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Around SBN: Win or Lose, Boston Celtics' New Big 3 Era A Success

2, 27, 33: A Retrospective

So, with the Fields saga over, we're pretty confident in where we'll be picking in the very early rounds of June's Rule Four draft. The only complication lies in whether or not Crow will cave and sign on with the Nationals. If he does, each of our picks (save the second overall) will be bumped up by 1 Edit: I'm a moron. The second rounds and above won't be determined until the beginning of the season, due to unsigned type A and B picks floating around.

Anyway, I thought it might be an interesting little exercise to take a look at where we'll be picking this year and how those spots have turned out historically, so let's see where the first and supplemental rounds of the draft will take us.

Star-divide

#2

2008: Pedro Alvarez, 3B. Great hitter, ranked as the #4 prospect in the country by BP this year. Has yet to play professionally, as a contract dispute with the Pirates lasted until late September.

2007:  Mike Moustakas, SS. Another top prospect, spent last year as a well above average hitter in A+, despite being fairly young for the league. BP has him ranked #21 overall going into 2009.

2006: Greg Reynolds, RHP. I have no idea why this happened. He's been pretty terrible over his professional career.

2005: Alex Gordon, 3B. Destroyed college and then the minor league, hasn't translated that success to the majors as of yet.

2004: Justin Verlander, RHP. Good pitcher with great stuff but spotty command. Miscast as an ace and overrated in general.

#27

2008: Carlos Gutierrez, RHP. Torii Hunter compensation for the Twins, Gutierrez signed in time to play last season, putting up average numbers as a reliever in A+. Nothing to write home about as of yet.

2007: Rick Porcello, RHP. Possibly the best arm in the 2007 draft, Porcello dropped to the Tigers due to signability reasons. He's been excellent as a pro, and is currently ranked #7 by BP.

2006: Jason Place, OF. I have no idea who this is. Has yet to post an above average season as a hitter.

2005: Joey Devine, RHP. Oakland ended up acquiring him from the Braves as the centrepiece of the Kotsay trade. Has been a well above average reliever since 2007.

2004: Taylor Tankersly, LHP. Mediocre reliever for the Marlins.

#33

2008: Brad Holt, RHP. Great fastball/curve combo for the Mets, probably needs a change to succeed as a starter.

2007: Jon Gilmore, 3B. Mind-bogglingly terrible in A-ball last year, picked himself up after a demotion. Still making the transition from SS to third.

2006: Emmanuel Burriss, SS. Currently in the mix for the Giant's 2B job going into next season. Bat should be serviceable for a middle infielder.

2005: John Drennen, OF. Once a promising bat, Drennen's development has stagnated in high-A ball.

2004: Justin Orenduff, RHP: A catastrophic 2008 has undone most of the good work from 2007. Currently looks like bullpen fodder at best.

We'll also probably have pick #46, notable for Yovani Gallardo in 2004.

We have a pretty good chance of grabbing at least a top-20 prospect for next year, and it looks like there's every chance that this draft could revitalise the farm completely. But nothing is guaranteed, which is what makes this so much fun. At January's feed, Tom McNamara described the upcoming draft as the most important in Mariner history. If you're not excited for it, even though we've given up #22 in exchange for Josh Fields, I don't know what to tell you.

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Rocky Mountain High?
2006: Greg Reynolds, RHP. I have no idea why this happened. He’s been pretty terrible over his professional career.

I thought this was rumored to be a fraidy cat “low cost” pick (3.25 million) by the Rockies because they, like us, didn’t want to bust slot for Andrew Miller (3.55 signing bonus + annoying stipulations and didn’t sign twice with two previous draft selections [2003, 2006]).

Tho I don’t know how anybody is retarded enough to let Evan Longoria go past them, even WITH hindsight being a bitch. Just inexcusable.

Fans are typically idiots.

by The Typical Idiot Fan on Feb 16, 2009 8:34 PM PST reply actions  

I seem to remember people talking about Longoria as a low risk/low upside guy at the time of the draft.

