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Around SBN: Raiders' GM Begins The Purge

51-44, Chart

Wbc_029_tiny by Jeff Sullivan on in Seattle Mariners Game Recaps

7_23_09_medium

Biggest Contribution: Jarrod Washburn, +46.2%
Biggest Suckfest: Russell Branyan, -11.8%
Most Important AB: Sweeney double, +10.0%
Most Important Pitch: Granderson triple, -16.2%
Total Contribution by Pitcher(s): +66.0%
Total Contribution by Lineup: -19.8%
Total Contribution by Opposition: +3.8%
(What is this chart?)

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Read More: Seattle Mariners, Seattle Mariners at Detroit Tigers, Jul 23, 2009 10:05 AM PDT

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Also, 21 outs, only 3 Ks for Washburn.

So he had 18 outs in the field against only 2 hits? Is that correct?

Sounds sustainable to me.

by CMC_Stags on Jul 23, 2009 1:20 PM PDT reply actions  

Sell now!

2009 Safeco Field Record: 5-0 ; Overall Safeco Field Record: 9-4

by Fin on Jul 23, 2009 1:22 PM PDT up reply actions  

This is not the first time.

Washburn doesn’t get run support, doesn’t strike out any batters, and still shows all the shiny stats that get him noticed.
What is the statistical probability that somebody with a 4.5ish tRA who gets one of the lowest run support figures in the league not only finishes with a winning record, but does so with a top-15 ERA?

Strange things can happen over just 30 starts.

by AnotherAaron on Jul 23, 2009 6:20 PM PDT up reply actions  

I couldn't believe it when it flashed up that the DA has only conceded one HR all year.

It seems that every ball in play is a fly ball or pop out. Long may this continue, and then come the off-season, get him traded to a dumb organisation for some prospects.

I was at Shea for the Felix-Slam!
Personal M's record: 5-4.

by EnglishMariner on Jul 23, 2009 1:22 PM PDT reply actions  

Nope

Let’s not let him go like Putz.

"Good evening Blazer fans, wherever you may be!"-Bill Schonely

by skywaker9 on Jul 23, 2009 1:34 PM PDT up reply actions  

Yes I know that he sucks now

But the talent is still there.

"Good evening Blazer fans, wherever you may be!"-Bill Schonely

by skywaker9 on Jul 23, 2009 1:38 PM PDT up reply actions  

Have you noticed that we actually traded him for other players?

Lots of them? Several of them very useful? One of them is the second most valuable CF in the AL?

by abender20 on Jul 23, 2009 1:40 PM PDT up reply actions  

Yes

It was a good deal, I’m just saying I don’t want to let DA go.

"Good evening Blazer fans, wherever you may be!"-Bill Schonely

by skywaker9 on Jul 23, 2009 1:40 PM PDT up reply actions  

This is a joke right?

Thank God for that.

Fuck Anaheim.

by Eyeball Kid on Jul 23, 2009 1:38 PM PDT up reply actions  

Right...

Although Putz sucking might have more to do with every single Met under-performing this year basically.

"Good evening Blazer fans, wherever you may be!"-Bill Schonely

by skywaker9 on Jul 23, 2009 1:40 PM PDT up reply actions  

I was about to say this

2007 tRA – 2.91 SwS% – 12.6
2008 tRA – 4.61 SwS% – 11.0
2009 tRA – 5.11 SwS% – 8.2

I’m still new to this but those numbers don’t look good to me.

Fuck Anaheim.

by Eyeball Kid on Jul 23, 2009 1:54 PM PDT up reply actions  

Can you guys imagine how amazing Wash would be pitching in the NL?

If he can do this in the AL, he has to be up there with Dan Haren for best pitcher in the league.

by abender20 on Jul 23, 2009 1:25 PM PDT reply actions  

I think he would need a good outfield behind him, regardless of what league he is in.

For example, Raul might screw him over in Philly.

2009 Safeco Field Record: 5-0 ; Overall Safeco Field Record: 9-4

by Fin on Jul 23, 2009 1:46 PM PDT up reply actions  

But, he's the third best in fielding!

