edinson Volquez, and Thomas Diamond won for the Rangers again?
DVD!
"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett Mariners Minors
And that seemed frightening at the time.
"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett Mariners Minors
Well, far be it from me to compare cross-generational prospects, but I'd say Martin Perez is a far better one than any of those 3.
Then: Barret Lous, Neil Ramirez, Robbie Erlin, Robbie Ross, Cody Buckel. Highly doubtful that all of these guys stick in the majors, but they’ve increased their margin for error.
Its just upsetting that the Rangers had to join the short list of teams with “Best crop of minor league arms”
follow @casetines
by Kenneth Arthur on Jul 18, 2011 12:41 PM PDT up reply actions
Our understanding of pitching is probably improving, but pitching is still extremely volatile.
"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett Mariners Minors
I just mean that by having 5 or 6 really good pitching prospects, as compared to 1 or 2, they've increased their margin for error.
With their pretty good rotation that’s already in the majors, it just makes it a little more likely that the Rangers could put together a solid rotation.
follow @casetines
by Kenneth Arthur on Jul 18, 2011 12:51 PM PDT up reply actions
Sorry, that sentence sucked.
follow @casetines
by Kenneth Arthur on Jul 18, 2011 12:51 PM PDT up reply actions
I understood it
And it would be really nice if they didn’t look they are matching up with (or exceeding) us in pitching prospects.
With the offense they field right now, it doesn’t help one’s optimistic outlook.
by nathaniel dawson on Jul 18, 2011 1:55 PM PDT up reply actions
Crossing my fingers for an entire post dedicated to Jabari Blash.
...and now I'm here
by CapSea on Jul 18, 2011 10:41 AM PDT reply actions 1 recs
This will be his only mention
What a weird split season he’s had. He starts in A-ball and can’t hit but draws an interesting 38 walks to go with his 43 strikeouts. Then he goes down to Everett and starts hitting, but has a 6:24 walk to K ratio
Who are you, Jabari?
by Matthew on Jul 18, 2011 11:28 AM PDT up reply actions 4 recs
What about Carlos Triunfel?
Kidding, kidding. Glad to see some more minor coverage here. I love minors.
That didn’t come out right.
by ManifestDestiny on Jul 18, 2011 10:42 AM PDT reply actions 7 recs
Prospect gurus - how concerned should we be about Paxton's walk rate?
it looks like he’s trending positively (5.8 BB/9 first seven starts, 3.0 BB/9 since), likely a case of not having pitched in a while?
Yeah...
First start, 6.0 IP, four walks.
May: 27.1 IP, seventeen walks
June: 22.2 IP, nine walks.
If you haven’t been facing real hitters in a while, your command probably won’t be that good.
"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett Mariners Minors
Isn't "likely to be in the top 20" selling Paxton really short?
I got the impression he’s a top 5 guy right now.
Currently seeking employment. My homepage
I didn't post a prospect list yet because fuck that noise.
I actually had Paxton for the top 10 pitchers thing I wrote for Grand Salami, because hey, it was written in mid-April. Couldn’t really justify putting Maurer or Erasmo in there, but I’m a fan of both for different reasons. I also spent the early part of the season bitching about how Carraway wasn’t in the rotation.
"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett Mariners Minors
Lists are dumb.
Blobs are the wave of the future
by Matthew on Jul 18, 2011 12:34 PM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
They behave both like waves and like blobs.
by Matthew on Jul 18, 2011 12:44 PM PDT up reply actions 4 recs
The more you know about his ranking vis a vis other prospects, the less you know about his ceiling.
Weirdest thing.
by marc w on Jul 18, 2011 2:00 PM PDT up reply actions 4 recs
Physics segueway!
Even though Marc w joking, here’s a chance to remedy a common public misuse.
Heisenberg’s uncertainty principle is often treated as ΔxΔp = a constant. In fact it’s >= a constant. That may seem like a quibble but it makes for a vast difference in meaning. The former states (as Marc somewhat alludes to) that if you increase your knowledge of one of the terms, your knowledge of the other must decrease to compensate. While what actually occurs is that if you increase your knowledge of one of the terms, your knowledge of the other must decrease if and only if you are near the threshold that is the constant.
And that constant is incredibly small. So no, you can’t use Heisenberg to argue your way out of a speeding ticket.

by Matthew on Jul 18, 2011 7:20 PM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
With blobs, you don't invite so much of the "WHY IS THIS GUY RANKED TWO SPOTS ABOVE THAT GUY" kind of discussion.
"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett Mariners Minors
Future Matthew!
"Satisfaction is the enemy of success." SanFranPreps Twitter: @d_quazzo
by perfectstrat on Jul 18, 2011 1:12 PM PDT up reply actions

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