Outfielders: (Part Of) A Complete And Balanced Baseball Team
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119 comments
Comments
Might as well give them an advantage since their pitching staff sucks
by Jeff on Feb 11, 2009 12:05 PM PST up reply actions 13 recs
Maybe they would be interested in a Jarrod Washburn.
by Fin on Feb 11, 2009 12:23 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I bet Jarrod could help out in the field if needed. Maybe at short?
by msb on Feb 11, 2009 1:29 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Jarrod is left handed
Determined, Jonesing Commentor | Proud proprietor of Wyomingroutes.org & Washingtonhighways.org
by I'm NOT Corco on Feb 11, 2009 1:41 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
This is the definitive JPEG, by the way.
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 1:26 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Wouldn't it make more sense to put Pena in right and Dunn at first?
by JI on Feb 11, 2009 12:03 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Pena is no speed demon
he may be an upgrade but only ever so slightly
by Bearskin Rugburn on Feb 11, 2009 12:05 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
hilarious
But remember, this is the NL, where bench players are more important.
by Bearskin Rugburn on Feb 11, 2009 12:03 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Don't knock it until you try it.
You just don't know when to keep your mouth shut, do you Saxy boy?
by oc on Feb 11, 2009 12:05 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Huh.
So, since Jim Bowden likes to collect OFers, maybe we can convince him that he needs a starting pitcher who can double as a team bus to go along with those OFers, and we’ll throw in a few million in cash, all for the low, low price of Nick Johnson.
by eponymous_coward on Feb 11, 2009 12:14 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Or a pitcher who can throw players
under the pitcher that doubles as a team bus.
the other angels fan
by Eyebrows on Feb 11, 2009 12:17 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I'm pretty sure if we feed motor oil to any player on our team their trade value would instantly plummet.
by Robert on Feb 11, 2009 12:50 PM PST up reply actions 4 recs
It would make the blubber for the oil lamps burn better after he is carved up.
There are no good individual basketball statistics.
54!
by joof on Feb 11, 2009 5:25 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Extra OFers?
Aside from Johnson at 1B, are any of those OF worth pursuing in a trade?
by bilbo on Feb 11, 2009 12:18 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Jeff, would you consider...
Chavez’s upside to be what Harris has been the last two years?
by meloyellow15 on Feb 11, 2009 12:23 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
The last two years, Harris has been an above-average hitter
Chavez won’t ever touch Harris’ 2008 value. But it is a similar idea.
by Jeff on Feb 11, 2009 12:26 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Harris has been utterly sick with the glove and shockingly competent with the bat.
He’s actually a very nice option as your fourth OF. Of course we have something like 300 OF right now.
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 12:27 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Harris would be damn fine as a starting corner OF
I don’t know how much of his 2008 offense is real, but he has a lot of room to fall from there before he’s a bad player.
by Jeff on Feb 11, 2009 12:29 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Having watched most Nats games last year (amazing, I know! And I watched most M's ones too!) I'd say that he's due for a bit of a drop-off but not that much.
He seems to have taken to the new stadium’s contours better than any other hitter on the team. And I have to say it’s a delight to watch him in the field. He just glides around out there most of the time, and every now and then darts at some seemingly impossible ball like a fish snapping at a lure and snagging it. Impressive stuff.
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 12:33 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I like Harris because he can also stand at 2nd base or shortstop competently if necessary
Determined, Jonesing Commentor | Proud proprietor of Wyomingroutes.org & Washingtonhighways.org
by I'm NOT Corco on Feb 11, 2009 1:01 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
so
Washburn and cash for Johnson and Harris? Throw in Chavez if he needs another OFer. :-)
by bilbo on Feb 11, 2009 12:29 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
AHAHAHAHAFUCKYOU
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 12:34 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
You owe us for Snelling/Fruto for Turbo
by eponymous_coward on Feb 11, 2009 12:38 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I owe you? It's worse than that.