For Left Fielders…

…

In the national league.

by Robert Lintott on Jul 23, 2009 5:24 PM PDT up reply actions  

He's actually still got a positive UZR this season somehow

he’s going earn all $33M of that contract in one fell swoop

by seattlebruin on Jul 23, 2009 5:28 PM PDT up reply actions  

His UZR/150 though is -0.4 though according to Fangraphs

But yeah, you’re definitely right.

Though he is 37th in MLB in UZR/150, 31 in UZR, and 39 in RngR. So by a very basic, non-position adjusted measure, he should not be a starting OF in the majors (assuming 30 teams and 3 starting OF/team).

by Robert Lintott on Jul 23, 2009 5:44 PM PDT up reply actions  

Even with Ibañez?

2009 Safeco Field Record: 5-0 ; Overall Safeco Field Record: 9-4

by Fin on Jul 23, 2009 1:47 PM PDT up reply actions  

So, how much of this improvement is defense

and how much of this is Washburn pitching better?

by craig3410 on Jul 23, 2009 1:26 PM PDT reply actions  

Crap

Can’t wait until the Cardinals sell the farm for him.

by craig3410 on Jul 23, 2009 1:29 PM PDT up reply actions  

Hey, I'm a cards fan too

Oh well, better than the rumored Wallace-for-Holliday deal; at least I’ll still get to root for them

by craig3410 on Jul 23, 2009 1:31 PM PDT up reply actions  

Wash's OBA is down .70

To .275 from .345, that’s your difference right there.

"Good evening Blazer fans, wherever you may be!"-Bill Schonely

by skywaker9 on Jul 23, 2009 1:37 PM PDT reply actions  

A lot of luck

The knack our pitchers have for getting out of jams this season is amazing.

"Good evening Blazer fans, wherever you may be!"-Bill Schonely

by skywaker9 on Jul 23, 2009 1:38 PM PDT up reply actions  

Serious question

How do you think the media would react if Washburn were traded for something that helps us right now, and would that reaction change Zdurencik’s standing with the FO? I’m thinking that trading Washburn wouldn’t be worth it if it creates a shitstorm that could get Z fired if the team stumbles on field in the next year and a half.

by Poochie on Jul 23, 2009 1:43 PM PDT reply actions  

I don't think there would be a problem apart from dumb fans.

The media are bitches and Z has tremendous good will right now.

I was at Shea for the Felix-Slam!
Personal M's record: 5-4.

by EnglishMariner on Jul 23, 2009 1:47 PM PDT up reply actions  

I have no idea his standing because I don't work the FO

I’m legitimately curious, and it should be considered

by Poochie on Jul 23, 2009 1:48 PM PDT up reply actions  

Did you see what they did to DePodesta in LA?

I think it’s definitely a concern. If the right deal comes up, you take it of course, but this has to be in Z’s mind.

I just wish we knew how much rope Armstrong/Lincoln are willing to give him. Probably plenty, but the trade-Washburn-then-suck scenario would use up quite a bit.

by marc w on Jul 23, 2009 1:49 PM PDT up reply actions  

Yes, I read your comment up there!

It is thought provoking.

I think it depends on what you get. At this point, trading him to cut salary and/or get a B- prospect may not be worth it. More than that and I think he’d have enough cover even if everything blew up.

by marc w on Jul 23, 2009 1:53 PM PDT up reply actions  

I don't disagree, but Baker and Stone are probably the most visible M's writers

and both of them seem to acknowledge that he knows what he is doing and have said that they are okay with moving Washburn/Bedard even if they aren’t exactly in favor of it.

by Aaron Campeau on Jul 23, 2009 1:56 PM PDT up reply actions  

To expand on that

Yes, it would take a confluence of several bad things for the media to just jump on GMZ – the move would have to backfire and the M’s would have to fall out of the race quickly, and probably some players would have to grumble about what the move did to morale. But all of that is possible…

by marc w on Jul 23, 2009 1:57 PM PDT up reply actions  

This is what it would take to trade Washburn

there is no reason to unless we’re getting an awesome return.

by Fuckmikereilly on Jul 23, 2009 2:05 PM PDT up reply actions  

I don't blame them

he’s very candid and honest with them and seems to make their jobs a lot easier. It helps that he’s gotten good results all season, too

by seattlebruin on Jul 23, 2009 1:57 PM PDT up reply actions  

Exactly. I actually love his interviews these days.

