I'll take "suspicious" for 2,000, Alex.

by TheTank123 on May 24, 2009 5:50 PM PDT

Dave Cameron posted an article over at Fangraphs about Carl Pavano's resurgence. One day later, the "Weekly Rundown" by Brad Evans at Yahoo Sports is, you guessed it, about Carl Pavano's resurgence. It looks like the guy literally took Dave's article and puffed it up with a bunch of terrible jokes. Sequencing, stats, everything is nearly identical.

I don't want to get all accusatory, but it seems a tad suspicious, no?

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Sometimes, I really hate what the internet has done to solid reporting.

Ok…most of the time. … All the time.

by SethGrandpa on May 24, 2009 6:00 PM PDT reply actions

Neither of these writers are reporters

They’re both analysts, and one is specifically a fantasy baseball analyst while the other has never been concerned with fantasy baseball as far as I can tell.

holy shit its christmas.

by yteimlad on May 25, 2009 1:35 AM PDT up reply actions

It's the stats

plus the other glaring hints…like both articles starting out the EXACT same way.

by TheTank123 on May 24, 2009 6:30 PM PDT up reply actions

Brad Evans frequently uses advanced metrics... this is not new for him.

But he always sounds more like he’s “poaching” someone else’s ideas more than speaking from knowledge. It could definitely be true that he scours SABR-savvy blogs looking for material.

by johnbai on May 24, 2009 6:32 PM PDT up reply actions

Sounds like?

He didn’t just “poach” stats. He “poached” the entire structure of the article Take the intro:

Dave: “Over the past four years, few pitchers have been the punchline to more jokes than Carl Pavano,”

Evans: “Carl Pavano(notes) no longer deserves to be a punchline. (Yes, seriously. We’ve only consumed one watered-down domestic adult beverage. No, honestly.) Just five short seasons ago, Pavano was one of fantasy’s brightest producers”

by TheTank123 on May 24, 2009 6:36 PM PDT up reply actions

Someone needs to call him on that.

by .Taylor on May 24, 2009 6:46 PM PDT up reply actions

Stealing a cliche isn't really stealing

I have no idea how much of the rest might have been stolen… But recycling the bit about “no longer being a punchline” isn’t much to complain about.

by johnbai on May 24, 2009 7:43 PM PDT up reply actions

Did you read the two articles?

There are 10 trillion different ways to say Carl Pavano sucked. He just “happened” to go with that one? My ass.

by TheTank123 on May 24, 2009 7:49 PM PDT up reply actions

Induction is generally the wrong way to go

In these situations. You could have contacted either author before making baseless and biased claims in public. But way to be responsible in your crusade against the irresponsible use of the internet.

holy shit its christmas.

by yteimlad on May 25, 2009 1:45 AM PDT up reply actions 2 recs

I would also add

That I don’t think there is anything wrong with him bringing publicly available information to his audience- the two writers have completely different audiences. Go read the comments on a Yahoo fantasy article and compare them to the comments here or at Fangraphs. So if he read Dave’s article and decided to re-frame the context for fantasy purposes, I think that is completely viable. Should he link to Dave’s article? Sure. However, he frequently links to other websites, and he even linked to another fantasy baseball website in the article in question. So I think that its not unfathomable that this is a coincidence. He has way more to lose by appearing to be a plagiarist than he does to gain by appearing to be the first to realize that Carl Pavano is under performing relative to his peripherals.

holy shit its christmas.

by yteimlad on May 25, 2009 2:12 AM PDT up reply actions

Also, again

Its not just one thing. It’s the whole article.

by TheTank123 on May 24, 2009 7:54 PM PDT reply actions

Brad Evans plays for the Sounders

by Kirsten Schlewitz on May 24, 2009 8:52 PM PDT reply actions 2 recs

"Real" journalists have

been stealing material from blogs since, well, there have been blogs; it’d be fine if they actually referenced their sources, ideal if they’d actually admit that independent blogs can be a legitimate source of analysis and dissemination.

by Liebkartoffel on May 24, 2009 8:52 PM PDT reply actions

I think we should hold off on the conspiracy theorying

Until Dave says something about it. If he thinks it’s the same article, open fire.

Fans are typically idiots.

by The Typical Idiot Fan on May 24, 2009 9:07 PM PDT reply actions

Why would Dave's opinion matter more than anyone else's in this subject?

I don’t think I’m better off judging whether somebody rips off something I write than any other random reader. Possibly even less so given that I, as the author, would likely be biased.

Anyways, I don’t think this is worth much attention.

by Matthew on May 24, 2009 9:16 PM PDT up reply actions

True

But I think he at least deserves to know what might be happening. I know that if I put forth as much effort as he does (especially when he does it for free), I would be upset if an author at a major website ripped my stuff off.

by TheTank123 on May 24, 2009 10:03 PM PDT up reply actions

We get paid to write for FanGraphs.

by Matthew on May 25, 2009 1:03 AM PDT up reply actions

Touche

by TheTank123 on May 25, 2009 6:25 AM PDT up reply actions

There's also something to be said about

fighting someone else’s fight… if there IS a fight to be had, that is.

