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Around SBN: Jeremy Lin Continues Rampage, New York Wins On Road

State Of The Trade

Wbc_029_tiny by Jeff Sullivan on in Seattle Mariners Transactions

Still not official, still awesome.

Update: Unless Bob Elliott is right. Whoopsadoodle

Update #2: Larry Stone has assured us that everything is fine

Update #3: Official! Cliff Lee is now a member of the Seattle Mariners organization, while Tyson Gillies, Phillippe Aumont, and JC Ramirez are not. We rock.

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Read More: Cliff Lee (P - PHI), Seattle Mariners

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SOUND THE ALARM

RT@elliottbaseball We’re hearing someone involved in the trade flunked their physical.

WHAT TRADE?!?!?

by EnglishMariner on Dec 16, 2009 9:46 AM PST reply actions  

SHIT
Bio Bob Elliott is a baseball columnist for the Toronto Sun, Sun Media and a frequent guest on The FAN-590.

by EnglishMariner on Dec 16, 2009 9:51 AM PST up reply actions  

I wouldn't worry about it too much

Bob Elliott was the first to report Drabek being in the trade, but he’s also said a variety of crazy things that have turned out to not be true.

by Jeff Nye on Dec 16, 2009 9:52 AM PST reply actions  

?

angels fan in seattle

by Eyebrows on Dec 16, 2009 9:57 AM PST via mobile reply actions  

THERE IS NO FLOOR!!!

I fucking hate you Mariners

by kentroyals5 on Dec 16, 2009 10:03 AM PST reply actions   1 recs

Why are we panicking?

Our prospects are fine and Cliff Lee is coming our direction. Last I checked, there’s no way to make two seperate trades contingent upon each other. Jack Z c ould still say we had a deal and it’s not our problem that Toronto doesn’t like your trade.

Fans are typically idiots.

by The Typical Idiot Fan on Dec 16, 2009 10:05 AM PST reply actions  

Doesn't have to be announced to still be a deal.

Names are exchanged. Both sides are happy. They wouldn’t be sending people around to physicals if there wasn’t an agreement in principle somewhere.

Halladay has already reportedly agreed to a damned extension for Chrissakes. There’s a deal in place. “Pending physicals” is Toronto / Philly’s problem.

Fans are typically idiots.

by The Typical Idiot Fan on Dec 16, 2009 10:08 AM PST up reply actions  

Not true

Phils trading Lee is contingent on the Halladay deal going through. It’s all interconnectified.

by lemonverbena on Dec 16, 2009 10:07 AM PST up reply actions  

There is no way to force two seperate deals to be contingent.

Philadelphia’s whole rationale for trading Lee is only because they don’t want the cubbard to be bare. They don’t have to trade him at all.

This isn’t a three way deal where the problems of one deal should effect ours.

Fans are typically idiots.

by The Typical Idiot Fan on Dec 16, 2009 10:10 AM PST up reply actions  

Except that...it is a three-way deal.

There is a way to force two (or more) “separate” deals to be contingent: inform the other party that you won’t make that trade with that party until the other deal goes through. Which Philly certainly has done.

by lemonverbena on Dec 16, 2009 10:14 AM PST up reply actions  

Hopefully it's a Phillies prospect

They’re committed on Halladay now, they’d have to step it up to Brown

by Graham MacAree on Dec 16, 2009 10:08 AM PST reply actions  

It would make sense if it was Philly

Since the Toronto guy is the one talking about a player failing.

by seattlesundevil on Dec 16, 2009 10:09 AM PST up reply actions  

I doubt the Phillies would do this

Morrow is more likely. Aumont was originally drafted as a starter…Fields has always been a reliever. I think the Phillies valued Aumont as a starter and wouldn’t swap Fields in for that reason. Morrow on the other hand…

by short on Dec 16, 2009 10:20 AM PST up reply actions  

Hm, well, while we don't know anything, Elliot is based in Toronto.

