FOX Sports Power Ratings
by Slurvey on Feb 16, 2009 7:40 PM PST
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PrintWell according to Fox Sports power rankings by Alam Tolegian the Yanks are leading while the M's are the worst in the MLB.
His reasoning
There seems to be no upside with the M's. There may be more wins with a good version of Erik Bedard, but this team is far from making a serious bid in the West. And there's nothing truly exciting to point to on the farm.
I believe contending might be a little stretch but I think we're are definitely not the worst team in the MLB.(Cue pictures of the Reds and Royals) Then we have a stronger rotation this year and I doubt our pitching staff we'll do as horrible as last year(well I hope so) since the defense is better giving them a slight edge. Our line up doesn't look to great at first but it's loaded with plenty of breakout candidates
Also he believes the Nats will be at 25th because of Adam Dunn alone.
The late addition of Adam Dunn added a nice finishing touch on a good offseason. The Nats play in the NL's toughest division, so they're not about to stun the world. But vast improvement can be expected.
So if we signed Griffey we'd probably be like 20th on this list.
And there's nothing truly exciting to point to on the farm.
*cough* Truinfel?!?!?* or Aumont future TOR starter or the Rameriez/Pineda/Adock rotation? The rising bat of Dennis Raben perhaps? Saunders/Halman OF duo? or maybe Tui...
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I have no ability to cope with bad baseball.
by Aaron Campeau on Feb 16, 2009 8:01 PM PST up reply actions
You're still around after last year's clusterfucky trainwreck
Nice Guys Finish Third - Hopelessly lost, but makin' good time.
Do you have any idea how much I drank last season?
by Aaron Campeau on Feb 16, 2009 8:31 PM PST up reply actions
But think of all the great new beer you discovered.
There’s always an upside.
Nice Guys Finish Third - Hopelessly lost, but makin' good time.
Eh.
Dead last?
I’m not buying it either.
I’m sure Wakamatsu will have this will be posted on every wall and inside every locker.
Seriously?
He also thinks the Blue Jays are the 18th best team in baseball,
that the Phillies are better than the Red Sox and that the Angels are the seventh best team in baseball. There is absolutely no reason to pay attention to what this guy has to say.
I stopped reading foxsports a long time ago
Seeing the stupidity of the comments under the stories just pain my eyes.
Rosenthal's a pretty good reporter.
But other than that, I stay away. Heyman isn’t 100% batshit crazy like I thought he was, but he’s still at like 80%.
While I think he's wrong with his ranking.. I couldn't help but chuckle at your
excitement over Nathan Adcock and Dennis Raben..
In all honestly, outside of Triunfel, Halman, and now Fields, there is nothing to be excited about in our current farm system. Yea, you can go down to the lower levels and see Pineda, Aumont, Ramirez, and others and be hopeful, but for a national author to think that is something to be excited about, you’re asking an awful lot.
If you're more excited for Fields than Aumont there is something seriously wrong with your prospect evaluation
by Graham MacAree on Feb 16, 2009 8:22 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Aumont is a long ways off, while Fields could be half a season away.. of course if Aumont pans out
he’s alot more important than Fields, but I’ve seen nothing from Aumont to have me believe there is more than a 50/50 shot he becomes a good MLB starter. My point was that most of our farm players have major hurdles they need to get over and many are in the lower levels.
No offense to those that love our system, but pretty much all teams in baseball have their versions of Tui, Acock, Raben, etc…
The Fox author is correct in that their is nothing in terms of 2009 talent to be excited about on the farm, and outside of Triunfel, who is 19, I don’t find a prospect down there I’m overly excited about being a MLB All-Star
"My point was that most of our farm players have major hurdles they need to get over and many are in the lower levels."
They’re prospects. Lacking a true blue-chipper until June does not kill a farm system.
by Graham MacAree on Feb 17, 2009 7:05 AM PST up reply actions
You need to read more Dave Cameron.