He’s refreshingly candid and aware of his own shortcomings (more so than many sportswriters/fans).

by marc w on Jul 23, 2009 1:58 PM PDT up reply actions  

All depends on the return

I think even the FO was planning a rebuilding year under Z. And I think they’re still committed to letting him see how he could rebuild the team given free reign. If he nets something of value going forward, I don’t think they’ll be upset, especially after things like the Putz deal.

by Fuckmikereilly on Jul 23, 2009 1:51 PM PDT up reply actions  

JJ was pretty popular right?

The Rise of a Superstar:Justin Upton-.398wOBA, 21 years old.

by Goose on Jul 23, 2009 2:13 PM PDT up reply actions  

I think the (major) media would handle it fine

However, it is very obviously not a move that Z could afford to make if he weren’t getting much in return. Unless the M’s drop out of this, selling Washburn would almost certainly have to be accompanied by another move that adds to the roster.

by Jeff Sullivan on Jul 23, 2009 3:04 PM PDT up reply actions  

I can't believe they'd fire him after one 'mistake' (their invevitable words, not mine)

While letting Bavasi go on and on like he did.

Besides, if the return for Wash works out well then they’ll forget about him soon enough and maybe realise that RRS is doing pretty the same thing.

Fuck Anaheim.

by Eyeball Kid on Jul 23, 2009 1:47 PM PDT reply actions  

The problem may be that Armstrong/Lincoln

took no end of shit for giving Bavasi as long as they gave him. They may not be willing to do that again.

by marc w on Jul 23, 2009 1:51 PM PDT up reply actions  

But Z has already made many more good moves

and has turned the team around in less than a year. They’re not going to ignore that because of Bavasi’s failures.

by Fuckmikereilly on Jul 23, 2009 1:52 PM PDT up reply actions  

They ignored it in LA

But DePo was hated to begin with

by Poochie on Jul 23, 2009 1:53 PM PDT up reply actions  

Have you ever heard sports talk radio?

He got the team into contention and then he pulled the plug because he doesn’t care about winning. He thinks this is all about looking smart and not about winning championships! He just wants HIS guys out there, and doesn’t care about chemistry or what’s good for the organization!

by marc w on Jul 23, 2009 1:55 PM PDT up reply actions  

Some people are going to think that, sure.

The only sports talk radio I listen to is Brock and Salk, but I’d say an equal number of their callers on the issue have said they would be okay with moving Washburn or Bedard because they feel like Zduriencik knows what he is doing.

by Aaron Campeau on Jul 23, 2009 1:57 PM PDT up reply actions  

People are fickle!

I think the odds of a trade like this really hurting his standing are like 1/10 or 1/20, but, y’know, they’re not 1/1000000.

by marc w on Jul 23, 2009 1:59 PM PDT up reply actions  

If you can make the team better you have to take those odds.

And I should point out that I am not in favor of moving Washburn because you can.

by Aaron Campeau on Jul 23, 2009 2:01 PM PDT up reply actions  

And to bring up another point

let’s say Zduriencik decides not to move Wasburn, he regresses and the M’s fall out of it. The biggest gripe you hear from casual fans is that the Mariners have a history of being indecisive at the trade deadline. If they are close to where they are in the race a week from now and the above scenario occurs, those same revisionist morons are likely to pile on him for continuing what they see as a trend of fence-sitting.