It doesn’t mean it’s for sure this way, but that makes me think it’s one of the guys going to Toronto.

by BrettJMiller on Dec 16, 2009 10:18 AM PST reply actions  

Aumont's was done last night

They may have been waiting for some overnight lab results to finalize the physical. Just becuase it’s a report from Toronto doesn’t mean it’s a prospect going their direction…they could have heard from the Phillies that the deal for Halladay was on hold due to the failure if it IS Aumont.

by short on Dec 16, 2009 10:19 AM PST reply actions  

If its Aumont, say bye bye to Morrow

I’m okay with this, since Morrow is a constant reminder we shouldve had Lincecum anyways.

by MagicMike23 on Dec 16, 2009 10:21 AM PST reply actions  

Go away

http://sodomojo.com/

by .Taylor on Dec 16, 2009 10:22 AM PST up reply actions  

They do but they don't have opposable thumbs

This poster’s proper use of the space bar makes me suspect he’s not really an A’s fan, but only pretends to be one as cover for his poor baseball knowledge.

by short on Dec 16, 2009 10:24 AM PST up reply actions  

`
Apparently Aumont passed too. RT @elliottbaseball Halladay and Lee passed (they stuided), it’s a minor leaguer who failed his physical.

by BrianL on Dec 16, 2009 10:24 AM PST up reply actions  

Twitter Lingo

After “RT” is somebody elses post. The first part was what the guy added… meaning it was new news.

by zeeehjee on Dec 16, 2009 10:28 AM PST up reply actions  

,
Apparently Aumont passed too. RT @elliottbaseball Halladay and Lee passed (they stuided), it’s a minor leaguer who failed his physical.

by seattlesundevil on Dec 16, 2009 10:24 AM PST up reply actions  

Thank you both

My Mariners blog - SodoMojo, Twitter Feed, Fuck the fucking Angels!

by gregrabble on Dec 16, 2009 10:25 AM PST up reply actions  

LINK?

My Mariners blog - SodoMojo, Twitter Feed, Fuck the fucking Angels!

by gregrabble on Dec 16, 2009 10:23 AM PST up reply actions  

This potential trade is destroying both my productivity and my emotional well-being.

When I saw the title, I skimmed quickly over the update and thought that the trade had been made official. Then I started reading the comments…

by ty540 on Dec 16, 2009 10:34 AM PST reply actions  

Same boat....

Been studying for my Quantitative Analysis final all day…pop in for a second and BOOM, no more studying…

by SebastianPruiti on Dec 16, 2009 10:37 AM PST up reply actions  

.

“From AP: Phillies GM Amaro says he’s hopeful Halladay trade can be completed Wednesday but talks may extend into Thursday”

by Brian Floyd on Dec 16, 2009 10:36 AM PST reply actions  

These GM sure gave bad timing for this trade

Don’t they realize most people have work and are in final exams week. Hopefully this trade is delayed till the weekend and I can devote more time and discussion to this.

by MagicMike23 on Dec 16, 2009 10:36 AM PST reply actions  

Hello friends

The pup that laughs when you're down on your luck.

by Scrappy the Scapegoat on Dec 16, 2009 10:45 AM PST reply actions  

The Internet Charter

Decrees that a minimum of %20 of all communication via the World Wide Web will be useless. Scrappy’s just doing his part. I think his ID is perfect for this role.

by short on Dec 16, 2009 10:49 AM PST up reply actions  

Oops

Technically I was pointing out how Scrappy’s contributions are critical to survival of the Internet.

by short on Dec 16, 2009 10:53 AM PST up reply actions  

Stone Twitter

I’m hearing it’s NOT one of the Mariners’ prospects that failed the physical, and that deal is NOT going to unravel.

by ManifestDestiny on Dec 16, 2009 10:47 AM PST reply actions  

I like that Stone reports what he reads in this comment section

and then the comment section posts what it reads from Stone. And we all feel like we learned something.

by Attractive Nuisance on Dec 16, 2009 10:48 AM PST up reply actions  

In Stone We Trust

Say it with me: Washington Capitals. Capitals.
Preserved In All His Greatness - R.I.P. The Reignman 1989 to 1997

by JLProck on Dec 16, 2009 10:51 AM PST reply actions  

Taylor had an injury

So they probably had him take one

by Brian Floyd on Dec 16, 2009 10:55 AM PST up reply actions  

Makes sense

But several people were saying Taylor didn’t have to take a physical at MLBTraderumors, wasn’t sure if that was true.

by MattPD on Dec 16, 2009 10:56 AM PST up reply actions  

Well everything is speculation at this point

I don’t know why people hate MLBTraderumors, they give you links to all RUMORS and people get mad when the RUMORS don’t become reality. It’s a rumor site.

by MattPD on Dec 16, 2009 11:01 AM PST up reply actions  

That's why a lot of people here hate it

because it’s nothing but rumors that get thrown to the wall to see what sticks. This site generally shies away from unfounded rumors, these last couple threads notwithstanding.

by pdb on Dec 16, 2009 11:02 AM PST up reply actions  

What I'm saying is that lots of people make up rumors

yes, you’re completely right, MLBTraderumors isn’t that ridiculous because it gives you exactly what it says on the tin – trade rumors about MLB. On the other hand though, don’t treat those as fact and certainly don’t cite them as evidence to back up a “Michael Taylor didn’t have to take a physical” opinion.