Fans are typically idiots.
by The Typical Idiot Fan on Feb 16, 2009 8:22 PM PST up reply actions
Nope
If you have any problems with Raben, then I would suggest you look at what the kid can do right. Then stop to consider that he still has 2-3 years to fix the handful of issues he has with his approach towards hitting. Dennis Raben is a wonderful prospect.
Yea, you can go down to the lower levels and see Pineda, Aumont, Ramirez, and others and be hopeful, but for a national author to think that is something to be excited about, you’re asking an awful lot.
I’m having trouble understanding what this means. Do our young arms offer hope or not? And why should national writers ignore what’s going on in A-ball? Is that something that only regional writers ought to focus on? I’m confused.
This is an article about the M's power ranking in 2009, right?
So… No… our A ball arms give us no hope at all.
Although one of them could someday pitch in the majors… and I guess that’s hopeful!
National writers are ignoring low level minors (except maybe recent #1 picks) because they are grappling with the complexities of figuring out if Boston should be #3 or Phillie. Why would they care about thousands of players that are never going to play in the big leagues?
No he just said our farm pretty much sucks and has nothing exciting.
If he said our farm won’t likely help us in 09 then yes but he just said there is nothing in it that jumps out when there is. Writers can choose to ignore low a ball but when he is talking about the entire system rather than make some BS comment on how it has nothing shiny in it he should actually do some research on it.
BOOYA! You got Slurved!
The FoxSports guy and Rudy4three are making different points
but they are both right.
Fox Sports says: the M’s have no prospects in the Jay Bruce/Max Scherzer tier (guys that will have an impact in 2009.) When assessing their “power ranking” for 2009, the Mariner’s farm can be summarily dismissed as “unexciting.”
Rudy says: the M’s farm system only has a couple of players that are likely to ever be more than marginal big leaguers. It’s really not a very exciting farm system.
Can’t see any flaws in either stance.
Disagree
The Fox Sports guy said
And there’s nothing truly exciting to point to on the farm.
The writer didn’t merely state that we have no impact players in AA or AAA who can help us this year. He (and Ruby) said that the farm system lacks anything “truly exciting” at all.
Granted, our only top-20 prospect still has a long ways to go before making the Majors. We don’t have a Bruce or Weiters waiting on the horizon. But the team’s talent in the low-minors is stacked. While it’s a matter of opinion if that’s “truly exciting” or not, I would at least contend that it invalidates the stance that the team’s farm system is inherently dismal.
No one said dismal, they said "unexciting"
And the context of the Fox Sports Guy needs to be considered. He said what he said while writing 3 sentences summarizing the Mariner’s power ranking in 2009. His context makes it clear (at least to me) that he’s talking about the lack of blue-chippers that are likely to make a splash for the M’s this year.
Adcock is the under the radar prospect but his stuff is good.
Sinking FB in the low 90’s that produced a 52% GB rate and an excellent curve as an out pitch (BA rated it as best in our system evidently) and his K/9 is 9.47 he has been overshadowed by Aumont, Pineda and Ramirez. So while he profiles more as a MOR starter I can say yes I’m excited for him because while he’s only in A-ball he’s got potential.
Then who’s not excited about Raben that guy is a freaking beast.
BOOYA! You got Slurved!
Aumont is like 12 years old, stands 10 feet tall and throws sinking, flaming cannonballs.
What’s more exciting than that?
If the Quebecois are as good at turning out pitchers as they are at turning out highway systems relative to the rest of Canada
Then we’re going to be looking at a multiple Cy Young winner
Determined, Jonesing Commentor | Proud proprietor of Wyomingroutes.org & Washingtonhighways.org
by Corco on Feb 16, 2009 11:29 PM PST up reply actions 2 recs
Aumont excites me more than anybody
Determined, Jonesing Commentor | Proud proprietor of Wyomingroutes.org & Washingtonhighways.org
Between Aumont, Ramirez, Pineda and Adcock, chances are pretty good at least one of them pans out really well
and one or two others at least get to the show eventually. I kind of like the idea of having four pretty good starting pitchers up and coming.
by seattlebruin on Feb 16, 2009 11:30 PM PST up reply actions
Please provide some sort of evidence for this assertion
Since I’ve repeatedly seen every Mariner pitching prospect (and I was only watching the ones that had already made it all the way to AAA) wash out over the last 15 years, it’s hard for me to believe this is more than wishful thinking.