Like Jeff Cirillo’s numbers at Coors. Obviously they were wrong to do so, but for some reason this is what sticks in my head.

by Double06 on Feb 16, 2009 8:43 PM PST up reply actions  

Book is still out on him

He had shoulder soreness in 2007 that shut him down until end of season. He had arthoscopic surgery in the winter but I do not think they discovered anything. He was still rated well after the draft and BA rated him as their #98 prospect at the start of 2008( take that as you will). I have no idea how much remains of his stuff after the mystery injury but his line is obviously not pretty.

by tdot mariner fan on Feb 16, 2009 8:52 PM PST up reply actions  

Reynolds

was more of a 10 pick so while being an overdraft he wasn’t that far from the realm of possibility (for example on site ranked him as the next best pitcher after Morrow who we picked with the 5th overall choice) He had a shoulder injury after the draft which made the pick look worse then it was (assuming they did there homework and the injury was after signing) He kind of reminds me of Jeremy Guthrie who is another Stanford alum. Reynolds could definitely stand to strikeout more batters but being as tall as he is he should also be able to get some good sink on his pitches

Don't believe the lies Bill!!!! look at the sparkly ERA!!! Sparkly, Sparkly!!! - McCovey Chronicles

by Trenchtown on Feb 16, 2009 10:10 PM PST up reply actions  

I feel like your

appraisal of Gordon sells him short a little bit. He made significant strides with the bat last year and is at least league average defensively. Next year will be more telling as to whether he takes another step forward but the way you phrased it makes it sound like he is hitting like Kevin Kouzmanoff when he was better then that especially in the 2nd half. Even if he doesn’t improve from last year and plays at that level for the next half decade it would be hard to call him a bust.

Don't believe the lies Bill!!!! look at the sparkly ERA!!! Sparkly, Sparkly!!! - McCovey Chronicles

by Trenchtown on Feb 16, 2009 10:03 PM PST reply actions  

He is hitting like Kevin Kouzmanoff.

But that’s not such a bad thing. Both are solid third basemen.

by Teej on Feb 16, 2009 10:08 PM PST up reply actions  

No he is not

Kouzmanoff’s wOBA last year was .316 last year compared to Gordon’s .344 which is about a 9 run difference over a season. Gordon’s bat is about a win better then Kouz who might have had a down year and Gordon is two years younger

Don't believe the lies Bill!!!! look at the sparkly ERA!!! Sparkly, Sparkly!!! - McCovey Chronicles

by Trenchtown on Feb 16, 2009 10:16 PM PST up reply actions  

His 2008 was pretty bad.

But the year before, he was above average at the plate.

Looking at StatCorner wOBA* numbers so we can park-adjust:

Gordon 07: .319
Gordon 08: .351

Kouz 07: .351
Kouz 08: .332

Yes, going forward, my money’s on Gordon because he’s younger and has better plate discipline. But regarding Kouz, there has been some good along with the bad.

by Teej on Feb 16, 2009 10:25 PM PST up reply actions  

This might be a bit of an exaggeration.

Gordon looks to be the better hitter going forward because he can actually take a pitch, but I like to defend Kouzmanoff. He’s not as bad as people make him out to be.

by Teej on Feb 16, 2009 10:16 PM PST up reply actions  

Defend Kouz on his defense

he rates slightly above average in both PMR and UZR last year despite a dreadful reputation

Don't believe the lies Bill!!!! look at the sparkly ERA!!! Sparkly, Sparkly!!! - McCovey Chronicles

by Trenchtown on Feb 16, 2009 10:22 PM PST up reply actions  

Indeed he does.

But he also projects as an average to above-average bat. CHONE, for example, projects him to be a tiny bit better than Adrian Beltre in 2009, so it’s not like “hitting like Kevin Kouzmanoff” is something to be ashamed of.

by Teej on Feb 16, 2009 10:48 PM PST up reply actions  

I didn't say you did

I just said that the way you phrased it felt like you hadn’t given him enough credit for what he has already accomplished at the major league level

Don't believe the lies Bill!!!! look at the sparkly ERA!!! Sparkly, Sparkly!!! - McCovey Chronicles

by Trenchtown on Feb 16, 2009 11:12 PM PST up reply actions  

He's a good player

He’s just not Alex Gordon, destroyer of worlds.

Yet.

by Graham MacAree on Feb 16, 2009 11:14 PM PST up reply actions  

tim linecum

we should have taken the local boy linecum,good luck too him.

by justicebeau on Feb 16, 2009 11:09 PM PST reply actions  

Welcome to LL.

We try to be welcoming to new voices around these parts, but you’ve been warned by mods several times (here and here) to put more effort into your comments (capitalize, spell names correctly, etc.)

Our overlords are pretty nice guys, but following some basic rules will ensure that you stay on their good side and stick around for a long time! Yay!

by Teej on Feb 16, 2009 11:22 PM PST up reply actions  

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