by seattlebruin on Dec 16, 2009 11:03 AM PST up reply actions  

"Michael Taylor didn't have to take a physical"

Was not my quote, I asked a question if he had to take a physical, so no need to twist words. I

by MattPD on Dec 16, 2009 11:06 AM PST up reply actions  

I know

But you said don’t treat it as fact. Well of course you don’t treat it as fact, which is why I asked a question about it. Thats all.

by MattPD on Dec 16, 2009 11:09 AM PST up reply actions  

Todd Zolecki, reporter in Philly:

bq Failed physical won’t kill this deal. An announcement is still expected today bq.

by ManifestDestiny on Dec 16, 2009 11:33 AM PST reply actions  

YES YES YES

YES!

PS – Just click the quotes for blockquote

by seattlesundevil on Dec 16, 2009 11:34 AM PST up reply actions  

Woo

My Mariners blog - SodoMojo, Twitter Feed, Fuck the fucking Angels!

by gregrabble on Dec 16, 2009 11:35 AM PST up reply actions  

Hot off the, erm, press from MLBtraderumors
1:31pm: Jeff Blair of the Globe and Mail heard that the report of a failed physical is a “totally false rumour.”

Link

by Decatur on Dec 16, 2009 11:36 AM PST up reply actions  

Jeff Blair tweets
Well-placed baseball source on failed physical reports involving a player coming to the Jays? “Totally false rumour.”

by seattlesundevil on Dec 16, 2009 11:35 AM PST reply actions  

IT IS OFFICIAL!!!!!

WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

FUCK YOU BOB ELLIOT!

by seattlesundevil on Dec 16, 2009 11:36 AM PST reply actions  

YES!!

My Mariners blog - SodoMojo, Twitter Feed, Fuck the fucking Angels!

by gregrabble on Dec 16, 2009 11:37 AM PST reply actions  

Now does Bob Elliot get fired?

At least he needs to have his twitter revoked.

by seattlesundevil on Dec 16, 2009 11:37 AM PST reply actions  

Well it was fun losing our shit for a few hours

I totally didnt need to do anything at work today

De Gutibus non disputandum est

by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 16, 2009 11:38 AM PST reply actions  

Stupid Canadians reporters.

Cliff Lee

Racer X. You have to love those amarillo hops.

p.s. fuck you angels

by InSpokane on Dec 16, 2009 11:39 AM PST reply actions  

FUCK YES!

Really incredible work by GMZ

by spikefriedman on Dec 16, 2009 11:43 AM PST reply actions  

More good news piling on: Gordon Edes doesn't think Beltre will be a member of the Boston Red Sox.

Twitter:

Don’t expect Beltre or Holliday either. Kotchman likely to open season at first, Youkilis at 3d. Not etched in stone, but it looks that way.

LINK

by BrettJMiller on Dec 16, 2009 11:43 AM PST reply actions  

I think the Angels are sold on Woods.

I hope, anyway.

Say it with me: Washington Capitals. Capitals.
Preserved In All His Greatness - R.I.P. The Reignman 1989 to 1997

by JLProck on Dec 16, 2009 11:48 AM PST up reply actions  

It's funny.

They’re saying we don’t have shit after Felix and CLIFF FUCKING LEE. I’m wondering how their pitching staff is going to do this year.

Say it with me: Washington Capitals. Capitals.
Preserved In All His Greatness - R.I.P. The Reignman 1989 to 1997

by JLProck on Dec 16, 2009 11:51 AM PST up reply actions  

I'm not 100% sure that's good news.

I for one would much rather see Beltre in Boston than Anaheim.

by Johnny Slick on Dec 16, 2009 11:59 AM PST via mobile up reply actions  

The Lee/Felix combo will be awesome for 1 yr

But a Felix/Lincecum still gives me nightmares, my goodness

by MagicMike23 on Dec 16, 2009 11:44 AM PST reply actions  

Worthwhile comment

My Mariners blog - SodoMojo, Twitter Feed, Fuck the fucking Angels!

by gregrabble on Dec 16, 2009 11:45 AM PST up reply actions  

I hope to fucking Christ this isn't a reference to taking Morrow over Lincecum.

Because it it is… oooooooooooOOOOOOH!

Say it with me: Washington Capitals. Capitals.
Preserved In All His Greatness - R.I.P. The Reignman 1989 to 1997

by JLProck on Dec 16, 2009 11:45 AM PST up reply actions  

The balls.