Fans are typically idiots.

by The Typical Idiot Fan on May 25, 2009 6:41 AM PDT up reply actions

Please don't confuse Brad Evans with journalism.

by Teej on May 24, 2009 9:14 PM PDT reply actions

or comedy

by Teej on May 24, 2009 9:28 PM PDT up reply actions

or anything else worth paying attention to

by Teej on May 24, 2009 9:29 PM PDT up reply actions

I confuse him with a soccer player

by Kirsten Schlewitz on May 24, 2009 10:16 PM PDT up reply actions

How is Brad Evans the soccer player at puns?

Because fuck, Evans is awesome. And by awesome I mean please murder me.

by Teej on May 24, 2009 10:51 PM PDT up reply actions

You could Evans say he's the king of puns.

by Mariner John on May 25, 2009 12:01 AM PDT up reply actions

That was Brad.

by TheTank123 on May 25, 2009 12:20 AM PDT reply actions

good god

i take that back.

by TheTank123 on May 25, 2009 12:21 AM PDT up reply actions

Meh

I’ll give him the benefit of the doubt. Maybe he just went to the ERA-FIP leaderboard and noticed Pavano had been remarkably unlucky? Wouldn’t be the first time that two people had the same idea.

by davidcameron on May 25, 2009 6:45 AM PDT reply actions

What the hell is wrong with me?

I just read all the comments in the Yahoo article. Don’t do it, whatever you do.

I will smash your face into a jelly.

by Phil Hatzenbuehler on May 25, 2009 9:41 AM PDT reply actions

I'll take famous movie titties for 800.

Oh god the comments on Yahoo are worse than the Fangraphs comments!

You got slurved!

Free Tommy Hanson! Free Jeff Clement! Free Michael Saunders!

by Slurvey on May 25, 2009 10:30 AM PDT reply actions

Famous movie titties?

by royalcurve on May 25, 2009 10:44 AM PDT up reply actions

You never seen the SNL Celebrity Jeopardy .

You got slurved!

Free Tommy Hanson! Free Jeff Clement! Free Michael Saunders!

by Slurvey on May 25, 2009 11:21 AM PDT up reply actions

Anal bum cover!

~The Official LookoutLanding Poster Who Dreams Of Doing Naughty Naughty Things To Russell Branyan~

by section331 on May 25, 2009 12:14 PM PDT up reply actions

Jap Anus Relations!

by johnbai on May 25, 2009 12:31 PM PDT up reply actions

The rapists!

by Teej on May 25, 2009 1:07 PM PDT up reply actions

Catch The Semen

by Schaefer on May 26, 2009 3:49 PM PDT up reply actions

That is an awfully monumental statement

by .Taylor on May 25, 2009 1:40 PM PDT up reply actions

Sherlock Holmes thetank123 is not

Hey guys, this is Brad Evans from Yahoo! Sports. Just to clarify for the conspiracy theorists in attendance: the Roto Arcade entry penned two days ago on Carl Pavano was not an intentional duplication of Dave Cameron’s Fangraphs article. Being a paid fanalyst, I do lean heavily on sabermetrics data when proving a point. Fangraphs is unquestionably the best site online for providing in-depth statistical information. The entire Y! Fantasy team has referenced it often over the past two years. But to make things crystal clear: Dave’s entry was not consumed until after my blog was posted. Describing Pavano as a “punchline” was purely coincidental. Frankly, based on his career in New York, the butt of jokes viewpoint is probably a very common perception.

Discussions on Pavano’s numbers misfortune was bound to have a similar tone simply because we were examining and regurgitating identical data. When it comes to an inflated ERA, unfortunate BABIP and friendly FIP, there’s only one way to skin a cat.

To reiterate, I’m not the type of person who poaches the work of others. It’s unprofessional, uncreative and downright slimy. Venturing down that path is filled with painful consequences. It’s senseless to risk tarnishing my reputation. That is, what little reputation I have. Sorry if you feel there’s a connection between the two, but I can personally assure you the similarities were unintentional. However, I take full responsibility for the “bunch of terrible jokes.” My douchey nature couldn’t resist an Alyssa Milano reference or three. That’s one part of Pavano’s career that deserves adulation.

If you have any questions or additional comments don’t hesitate to contact me at brade@yahoo-inc.com.

by BigNoise on May 25, 2009 2:05 PM PDT reply actions 11 recs

I appreciate your clearing this up

Thanks!

by Jeff Sullivan on May 25, 2009 2:21 PM PDT up reply actions

A yahoo sports writer with accountability?

Well now I’ve seen everything.

Paris Hilton, Burberry plaid, reality TV, mullets, Zima, Dubya, and the Sonics being sold to Oklahoma City. - Yahoo Answer results for "7 Signs of the Apocalypse"

by bluemax on May 25, 2009 2:42 PM PDT up reply actions