When things don’t work out as well as they think they should, uninformed fans bitch and they usually blame the people at the top. I’d say the odds are just as good that keeping Washburn backfires as trading him, so the best thing to do is weigh the risks and proceed as though what the fan base thinks is irrelevant in this particular situation.

by Aaron Campeau on Jul 23, 2009 2:14 PM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

A great point, ac

I just think casual fans believe in Washburn and would deflect blame for the collapse away from him. Whereas if they collapsed just after a trade, people would point to the trade as the causal factor. That’s crap, of course, but I think we underestimate how popular Washburn’s become.

by marc w on Jul 23, 2009 2:17 PM PDT up reply actions  

Sports talk radio is the lowest form of fandom

Regardless of how little the FO knows, I think they’ll take their cue from the media and the fans. And most of them have faith in Z at the point. It could evaporate a bit if Wash is traded and we tank, but it’s not going to be the tipping point or anything. And I have faith that if he’s trading Wash, he’s at least trying to make us better in the future.

by Fuckmikereilly on Jul 23, 2009 2:03 PM PDT up reply actions  

Oh, a caller already proposed that.

it was later referenced by a caller who thought while it would be good to have three Cy Young candidates in the rotation ….

by msb on Jul 23, 2009 2:18 PM PDT up reply actions  

The Mariners don't have the players necessary to get Roy Halladay.

And even if he is the best pitcher on the planet, I’m grateful for it. We can’t mortgage the farm on another “ace” for a year and a half before he signs a $150 million dollar contract with the Red Sox.

by Kenny Knows Sports on Jul 23, 2009 2:36 PM PDT up reply actions  

From Rany on the Royals
The highlight of my weekend – hell, it might be the highlight of my career – came on Friday night, when unbeknownst to the Royals (or me), the participant in the between-innings "Match Game" promotion was a devoted reader of this blog. After winning the promotion, our good reader was given the microphone and asked to say a few words. He said only two: "Rany Rules!" The microphone was snatched away by the announcer at that point, but judging from the audience’s reaction, the damage was already done.

by seattlebruin on Jul 23, 2009 1:55 PM PDT reply actions  

Jesus, I feel so sorry for Royals fans.

I was at Shea for the Felix-Slam!
Personal M's record: 5-4.

by EnglishMariner on Jul 23, 2009 2:50 PM PDT up reply actions  

Goddammit

keep front page posts on topic or you will be castrated

De Gutibus non disputandum est

by Bearskin Rugburn on Jul 23, 2009 3:08 PM PDT up reply actions  

Trade trade trade.

You got slurved!

Hehehe Mark Reynolds is so awesome.

by Slurvey on Jul 23, 2009 3:15 PM PDT reply actions  

Neither

I understand why I got the response, but was it that ridiculous to think that there would be other people listening to 710 at the time I posted it? I didn’t know any better ways to describe the guy, so I was just make an observation.

My Mariners blog - SodoMojo Twitter Feed

by gregrabble on Jul 23, 2009 3:44 PM PDT up reply actions  

A heart of gold, while valuable to others,

would seem to not be a very good quality to strive for personally. I mean, I know gold is one of the more pliable elements, but I do not think it would make a good compression simply from electrical shocks.

by Matthew on Jul 23, 2009 3:42 PM PDT up reply actions  

Washburn on the trade rumors
“If I’m traded, it means something bad happened in the next 10 days. That’s the last thing I want to happen. I love winning, and we’re winning here. We have maybe the best group of guys I’ve ever been a part of, and that’s saying a lot. That ‘02 team in Anaheim (that won the World Series), we were a great team. Everybody loved each other. We had fun. We did whatever it took to win. That’s the exact same feel I have with this ballclub. I’m very happy to be a part of it, and yeah, I want to continue to be a part of it.”

Larry Stone

The Rise of a Superstar:Justin Upton-.398wOBA, 21 years old.

by Goose on Jul 23, 2009 3:19 PM PDT reply actions  

The Wash interviews, I half expected him to say something like:

“I’ve been overachieving and the team has good pitching depth. If they can trade me for a useful replacement, that would be lovely.”

by abender20 on Jul 23, 2009 3:22 PM PDT up reply actions  

Shutup Jarrod. Just shutup. I'm starting to actually respect and like you.

I hope something happens the next 10 days or whatever. Either gettting us within 2-3 games of first or dropping us 7-8 back. This 4-5 game stuff is making it difficult to decide what to do with guys like Washburn.