I owe myself. You have any idea how weird it felt to see my one favorite team ripping off my other favorite team? I derived no pleasure from it…it was like watching Cain slay Abel.
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 12:45 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Also +22 and +21 in RF by plus/minus these last two years
In partial seasons, no less.
by Jeff on Feb 11, 2009 12:43 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Bowden certainly knows how to corner the market...
on fourth outfielders.
by Wilder. on Feb 11, 2009 12:20 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
JUST SHUT THE FUCK UP, JEFF.
SHUT THE FUCK UP AND STOP MOCKING. I’M HAPPY FOR MY RETARD NL TEAM, LIKE WHEN YOUR DOWNS’ SYNDROME CHILD TAKES HIS FIRST HALTING STEPS BEFORE IMMEDIATELY TUMBLING OVER.
(Don’t make fun…I know it’s a senseless signing but what if the terms are, like, really awesome or something?)
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 12:26 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
The upside is that this creates an opportunity for Jim Bowden to look like a genius
The downside is that achieving such genius doesn’t appear possible within the constraints of space and time. So I guess the level of genius would be unprecedented.
by Jeff on Feb 11, 2009 12:29 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
The terms are apparently 2/$20 million.
So it’s not a terrible deal, but still probably a bit of an overpay at $10 million a year in this market. I mean let’s assume that Abreu’s deal isn’t really $5 million (it’s probably more like $8 million with plausible incentives), that’s still a $2 million overpay. About what I’d expect given the Nationals’ worst-place status.
Man, if we didn’t have SO MANY FUCKING OUTFIELDERS COMING OUT OF OUR EARS, I might actually like this deal a lot. I like Dunn and I like the years, the money’s reasonable too. It’s just that he’s so…superfluous.
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 12:31 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah
It’s a fine contract and all. I just don’t see the point.
by Jeff on Feb 11, 2009 12:33 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Um.
Bowden drafted Dunn, and just loves the big Donkey?
by msb on Feb 11, 2009 1:32 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I kinda love the big Donkey too.
Back before we had this huge glut of quality/prospect OF’ers, I fervently hoped we would sign Dunn. He’s an amiable lug, he’s the living embodiment of the Three True Outcomes, and hey – the actual contract is quite good, really. It’s just that right now we have so many damn OF’ers.
Which makes me wonder. Dunn probably would have preferred to sign with a team that let him play LF. Instead he took the Nationals’ offer (a last-place team) and agreed to play 1B. He got a bit of bonus for that (an extra year plus a million or so over “market” as set by Burrell and Abreu, granting that Dunn is slightly better than those two), but still…the market must have been WEAK for this to all happen.
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 1:56 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Best possible outfield combination, as far as I can tell:
Harris/Langerhans/Dukes.
It’s going to be fun to watch them not use that.
by Jeff on Feb 11, 2009 12:31 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
I really want to see what 600 plate appearances of Elijah Dukes looks like.
by Teej on Feb 11, 2009 12:33 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I suspect he will beat the ball harder than he beats his women.
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 12:34 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Wouldn't MIlledge have much more upside than Langerhans?
by JI on Feb 11, 2009 12:34 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Langerhans is a decent hitter and an absolutely wonderful defensive OF
He deserves a starting gig somewhere.
by Jeff on Feb 11, 2009 12:36 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Langerhans is still suffering from the aftereffects of his atrocious 2006-2007 campaigns.
His superficial stats were TERRIBLE, and while his defense was fine indeed, you would be hard-pressed to find many GMs who think of him as starting material.
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 12:38 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Which is why he had to sign a minor league contract
but he’s easily a better player than, say, Raul Ibanez. GMs are just silly sometimes.
by Jeff on Feb 11, 2009 12:39 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
At this point I trust the numbers with my life, pretty much, but still...
…it’s incredibly hard to wrap my mind around the proposition that Langerhans is “easily” a better player than Raul. I know Langy has the plus-plus defense and Raul is Raul, but I still retain this subjective sense that Langerhans’ bat has fallen off a Wile E. Coyote cliff and shows no signs of returning.
