Today's Fun Fact
A table:
| Player | 1st Half wOBA | 2nd Half wOBA* |
| ICHIRO | 0.377 | 0.350 |
| BRANYAN | 0.403 | 0.375 |
| LOPEZ | 0.301 | 0.314 |
| GRIFFEY | 0.333 | 0.337 |
| GUTIERREZ | 0.346 | 0.327 |
| LANGERHANS | 0.316 | 0.326 |
| JOHJIMA/JOHNSON | 0.274 | 0.286 |
| HANNAHAN | 0.260 | 0.307 |
| :(EDENO | 0.230 | 0.284 |
| BENCH | ~.275 | ~.300 |
| * ZiPS Rest-of-Season projection | ||
Sourced using Fangraphs wOBA, not StatCorner wOBA, For the sake of staying consistent with the ZiPS numbers.
Applying some approximate playing time weights and mathing everything out, the Mariner offense as currently built projects for a team .321 wOBA in the second half of the season, against a .328 league average and a .313 team mark for the first three months. What's more is that that number isn't park-adjusted. Taking Safeco into account, ZiPS thinks this offense will only be a handful of runs below average over the rest of the year. And that's without adding a shortstop or even including a few potential weeks of Adrian Beltre.
Tired of seeing this lineup struggle to score runs? Me too. But there's good news. While this team will never be accused of lighting up the scoreboard, there's reason to believe that things are going to get a great deal better going forward.
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48 comments
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Comments
So does this mean...
PLAYOFFS!!?!??!?!!
by I Lick Squirrels on Jul 13, 2009 11:47 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Hannahan's first half is so incredibly insanely bad.
But if he hits like he’s projected to, he could be very, very, very big for this team over the next two months.
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by Jack Moore on Jul 13, 2009 11:50 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
The way I think about it
even if Hannahan and Cedeno fall short of those projections, they’re unlikely to get all the playing time. Hannahan because Beltre should come back, and Cedeno because, if he doesn’t hit, they’ll find someone else.
by Jeff on Jul 13, 2009 11:53 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm really excited
My Mariners blog - SodoMojo Twitter Feed
by gregrabble on Jul 13, 2009 11:52 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Tell me about it.
The Yankees suck-a-doodle-doo!
by JamMasterJesus on Jul 14, 2009 12:00 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
So basically our few good players are gonna get worse & our bad players are gonna get better?
Hmmm….
by SethGrandpa on Jul 13, 2009 11:53 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I feel like there's a word for that
A statistical word.
by Jeff on Jul 13, 2009 11:54 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah but if you say it 800 people will use it incorrectly tomorrow
by acblue on Jul 13, 2009 11:55 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Repeating buzzwords without understanding them is so addicting
by Jeff on Jul 13, 2009 11:57 PM PDT up reply actions 3 recs
Buzzwords.
I actually bought a Betancourt t-shirt.
by Hopefulmsfan on Jul 14, 2009 12:12 AM PDT up reply actions 4 recs
Buzzwords!
The Yankees suck-a-doodle-doo!
by JamMasterJesus on Jul 14, 2009 12:24 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
BEES!
I fucking hate you Mariners
by kentroyals5 on Jul 14, 2009 9:59 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Like a boss.
I will smash your face into a jelly.
by Phildopip on Jul 14, 2009 8:29 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I like that Cedeno's projected wOBA is 54 points higher in the second half
And he’ll still kinda suck.
by Gihyou on Jul 13, 2009 11:59 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Dave's Hardy trade intrigues me.
1) Dave is forgetting that Dave Bush will be back on July 20th and is projected to be much better than Mike Burns. The impact of adding Washburn on top of Bedard is probably minimal. Also, unfortunately, I have a feeling that if anyone were to be ejected from the Brewers rotation, it would be Manny Parra, and not Jeff Suppan or Braden Looper, who are both much more deserving of the boot.
2) The Brewers probably can’t afford to add the 6M difference in the salaries of Washburn/Bedard and Hardy. They’re pretty much at their limit.
Other than that, I’m torn. I love Hardy but the addition of Bedard would be huge for a struggling staff, and our infield defense would remain excellent even losing Hardy, since Escobar is so great on defense. Washburn could probably continue pitching well with Cameron in center, although MIL’s corner outfield of Braun and Hart is nowhere near as rangy as Langerhans/Ichiro, not by a long shot. I don’t know. I have a feeling if the Brewers did this trade, they’d go about it in the worst possible way.
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by Jack Moore on Jul 14, 2009 12:03 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I'll take this opportunity to mention that using this comment as a jumping-off point to bitch about Dave's idea will not be tolerated
Behave, people.
by Jeff on Jul 14, 2009 12:06 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Sorry if you didn't want to get into that tonight.
Just thought it might be interesting to get some perspective from the other side.
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by Jack Moore on Jul 14, 2009 12:09 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's fine to talk about
I just don’t ever want to see a comment thread as bad as that one.
by Jeff on Jul 14, 2009 9:51 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
That motherfucking Dave Cameron
How dare he convince me of the merits of a trade that wil never happen
by lemonverbena on Jul 14, 2009 6:36 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Brewers self-admittedly want starting pitching
Melvin falls on middle of results versus projection so he could be intrigued by both Washburn and Bedard. Hardy has been on the trade block since mid-last season so I believe Dave is right that a Hardy trade is inevitable*. JJ has had a bad year at the plate so far the trade value is there and when he was coming up he was a glove first player so the analysis seems correct. I hope it is a match but if not the M’s have other options
- Jeff, I read your comment and I hope this counts as behaving because it was intended to be.If not I apologize
Don't believe the lies Bill!!!! look at the sparkly ERA!!! Sparkly, Sparkly!!! - McCovey Chronicles
by Trenchtown on Jul 14, 2009 1:55 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Is the deal Hardy for Washburn straight up?