Felix isn't a washout and Morrow doesn't appear to be, although it's too early to say for sure.
Also, the organization has been completely overhauled.
by Aaron Campeau on Feb 17, 2009 12:01 AM PST up reply actions
Yes! That's true
I can hold onto that with some hope. But even that has to temper your expectations a bit… Felix was supposed to be heir to Doc Gooden coming through the minors. He’s been great and all, but still pretty frustratingly inconsistent in the bigs. Jury is still out on Morrow, but I’m pretty optimistic about his future as a starter (but what do I know… I still like Gil Meche.)
Feed me more positivity to get the taste of Nageotte and Blackley out of my mouth.
This is a completely new group though
One that was known for their skill with developing minor leaguers.
by Mariner John on Feb 17, 2009 12:23 AM PST up reply actions
Alright, that's another good example
although he’s yet to even have Dave Flemming’s career, let alone Eric Hanson’s.
I'll be surprised if he sticks in the majors
but he did graduate from AAA so I’ll give the M’s pitching development team some credit there. I’m not at all convinced we’ll ever regret dumping him though, so it’s hard to really chalk him up in the win column.
Baek has been an average to above-average starting pitcher for the past two years.
He’s not exciting, but I absolutely regret dumping him.
He was a league average pitcher in San Diego
by Graham MacAree on Feb 17, 2009 2:13 PM PST up reply actions
Thank you, Graham.
Cha Seung Baek is ridiculously underrated. He was a league ave. pitcher in Seattle in both 2008 and 2007, too.
jared fucking wells
You are entering a world of pain, Smokey.
“I HATE ALL THESE FUCKCUNTS MORE THAN LIFE ITS SELF
I WANT THEM TO 15 FUCKING MINUTES IN HEAVEN WITH THE FUCKING BUBONIC PLAUGE”
by marc w on Feb 17, 2009 3:55 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
The more good prospects you have, the better shot that one (or more!) of them pans out
perhaps trying to put numbers on that statement was incorrect, but I’d much rather have four guys with 50/50 shots or better at becoming an impact player than one guy in AA with a 70/30 shot at making it.
by seattlebruin on Feb 17, 2009 8:18 AM PST up reply actions
Yes. Quantity matters.
Especially with pitchers, because the failure rate is so high. That’s why we saw Andy MacPhail just run down the list and take every M’s pitching prospect he could find. If you’re trying to restock, you want high-ceiling talent, but you also just need talent period, because not every high-ceiling guy is going to turn into a good MLB pitcher. Your odds of turning out a useful pitcher get better with every arm you add to the system.
This is another reason I loved the Putz trade. Yeah, we got some great MLB-ready defensive players and a good relief pitcher, but we also added a few guys to the farm system. If one of those guys (Carp or that young pitcher?) ends up being an everyday player in the majors, then we make out like thieves.
Carp's not too far from the bigs, is he?
Cleto and Carrera both seem like super-high risk, good reward types, or the types where you just stockpile ten of them and hope a couple turn into good players
by seattlebruin on Feb 17, 2009 9:52 AM PST up reply actions
I don't know a ton about any of them, but yes, I believe Carp is the closest of the three.
It’s not like a 1B prospect is super exciting, but if he can hit, it’s not like we have anyone blocking him.
You've got a good point
I also think they’re not likely to be dead last, and may not even be at the bottom of the division in 09, but with many of the local writers saying this is a lackluster team one can hardly expect a national writer to see it as a rough diamond. And yes, as far as the 09 team is concerned there isn’t any help coming up from the minors except Fields, relievers and maybe RRS if he starts the season in the Tacoma rotation. It’s probably unfair to say there is no upside in the team – Bedard, Silva, Clement, Ichiro, Felix, Balentien, Johjima, Gutierrez, Yuni, Branyan, Sweeney all are likely to perform better than last year (in descending order of likelyhood and significance).