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 12:44 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
We have to trade for one of these guys.
Maybe we could trade Yuni and sell them on that whole upside thing.
by JI on Feb 11, 2009 12:47 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
We don't have a hole at SS what with the Guzman resigning.
However, the Nats have had a thing for underachieving 2B named Lopez in the past….I see an opening here. You could probably overcharge them too given JoLo’s good season last year.
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 12:52 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Like anything the Nationals do makes sense
by JI on Feb 11, 2009 12:58 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
To be fair, everyone was full of praise for the Nats moves & trajectory in March of 2008.
They had made the Kearns/Lopez trade in 2006, dumped Vidro + salary on us, stolen Jesus Flores from the Mets on the Rule V draft and turned him into a young ML-worthy catcher, purloined Milledge from the Mets for the aging spare parts of Schneider and Church (a deal made possible in large part by the Flores robbery), found undervalued power hitters with big upside in Willy Mo Pena and Elijah Dukes, and had the runner-up for ROY manning third base. AND we had what Baseball America rated the best draft class of the 2007 season.
And then it all went straight to hell in a handbasket. Everyone – EVERYONE – in our ML lineup got injured and missed significant time. Wily Mo turned into a pumpkin. Kearns and Lopez failed to develop as reasonably hoped. Cordero tore his labrum before we could trade him). The bullpen – previously a major strength – imploded. The young prospects almost all took a step backwards in the minors. And then we failed to sign our #1 draft pick.
It was the year from hell, and arguably even worse that what we all went through here with the M’s. Though I could definitely entertain arguments for either side.
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 1:07 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
How odd that I have absolutely no memory of his ML playing time.
How many ABs?
I guarantee you that you could get Langerhans from the Nationals for beans.
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 12:48 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
139 good PAs in the Majors, 257 good PAs in the minors
Even if you just call him a .315 wOBA true talent, he’s a league-average player in left or right.
by Jeff on Feb 11, 2009 12:50 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
All of a sudden I want the NL to adopt the DH rule.
Then we’d have a place for Dunn.
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 12:35 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
By the way, I think this means that, of all the Nationals' surplus outfielders, Kearns is the one with the axe over his head.
His defense is still plus-plus, but he was hugely disappointing last year and the sense I get from reading the Washington tea leaves is that his days are numbered. They’re not going to deal Milledge or Dukes unless the price is very right. Harris is the projected 4th OF but can be had for a fair price. Langerhans is a throw-in, and Willingham is basically our projected 1B since who the hell knows whether Nick Johnson will ever be able to play two games in a row?
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 12:40 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
With the news that Dunn is playing 1B, I revise my opinion:
Our starting OF will, absent any trades, remain Dukes/Milledge/Kearns with Harris as the 4th OF (even though Harris ought to be the starting LF…he held the job down fabulously last season when injuries set in). Johnson and/or Willingham are gone for sure. I have no idea how the calculations are being made in the Nats FO, but I would think that Johnson’s on the block first, with Willingham as the backup/sub/bench bat.
In a perfect world, the Nats would trade Kearns and Johnson for a couple of young mid-level prospects, and run an outfield of Harris/Milledge/Dukes with Dunn at 1B and a healthy Johnson as the bench bat/sub along with Belliard. You would actually have two genuinely threatening power hitters in Dukes and Dunn plus a guy who can take at walk or dink a hit pretty much at will in Johnson…when he’s not slicing open his wrist sheath whilst taking practice swings, that is.
As dumb as it sounds, a Washburn trade with the Mariners is suddenly sounding…plausible.
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 12:59 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Oh Sure
I bring it up and its FUCKYOUHAHAHAHAHA, but you think about it and suddenly it makes sense? :-)
by bilbo on Feb 11, 2009 1:06 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
The fact that Dunn is playing 1B changes what I think is PLAUSIBLE, but doesn't really affect what I feel is right, you know what I mean?