I still say deal him if the prospect or prospects are right, but I like this group of guys we got in the clubhouse right now, and I have to admit, I’d feel bad if this group starts getting broken up, although it’s probably best in the long term

by Rudy4three on Jul 23, 2009 3:28 PM PDT up reply actions  

His interviews have been quite honest recently

I enjoyed the part where he calls bullshit on players who say they don’t pay attention to trade rumors.

by Fuckmikereilly on Jul 23, 2009 3:30 PM PDT up reply actions  

Has he said

“I’m much happier now throwing to Rob Johnson with an incredible outfield defense to bail me out instead of throwing to Kenji and having Raul watch fly balls drop for doubles?”

by CMC_Stags on Jul 23, 2009 3:44 PM PDT up reply actions  

So if Washburn keeps up his current pace for 75 or so more innings this year

He will have accumulated enough WAR during the past 4 years to actually earn his contract. Who would have thought.

by Manzanillos Cup on Jul 23, 2009 3:50 PM PDT reply actions  

Actually, I don't know if this is true or not.

Looks like Fangraphs uses an RA version of FIP. Also, I don’t know which metric makes him look better over the years, but this year his FIP is well above average and he’s just below average in tRA.

by Manzanillos Cup on Jul 23, 2009 10:36 PM PDT up reply actions  

Why would the Phillies want Washburn?

Come on, have some common sense. Why would the Phillies want an extreme flyball pitcher like Washburn pitching in their little bandbox? 9 flyouts to start the game? His ERA would double to Jamie Moyer level if he pitches in Phillies.

by brian_sun on Jul 23, 2009 4:26 PM PDT reply actions  

Happ is pitching great, we know about Cole Hamels, and he's awesome,

They just signed Pedro, and Moyer is going to stay in the rotation because of his contract and local ties. I am sorry, but Washburn isn’t a upgrade to the Phillies.

by brian_sun on Jul 23, 2009 4:35 PM PDT up reply actions  

I don't think anyone here is saying Washburn is going to Philadelphia.

Nobody cares where Washburn goes, as long as he returns something of interest. Philly just so happens to be doing their homework on Washburn, hence the talk around here.

by Wilder. on Jul 23, 2009 4:44 PM PDT up reply actions  

Phillies might not be the smartest organization in baseball,

but the are the defending WS champ and have one of the best farm systems in baseball. I would love the Mariners to be in their shoes.

by brian_sun on Jul 23, 2009 4:44 PM PDT up reply actions  

Is Jarrod Washburn's 1.06 WHIP sustainable?

He’s leading the whole AL in WHIP now. How the heck is that possible? He’s only given up 31 extra base hits in 126 IP. That’s pretty awesome for a flyball pitcher.

by brian_sun on Jul 23, 2009 4:42 PM PDT reply actions  

This is how.

WHIP is a stat the relies on defense. It’s not a very good way to analyze a pitcher. Plus a flyball pitcher will have a lower WHIP in general.

angels fan in seattle

by Eyebrows on Jul 23, 2009 4:46 PM PDT up reply actions   4 recs

Oh shit guys image size sorry.

Rookie mistake, I’ll go get my coffee now.

angels fan in seattle

by Eyebrows on Jul 23, 2009 4:46 PM PDT up reply actions  

I like this picture though.

2009 Safeco Field Record: 5-0 ; Overall Safeco Field Record: 9-4

by Fin on Jul 23, 2009 5:57 PM PDT up reply actions  

I have not read a single commment.

Nor have I watched the game. I am probably LLLJing a bit, but I just got drunk with my dad and hoped to see 51-44 upon my refresh of LL. I am happy and satisfied. Go M’s! :)

We won and I had a great day. Hooray for the M’s! :D

Yesterday's Pants
A blog-thingy about the Mariners and stuff.

by BrettJMiller on Jul 23, 2009 4:58 PM PDT reply actions  

We should send Washburn some Captain Morgan

He’s our captain and we’re all on his ship. Sorry Felix, you’re too young to be a Captain!

by OceanBird on Jul 23, 2009 7:21 PM PDT reply actions  

I am pleased by the fact that we are 7 games over .500!

