The Top of the Ninth
Ignore the results and lets talk process. Taking it batter by batter with the WE at 8.2% to start the inning.
Casey Kotchman sees three straight fastballs and rolls the last one up the middle for a single. (WE = 16%)
Rob Johnson is allowed to bat and coaxes a seven pitch walk. Was letting Johnson bat the right idea? Given that your best LH hitter on the bench is Griffey (projected wOBA: ~.310) is he that much of an improvement over Rob Johnson (projected wOBA: ~.290) ? The pinch-hitting penalty alone makes them, at best for Griffey, equal and then you have to consider leaving yourself down to just one catcher and using Griffey early in the inning. It's probably a close call, but I'm fine with not pinch hitting here. (WE = 28.2%)
Meanwhile, Griffey was in the on deck circle for Jack Wilson, which is still questionable. Jack Wilson is a poor hitter, but he's not demonstrably worse than Rob Johnson and our depth in the infield is worse than it is at catcher, plus Wilson is an important defensive cog and short stop is the hardest position to replace. We did not get the chance to evaluate the potential move however as Wilson batted once Johnson reached and sacrificed Kotchman and Johnson over.
Right call? Debatable. Ichiro (and Figgins we presumed) were due up next and you've put the tying runners into scoring position. It was a negative WPA move without context but with Ichiro up next it becomes possibly even money and given the chance that letting WIlson (or Griffey) bat turns into a double play given who they are, I'm willing to give a pass to Wak here. (WE = 24.3%)
Ichiro takes a first pitch fastball into right-center for a clear single. I have no idea what was going through Rob Johnson's head as he hovered near second base. There was no chance that was getting caught and at the time he cost the Mariners a run. (WE = 37.9%)
Now here is where we can all take Wak to task. First and third, one out, down by a run. You need to get that runner in from third and so avoiding a strikeout and a double play are tantamount. Figgins has a good eye, good bat control and is speedy as all get out. He also can bat left-handed. What was Wak thinking pinch hitting for him with Griffey? This is like a 25 point drop in wOBA even before the pinch hitting penalty and when you factor in the circumstances, this was an inexcusable move unless Figgins was physically unable to perform.
Lucky for us and Wak, it worked nonetheless and Griffey drove another first pitch fastball into center field to plate Johnson and move Ichiro around to third. (WE = 67.9%)
It's going to get lost with what he did in the bottom half of the frame, but what a big hit here from Franklin Gutierrez. The Mariners went with the squeeze and Guti unfortunately (at the time) stabbed at it and fouled it back. With Ichiro on third, Guti probably just needed to get it on the ground and fair to put the Mariners ahead. He missed, but took the next pitch into left field for a single that got us ahead 4-3. (WE = 85.1%)
Lopez got ragged on for the ensuing double play but he was in a tough spot. Darren O'Day is a side thrower and he had Lopez on a legitimate 1-2 count. Lopez took a down and in pitch and pulled it down the third base line, but that's where Michael Young happened to be playing and so it resulted in a 5-3 GIDP. (WE = 78.1%)
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Matthew 1, Dave 0
Dave probably had to re-type his summary after that epic 9th inning.
I don't think Wak has this team totally figured out yet, which is annoying
I like him, but he obviously has a somewhat skewed view of the abilities of Griffey and Figgins respectively to even think about doing that in such a crucial moment (or ever). Then there’s the Sweeney thing….and Sean White…. He’s great at a lot of things but he has to get over these irrational love affairs of his and soon.
Besides the drop in wOBA, the pinch hitting for Figgins meant that we needed to replace him in the field
which could have been a factor in the bottom of the 9th. Luckily, it didn’t matter, but it seems strange to PH for any of our middle infielders.
by seattle_since_81 on Apr 10, 2010 4:06 PM PDT reply actions
Gutz has been huge for the team this first week.
.389/.450/.500
I know it’s SSS, but I sure hope this is Frabklin taking another step in the right direction offensively.
Because we’re rebels. Accurate, intelligent, introspective rebels. And damn proud of it my friend. - CapSea
Preserved In All His Greatness - R.I.P. The Reignman 1989 to 1997
His BABIP
is over 100 points above what we’d expect, and it’s not like he’s been hitting a bunch of ropes (25% LDs). His groundballs have been finding holes; that’s all. A step forward for him is showing more power, not all these singles.
And SSS. But there’s SSS on his defense too, and yet… I still feel like this first week has shown how good he is defensively.
Well I think (as another member of the community I can not remember already pointed out) there can be something said about his approach at the plate.
Slightly inflated BABIP sure, but pretty much everything I’ve seen him hit this year has been right on the screws, and really really hard hit ground balls tend to raise your BABIP a little bit. If he stays right where he was last year, or a little bit behind, he is still an all-star.
So the question is...
Does batting Griffey for Figgins but still resulting in a run count as an annoying run?
"Why did he run when I was going to throw him out?"
- Ichiro Suzuki
Griffey for Chone is an odd move.