Derosa.
by vivaelpujols on Jul 14, 2009 2:48 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
You could go over to USSM and see for yourself.
...and now I'm here
by Librocrat on Jul 14, 2009 2:48 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Dave is quite good at what he does
Derosa.
by vivaelpujols on Jul 14, 2009 3:02 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The thing about the hypothetical Hardy/pitching trade
is that ZiPS is putting a premium on Gutierrez’ ML performance in years past and seems to be ignoring the fact that his minor league numbers as well as his last tow months of last season support that this is exactly the kind of player he is. I doubt he will maintain the power production he had in June-early July, but I will be disappointed if he does not finish the season with twenty homers or so. I don’t see why he should be anything less than a league average hitter.
I am also hopeful that Kenji has a little pop left in his bat, though if he does, he’s hiding it very well. As for the rest of the projections, they all seem very reasonable. Branyan seems to be settling back into his career norms, even developing a fairly normal platoon split over the last month after spending the first two having none.
Overall, I am very interested to see how the actual run scoring compares to predicted run scoring from here. The offense so far has been below average, but not so far below as the RS column might indicate, suggesting that there is some bad luck involved – maybe wOBA with RISP, I don’t know. But when something like this goes on for a long time and does not normalize you have to wonder if there is some way of constructing a roster that is bound to score less than wOBA would suggest. In our case, we have a black hole bottom of the order and a clean up hitter whose IsoD is approaching his BA.
by Bearskin Rugburn on Jul 14, 2009 7:49 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wish we could dip into the Texas farm system.
by Kenny Knows Sports on Jul 14, 2009 9:46 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
We can have a farm system just as good as theirs. They traded their best playe in Teixeira for prospects.
We could do the same in trading Felix, but thats out of the question since we don’t we don’t have anyone nearly as good so it would be stupid do so.
by russak on Jul 14, 2009 11:13 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I read it as "The reason our farm system is barren is that most of our young talent is already in the majors"
Determined, Jonesing Commentor | Proud proprietor of Wyomingroutes.org & Washingtonhighways.org
by I'm NOT Corco on Jul 14, 2009 1:31 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
You mean Prison?
Chicks dig the long ball.
by LauraBu on Jul 14, 2009 12:45 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Manager for a Day: Optimal Batting Order?
OK, here’s a question for y’all. If you were manager for the day, given the above stats, what would be your optimal batting order?
Extra credit for LHP vs RHP.
Chicks dig the long ball.
by LauraBu on Jul 14, 2009 1:34 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Wak's standard lineup is almost perfectly optimized (probably because Tom Tango, the guy who pioneered lineup optimization, is working for the M's).
by Decatur on Jul 14, 2009 1:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Lopez at 3rd? Branyan at 2nd?
77 different lineups in 88 games according to one stat. Is there a standard lineup? ;-)
Chicks dig the long ball.
by LauraBu on Jul 14, 2009 1:41 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
To clarify, I meant
I second what acblue said, and all that applies. but here’s what I meant. The key is to optimize the lineup as closely along the lines ac described while also keeping the handedness of the hitters alternated enough to guard against the opposition exploiting platoon splits by keeping a LOOGY (lefty one out guy) or ROOGY in to face same-handed 3 batters in a row. “Best” is pretty much determined by wOBA. Wak does this really, really well.
Vs. RHP
L 1. Ichiro (best/2nd best hitter)
L 2. Branyan (2nd best/best hitter)
R 3. Lopez (fifth best)
L 4. Griffey (probably fourth best) -
R. 5. Gutz (3rd best)
L. 6. Langerhans (6th best)
R. 7. Johjima/Johnson (whatever)
L. 8. 3B Hannahan (whatever)
R. 9 :(edeno (erm)
Vs. Lefty: just subbing Shelton for Griffey is fine, but best would probably be:
L 1. Ichiro (best/2nd best hitter)
R 2. Gutz (3rd best) Branyan (2nd best/best hitter)
R 3. Lopez (fifth best)
L 4. Branyan (2nd best/best hitter)
R. 5. Shelton (fourth best?)
L/R 6. Langerhans/Wlad (6th best)
R. 7. Johjima/Johnson (whatever)
L. 8. 3B Hannahan (whatever)
R. 9 :(edeno (erm)
by Decatur on Jul 14, 2009 2:26 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Since you're new here I should probably point out that we've had this discussion several thousand times over the past few years.
Basically, lineups don’t matter very much at all. A perfectly constructed lineup is probably going to equal one extra win (at best) over the worst possible lineup construction.
In general, you want your five best hitters 1-5 based on OBP or wOBA. Your 1 and 2 hitters should be your best OBP guys and your 4 and 5 should be the third and fourth best of those five with power. 3 is the least important position in your top 5. 6-9 should be in descending order of OBP or wOBA, unless you’re in the NL in which case it makes sense to bat your worst hitting position player 9 and the pitcher 8 because it will give your leadoff hitter more PAs with runners on base.
by acblue on Jul 14, 2009 1:56 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

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