Also, a more plausible trade would be Washburn for Johnson + $$$ (i.e. we take on most of the salary). Throwing in Harris as well would be highway robbery.
The reason it’s more plausible now is because the one constant refrain in Washington baseball quarters over the offseason is the awfulness of our starting rotation. We have one genuinely good and healthy (and young) starter in John Lannan. That’s it, and then you go to iffy older/injury-prone/crappy types like Scott Olsen and Odalis Perez, both of who are also pretty much guaranteed spots. If Shawn Hill is actually healthy then he’s in as well (and he’s actually got HUGE upside…Hill’s sinker is one of the best in all major league baseball when it’s on and that’s no joke. It’s just — again! — that health is such an issue with him). That leaves one or two spots. Jason Bergmann will certainly compete, but who knows what he’ll do? He has such flashes of talent, and then he’s suddenly just another “big fucker coming in and walking the world.” Matt Chico? No thanks. So I can definitely see the Nats FO saying “we need another RESPECTABLE starting pitcher” and trading for Washburn. I’m not saying it’s a good move, I’m just saying I can see how it would happen.
Boy, using personal pronouns like “you” and “we” gets really confusing when both teams in the discussion are "we"s.
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 1:14 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Is it just me, or does Nick Johnson seem exceedingly injury-prone.
If we had to trade any kind of real talent for his services, I’d say no.
by redwolf75 on Feb 11, 2009 1:09 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Jarrod Washburn? In a heartbeat. Even with a 3-4 million dollar check to balance salaries
Seriously, we have 4 different guys who could turn into the next Washburn (RRS, Vargas, Olson, Feierabend). Nick Johnson has great upside if he stays healthy (two years on the Nats as a ~5 WAR player), and if not, great, we can rotate random people through the DH/1B/LF spots.
by eponymous_coward on Feb 11, 2009 1:17 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
The saddest part is that his most gruesome injury was pure freak accident.
He had played nearly the entire 2006 season without injury, and had put up a GREAT line (.290/.428/.520 in 500 AB, good for an OBP heavy OPS+ of 148). Then, in mid-September, he was backpedaling out into the RF foul line area to chase a pop-up when he crashed into Austin Kearns, who was simultaneously charging in to get the same ball.
It’s the most sickening collision I have EVER seen on a baseball field. Seriously, it’s right up there with the Joe Theismann/LT football tackle, or the Beltran/Cameron head-impact. You could actually SEE Nick’s leg being snapped in half, and he was on the field for 15 minutes, pretty much bawling like a child like anyone would.
And there you had it: it was clear that God just hated this extremely nice, extremely talented man. Finally, it looked like NJ was going to get in a full season without freak injuries, and prove what a great non-trad 1B he was: no overwhelming HR numbers, but solid SLG, excellent defense, and ridiculously great on-base skills. And finally he proved he could be healthy! And then he SNAPS HIS LEG LIKE A FUCKING MATCHSTICK. He missed all of 2007 recovering from it. Played fine for the first part of 2008, but then he tore a tendon sheath in his wrist swinging a bat (!) and was gone again. I repeat: God has for whatever reason decided to personally pwn this poor man.
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 1:21 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
What's his middle name?
I'd rather know a little about a lot than a lot about a little
by Sportszilla on Feb 11, 2009 1:26 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Oddly enough, it's "Damien"
Huh. It’s all starting to make sense now….
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 1:27 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
SRSLY though, it's "Robert"
By the way, he’s Larry Bowa’s nephew.
The More You Know.
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 1:29 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I always thought it was a mean joke on fate's part ...
somehow balancing out Bowa’s aggressiveness by beating down Johnson.
by msb on Feb 11, 2009 1:35 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
ick
I'd rather know a little about a lot than a lot about a little
by Sportszilla on Feb 11, 2009 1:40 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
When you're down by five, injuries like that don't need to happen.