Offense-wise, it’s a downgrade. Speed-wise it’s a downgrade. Our backup infield replacement is a downgrade. It also flies in the face of Wak’s “belief system” about giving players a chance to hit in that situation, at least early in the season. Still no word if there were any physical issues with Chone.
I had no problem with Johnson and Wilson staying in though.
I agree with keeping Wilson in
especially because Wilson was already 2 for 3 in the game.
I’m glad though that Lopez ended the inning, not Milton right after him. Not sure if Milton would have gotten out of a batters funk if he would have gotten the at bat. But I think he will soon, because hopefully it appears that some of the offense did after that 9th inning.
Someone enlighten on why Wak is considered a "good" manager.
I keep hearing about his constant misuse of the bullpen, the keeping Sweeney decision, and of course, Rob Johnson. And now today’s Griffey for Chone decision.
So what makes him a good manager? His ability to communicate with the players? His calm demeanor? I don’t get it.
The latter two don't threaten to make him a bad manager (keeping Sweeney is an org decision).
For the most part, he does a good job balancing statistical information with what he sees on the field. I really haven’t seen a ‘dumb’ explanation out of Wak for questionable moves.
And I honestly haven't seen much bullpen misuse.
Can’t really judge after the first game since ever since then it’s been a game of whomever has gas left in their tank.
I was hoping for some creativity with the bullpen
When they started a 6 man bullpen I didn’t expect him to adhere to the traditional one inning per reliever, a pitch count would have been nice. I know without Lee it was difficult, but he had the guys to make a go of it. Capable of more than one inning, and I believe I read most of them lacked a bad split. I tried looking up their splits but I’m not sure how to find that on B-Ref, Fangraphs, or Statcorner.
I wouldn't say that
critical armchair analysis prevents him from being a good manager. Regardless of who manages the club each move will be up for debate. I think it is difficult to pinpoint a list of characteristics that make a good manager. However, it is usually pretty easy to spot a really bad one.
by Ballard Erik on Apr 10, 2010 7:07 PM PDT up reply actions
His bullpen management last season was fine.
I’d say better than the average manager’s, actually. I really like how Wak doesn’t insist on having a LOOGY in the pen for the sole purpose of getting one guy out.
Sweeny decision was not entirely in his hands.
The fact that we have to harp on him for the little things is kind of a good thing. If all we have to bitch about is using Kelly for only 1 inning than 2 then he’s doing pretty well. He makes dumb decisions sometimes sure, but my thought is that no manager ever has THAT much of an effect on the outcome on games in Baseball. Even though clubhouse chemistry is something we don’t like to talk about a lot because it’s hard to quantify, it really does seem that Wak has all of the players on the same page and moving in the same direction. Compared to 2008 it’s a complete 180 and managing a bunch of different personalities and the ability to make all of the players “move to the same beat” is all we can ask from a manager.
Yahoo sports summaries
Oh man those are so bad after a game is over. They are always completely out of order. Plus no mention of the Griffey for Chone event, and nothing about Franklin’s ‘game saving’ catch…
I’ll take this win, hopefully the offense got enough of a spark that will carry over…
Recorded off my TV using my phone.
by seattle_since_81 on Apr 10, 2010 4:35 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Weird, it works when I click on it.
by seattle_since_81 on Apr 10, 2010 4:36 PM PDT up reply actions
Holy fuck
Whats a good program to make a GIF of this easily?
I turned the television off after the top of the eighth and went for a run/walk.
Just got back. What the hell. I’m so sorry Mariners for not believing in you.
Same here.
It felt extra good to be able to say to my brother (who says Mariners will suck due to lack of homerun hitters) “IN YOUR FACE!”
You should only do that when we're ahead.
Anything dramatic that’s going to happen then is probably something you don’t want to see.
I like using semi-colons; they make me feel smart.
Avoiding the Double play
Griffey is less likely to put the ball on the ground than Figgins (37% to 42% since Fangraphs Era.) Of course, once taking into account Figgins is less likely to make an out or more likely to beat out a double play it seems pretty obvious to stick with him, but maybe that is what Wak was thinking that Griffey had a better chance of hitting a sacrifice fly then Figgins
Stats are not a euphemism for tits
This is the only thing with potential to make sense
Someone in another thread said that maybe Griffey has a better shot of getting the ball in the air for a sac fly. I’m not convinced. But barring injury it’s the only that makes sense to me. The thing with this theory is that looking at usual splits might not match what you’d actually expect. The GB% might be 37 to 42, but maybe Griffey is better at hitting it in the air when he’s trying? I have no idea….
Basically I’m just trying to avoid the thought that we’re going to find out Figgins has some nagging injury.
by Snuffleupagus on Apr 10, 2010 4:59 PM PDT up reply actions
Rational and, perhaps, long range?
I wonder how much tension Wak is feeling from competing “baseball” and “organization” goals. It’s foolhardy to assume Wak really doesn’t know (hasn’t been told) the difference in the numbers between batting Griff and Figgins in that situation. His decision was deliberate, and only perhaps, also dynamically inconsistent.