The flip side of it is there isn’t really a lot of downside on the team. Nearly every position that has a question mark attached is protected by considerable depth and really with the exception of Beltre and Lopez I can’t imagine any players doing any worse than last year.
by Bearskin Rugburn on Feb 17, 2009 7:57 AM PST up reply actions
I've spent the last 20 minutes trying to find last year's with no luck.
by Aaron Campeau on Feb 16, 2009 8:56 PM PST up reply actions
Also, proven closers are very important.
The feeling here is that Phillies took a step back this off-season. How any team can trust Brad Lidge to close is beyond us.
I guess someone made quite the impression on the Fox Sports crack writing team…
OK, somebody tell me how the Astros
with 1 really good SP, 1 OK guy, and junk get a free pass on a team that has in the bottom of the league (22nd) in Runs Scored? How in the holy fuck are they 16th? They got worse this off season, if that was possible. Hell they may not even be the best team in Texas, much less 16th.
How are the Angels 7th? I expect the no team in the West to win 90 games this year. I can kinda see the A’s at 14th, but no mention that their entire rotation is young and inexperienced?
Why am I wasting time with this crappy article? This was total waste.
I am ready for some FUCKING BASEBALL!!!!
it's almost like there's no analytical rigor at all to these lists.
Shocking.
Nice Guys Finish Third - Hopelessly lost, but makin' good time.
I could wipe my ass with these rankings and make them more worthwhile.
Don’t spend more time thinking about them than the author did.
Perhaps this is 2009's Vegas over/under arbitrage opportunity...
Just as the Rays winning, what, 72 games last year was the home-based business guaranteed moneymaking opportunity of 2008.
We're going to give up like 650 runs this season
at the very least, our games will be awfully exciting
We could go over to Halo Heaven and bitch about how many 1 run wins we had.
There are no good individual basketball statistics.
54!
Quote from article
The Royals quietly had a nice offseason
and then didn’t mention the Greinke extension. This is obviously some affirmative action hire for the mentally handicapped.
If you want to quickly assess if any baseball writer is worth reading, just get his or her opinion on the Royals offseason.
Well they managed to not trade Grienke, Soria, Gordon or DeJesus
and the contracts they took on, while for crappy players aren’t franchise-killingly-bad like others we’ve seen recently. It could have been worse, I guess.
by seattlebruin on Feb 17, 2009 9:56 AM PST up reply actions
I don't get why everyone rips on FoxSports.com. I find it to be the gold standard for professionalism.
by Teej on Feb 17, 2009 11:20 AM PST reply actions 1 recs
Oh bloody hell
I DRINK YOUR MILKSHAKE!!! I DRINK IT UP!!
I can't believe you wrote that instead of Photoshopping it.
by Teej on Feb 17, 2009 10:16 PM PST up reply actions 4 recs
Here's something I'd really like to know
What are the historical “success” rates of prospects? We casually throw out numbers like “he’s got a 50/50 shot at being a TOR pitcher.” I’m guessing we could make that argument about 10 pitchers and only one will actually wind up being a TOR pitcher in the bigs. I love seeing homegrown talent come up and play well for the ML team, but it doesn’t seem to happen nearly as often as I’ve expected it to over the years. And whenever I see someone make a claim about someone’s chances of being an impact player at the big league level, I always feel like the person is selling me something.
The hardest part of a study like this, I suppose, is that you’d have to look back at who you thought was going to be a star 10-15 years ago and see how they panned out.
Uh huh...
Like the move to replace Pat Burrell with the more steady Raul Ibanez.
Yeah, I’m putting a lot of faith in these rankings…
when is BP's hitlist start?
Chicago. Where the Dead can Vote. Where the Voters of Tomorrow are found in the Obituaries of Today.
Why is it that I keep feeling like defending Fox News Sports writers?
For example, I’m totally tempted to argue that Raul Ibanez was “more steady” than Pat Burrell right now.
If by steady you mean
old and expensive then I totally agree.
vivaelbeñsheets
by vivaelpujols on Feb 17, 2009 7:31 PM PST up reply actions
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