"Part, fools!
Put up your swords. You know not what you do."

by Fearless Frog on Jul 23, 2009 8:05 PM PDT reply actions  

I know you're upset, and I'm not trying to start anything, but I'm curious.

I’ve always kind of wondered how is the result of an Angels game, and hence our standing in the division, not “on-topic” when discussing our game result of the day? Is it just discussing specific plays that irks you? Because if, say, Nathan had gotten the final out and I’d simply posted “Sweet Angels lose. Only 4.5 back!” that would’ve surely been on-topic.

by SethGrandpa on Jul 23, 2009 10:44 PM PDT up reply actions  

Posting about a result is fine

Posting about something happening during the game is not because it encourages further game thread-style conversation.

Also I’M FUCKING MAD

by Jeff Sullivan on Jul 23, 2009 10:49 PM PDT up reply actions  

I understand not wanting constant updates, after yesterday

I think simply stating the outcome and maybe a brief summary of frustrations about how the Angels never lose would be more appropriate? Or maybe it should just all go in the game threads. Up to Jeff.

by Fuckmikereilly on Jul 23, 2009 10:49 PM PDT up reply actions  

Boston got swept by the Texas Rangers.

You got slurved!

Hehehe Mark Reynolds is so awesome.

by Slurvey on Jul 23, 2009 10:56 PM PDT up reply actions  

I know the Angels are flawed and getting incredibly lucky...

But I’m really starting to think we have a better shot at the wild card. I mean Boston is clearly not great (unless they swing something for Halladay) and the Rangers are due to fade. The Rays scare me, but I think we might just have a shot.

by SethGrandpa on Jul 23, 2009 11:01 PM PDT up reply actions  

The Red Sox are bound to make moves

and they’re fucking good as is. Our top of the rotation and our defense is the only thing that comes close to them.

by Fuckmikereilly on Jul 23, 2009 11:05 PM PDT up reply actions  

I know I'm contradicting almost all evidence I always use to seperate smart fans from dumb fans, but...

I dunno. I just don’t get a feeling with Boston that they’re as good as all indicators say they should be. I thought the entire year (ok…excluding games 3-5 of the series with the Yanks) that Boston would win it the last two times they did, but I don’t get the same vibe.

by SethGrandpa on Jul 23, 2009 11:12 PM PDT up reply actions  

In my gut I feel better about beating Boston than the Angels

but that’s just because recently Boston has been sliding and the Angels have been…whatever.

by Fuckmikereilly on Jul 23, 2009 11:14 PM PDT up reply actions  

Their offense is only above-average and their defense is bad

but the pitching staff is phenomenal from top to bottom. Our only WC hope is that the AL East beats up on itself.

by Jeff Sullivan on Jul 23, 2009 11:37 PM PDT up reply actions  

You hear that, Rays?

Go make a trade. Just keep Scott Kazmir away from the Angels.

angels fan in seattle

by Eyebrows on Jul 23, 2009 11:44 PM PDT up reply actions  

Also simple math

We are chasing two teams in the division. We are chasing three teams in the WC. There are no teams realistically chasing us in the division. There are a couple Central teams in the WC.

by calim on Jul 24, 2009 12:08 AM PDT up reply actions  

Pro-Angels.

Who clearly are a team that has made a pact with Satan. When I said mainstream was meaning that it was maliciously marketed as a family movie, when it was really more “Triumph of the Will” than “Lion King.”

by SethGrandpa on Jul 23, 2009 11:24 PM PDT up reply actions  

I liked this movie as a kid.

FUCK THE ANGELS! FUCK THE ANGELS! FUCK THE ANGELS!

by Goose on Jul 24, 2009 12:13 AM PDT up reply actions  

Angels=performance enhancers.

Yesterday's Pants
A blog-thingy about the Mariners and stuff.

by BrettJMiller on Jul 24, 2009 12:47 AM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

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