Given that it was Game 6 of the season, we’re we watching a larger organizational goal being employed at the potential expense of a good result on the field? I don’t know, but I can’t help but feel that Wak is forced to weigh these things and make, from time to time, small, odd interventions at key stages with an eye on producing a far more significant variation in the outcome…down the road.
Translation:
By giving Griff some early season, relatively meaningless ABs, Wak, with GMZ’s help, is preparing us for a tearful, heartfelt, mid-season “it’s been a good ride, but…” press conference (as a prelude to announcing the AGon trade.)
By giving Griff some ABs, he keeps Griff happy. Tickling and hoopla-making notwithstanding, Junior is still a big ego in the clubhouse.
Griff getting a fat pitch to loft an AB against the Generalissimo – who wasn’t fooling anybody in this game, nor had he been to this point in 2010 – isn’t such an extreme bet, from where I’m watching.
In the game, Griff was up and down a few times before his actual AB. What started out intuitively ended up fairly rational: Wak chose to bat him for Chone rather than both Johnson and Wilson. Whatever wOBA indicates, batting Jr with Ichiro on 3rd and one out makes a hell of a lot more sense than batting him following Kotch or Johnson. (Though arguably a hell of a lot less sense that batting him in place of Figgins in the first place.)
Wak’s got himself some fish to fry in managing this club.
láska v srdciach nájde dom, človek človeku domovom - komajota
If the Mariners wanted Griffey to go away they shouldn't have offered him a contract
I have no idea how setting him, and the team, up to fail benefits anyone in the short or long term.
Good thing Chone doesn't have an ego
He’s a real team player, so I don’t think he’s gonna go “why you take me out? WTF”, especially after Griffey comes through.
Still a questionable decision by Wak, but I don’t think this one in particular will hurt anyone.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but...
After Chone went down on three strikes in the previous (?) inning, he went down the dugout steps and directly into the clubhouse. If you watch it back you can see him making a beeline down the stairs and out of view, not even talking to anyone.
Perhaps he WAS hurt, and being pulled for Griff has more to do with that than it does WPA?
But he was playing 2b in the bottom of the inning correct?
I don’t remember seeing any defensive changes mentioned.
by seattle_since_81 on Apr 10, 2010 7:08 PM PDT up reply actions
Totally, I'm just throwing it out there as a possibility that I hadn't seen mentioned.
It does happen pretty regularly where players decide to pull themselves after trying to “give it a go”.
Who knows though really… Doubt we’ll ever get an explanation.
Not sure if anyone's mentioned it
But I’m a little surprised Ron Washington didn’t IBB Ichiro. Granted, Francisco was struggling to throw strikes and Chone Figgins would’ve been batting with the bases loaded, but I feel a lot of managers would consider putting Ichiro on.
They said on Fox
Ichiro was 1 for 11 lifetime against Francisco with a bunch of strikeouts.
by Rollo Tomasi on Apr 10, 2010 9:03 PM PDT up reply actions
Ah, SSS theater!
I love that managerial logic because it means Ichiro will also get to bat against Francisco the next time a similar situation arises. The broadcasters will tell us that he’s only 2 for 12 lifetime, with a bunch of strikeouts.
Wak decision
Gee, I can’t believe that Wak didn’t go with the percentages that you described. Hmmm, maybe he’s been around this game awhile and has a little more experience than you do. However, from your armchair quarterback position, I’m sure you will win more games this year than Wak. Give me a break and don’t give me your sabercrap after the fact if your going to second guess professionals with experience. How many pro games have you played??
I can't tell if this is sarcasm or not.
Also a die-hard Hawks fan.
by Hopefulmsfan on Apr 11, 2010 1:29 AM PDT up reply actions
If you're serious go get fucked by a rabid and horny Sasquatch.
If you’re being sarcastic be better at it.
by Aaron Campeau on Apr 11, 2010 1:39 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
You're fucking kidding right?
What superior knowledge surpasses the basic rationale that pinch hitting a terrible hitter for a good hitter of the same handedness is a terrible idea?
How many pro games have YOU played?
If you don’t like “sabercrap”, what the fuck are you doing reading this entry, much less this entire blog?
I don’t like severe head trauma, and one of the ways I avoid severe head trauma is that I don’t sit around and hit myself over the head with a sheet of plywood for an hour every day. Same thing applies here – if you don’t like the content, don’t fucking read it.
Go away.
by pdb on Apr 11, 2010 10:18 AM PDT up reply actions 5 recs
Must be a troll.
Only 1 comment and LL is the only blog he’s joined.
"Mayhap a hidden door lurks nigh. Let us search the environs."
by Fearless Frog on Apr 11, 2010 10:48 AM PDT up reply actions
Have you actually read anything on this blog before?
I mean, there’s “sabercrap” on just about every front page post. I don’t know, maybe that should have been the clue that this just might not be the blog for you.
So I notice there's six replies, all expressing indignation
and yet nobody bothered to flag the comment as a possible troll. Would have been the perfect time, folks.
by Matthew on Apr 11, 2010 11:35 AM PDT up reply actions 2 recs

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