You just don't know when to keep your mouth shut, do you Saxy boy?
by oc on Feb 11, 2009 1:41 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
NOTICE THAT THE METS WERE INVOLVED.
NOT A FUCKING COINCIDENCE.
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 1:44 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Ugh, look at the way his left leg flops over when he rolls onto his stomach.
Thanks for rekindling all the sickening memories of that day, Jeff. At least you verified my claim of how awful it looked to the viewers.
Where did you FIND that anyway?
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 1:45 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I hope the M's trade for NJ just so we can file this .GIF away for frequent use.
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 2:01 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Also, thanks for not including a subject line so I can't minimize it.
Asshole. Fucking cruel asshole.
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 1:48 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
You've already traumatized me this much, you might as well put the uglier replay up.
Let’s see the femur snap in slo-mo, what say?
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 2:00 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't want to open it back up again
Your loss.
by Jeff on Feb 11, 2009 2:01 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Ban him! Ban him Matthew!
The time to rise up is now! When he least expects it!
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 2:10 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I thought the 600 PA Elijah Dukes post was worse
by Jeff on Feb 11, 2009 2:21 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Care to explain to me?
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 2:27 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Jeff took my statement literally and wrecked the Internet.
by Teej on Feb 11, 2009 2:29 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
How do all those dots represent plate appearances, though?
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 2:30 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I wasn't going to insert 600 pictures of Elijah Dukes batting at full resolution
by Jeff on Feb 11, 2009 2:31 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
You people are working on a level of humor way above my puny intellect.
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 2:32 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Jeff, sometimes I just marvel
At the kind of mind that would even dream up such a thing
I'd rather know a little about a lot than a lot about a little
by Sportszilla on Feb 11, 2009 2:33 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Okay, I FINALLY get it.
You know how hard it is to position your cursor directly over one of those dots to “View Image” right-click on it? Bastard.
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 2:35 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
What was that even supposed to be?
That joke totally went over my head.
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 2:24 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
All I know is that my browser suddenly seems to slow down when scrolling past it.
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 2:25 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
You're not being helpful, Mr. Moderator.
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 2:28 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
According to that new injury tool
Nick Johnson has spent 155 days on the 15-day DL and 393 days on the 60-day DL.
1 injury to the face, 2 to the wrist, 1 to the hand, 1 to the lower back, 1 to the thigh, and 1 to the foot. Chris Snelling still wins the “Pwn’d by God” trophy, though
by csiems on Feb 11, 2009 3:10 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
And at one time the Nationals had them both!
Patriotism, Pepper, Professionalism
by esoteric on Feb 11, 2009 3:49 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Well, since Bowden has a thing for ex-Reds...
maybe he could sign Griffey and trade for Cameron?
by eponymous_coward on Feb 11, 2009 1:19 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I just realized...
we’re going to get Strasburg because Bowden is goign to draft either Ackley or Tate.
Yay!
"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett http://mvn.com/marinersminors/
by JY on Feb 11, 2009 4:20 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
This really isn't that big of a clusterfuck
if done reasonably. Put Willingham in left, he’s below average but not terrible and knows how to take a walk. Put Milledge in center, he has been bad defensively but yo uhave to play him as the player with the most potential, as you get closer to a complete team move him to a corner. Put Dukes in right as his bat showed real life last year and plus he was very good defensively, albeit small sample size. Play Dunn at first, Johnson is an excellent hitter but relying on his health is like leaving a bomb in the middle of a city and hopping someone doesn’t rig it to detonate for 500 caps and a suite. Finally play Harris at 2nd, Belliard can super sub 2nd and 3rd.
Don't believe the lies Bill!!!! look at the sparkly ERA!!! Sparkly, Sparkly!!! - McCovey Chronicles
by Trenchtown on Feb 11, 2009 10:23 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Still, you have to put Johnson in the lineup until he gets hurt.
He’s the best player on the team.
by Teej on Feb 12, 2009 8:46 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

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