I’m sure Jack has a massive pair of balls. Good place to start.

Say it with me: Washington Capitals. Capitals.
Preserved In All His Greatness - R.I.P. The Reignman 1989 to 1997

by JLProck on Dec 16, 2009 11:46 AM PST up reply actions  

Yeah, fuck the Angels!

Say it with me: Washington Capitals. Capitals.
Preserved In All His Greatness - R.I.P. The Reignman 1989 to 1997

by JLProck on Dec 16, 2009 11:47 AM PST up reply actions  

They're in denile

This kinda reminds me of 2004. Our guys just died, they signed Colon and Vlad, etc. Figgins might not be Vlad but dammit let me find parallels!

Carlos Silvelite

by OceanBird on Dec 16, 2009 11:48 AM PST up reply actions  

Sorry, couldn't resist.

Love Mark Twain.

De Gutibus non disputandum est

by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 16, 2009 11:49 AM PST up reply actions  

I can't help but feel Zduriencik is happy this was a press release, because I can imagine him laughing in between these quotes.
“We are very excited to have Cliff Lee on-board in the Seattle organization,” Mariners GM Jack Zduriencik said in a written release. "It goes without saying what a quality pitcher and competitor he is and what he will mean to our ballclub and organization.

“I also want to congratulate Philadelphia and Toronto on how this whole deal was handled. We gave up three very nice prospects to Philadelphia. I think they will be a nice piece of the Phillies future, and I want to thank Tyson, Phillippe and JC, and let them know we’ll be rooting for them as they progress towards the Majors. It was not an easy decision for us, but we could not pass up the opportunity to add a pitcher a Lee’s ability to our Major League team.”

Per Baker

by BrettJMiller on Dec 16, 2009 11:55 AM PST reply actions  

Awesome

“And… don’t let the door hit you on the way out…”

by hcoguy on Dec 16, 2009 11:56 AM PST up reply actions  

Jack Z is a class act.

Deals like this get done because he is easy to work with.

by Wilder. on Dec 16, 2009 11:57 AM PST up reply actions  

In fewer words, yes.

But not as genuine as this:

I think they will be a nice piece of the Phillies future, and I want to thank Tyson, Phillippe and JC, and let them know we’ll be rooting for them as they progress towards the Majors.

by Wilder. on Dec 16, 2009 11:59 AM PST up reply actions  

Reading and listening to some of the things Jack has said, he really is a good guy and a person easy to work with.

He’s not looking to “win” a trade. He’s looking to make a fair deal and hope both sides come out happy. This quote supports that effort.

The best part is, this kind of stuff opens doors for bigger and better deals. I love Jack.

by Wilder. on Dec 16, 2009 12:03 PM PST up reply actions  

I think he's looking to win the trade.

He just doesn’t want the other team to know he’s raping them.

by BrettJMiller on Dec 16, 2009 12:09 PM PST up reply actions  

What do you expect him to tell the media?

“I want to give away as little as I can and get as much back as possible while making them think they got something good?” Of course he’s gonna say he’s giving up a substantial package, even if it’s not the case.

by BrettJMiller on Dec 16, 2009 12:26 PM PST up reply actions  

He was specifically asked what he looks for to win a trade.

He countered with the statement that he doesn’t look to win a trade. Most other people wouldn’t go out of their way to make that point.

Jack seems genuine and I’ll leave it at that.

by Wilder. on Dec 16, 2009 12:29 PM PST up reply actions  

There's some benefit to this.

GMs are a fraternity. If you develop a reputation of screwing over everyone you trade with, people stop wanting to trade with you. This has happened to some extent with KP of the Trail Blazers who developed a rep for “Pritchslapping” trade partners.

Keeping a good relationship with other GMs might mean you get to hear about teams looking for help in a trade (such as this one) before anyone else. As we just saw, that can be pretty valuable.

by PDXTai on Dec 16, 2009 12:27 PM PST up reply actions  

"I also want to congratulate Philadelphia and Toronto on how this whole deal was handled (SUCKERS!). We gave up three very nice prospects to Philadelphia. I think they will be a nice piece of the Phillies future (but they ain’t no CLIFF FUCKING LEE!), and I want to thank Tyson, Phillippe and JC, and let them know we’ll be rooting for them as they progress towards the Majors. It was not an easy decision for us, but we could not pass up the opportunity to add a pitcher a Lee’s ability to our Major League team (BITCHES!)."

Say it with me: Washington Capitals. Capitals.
Preserved In All His Greatness - R.I.P. The Reignman 1989 to 1997

by JLProck on Dec 16, 2009 11:57 AM PST up reply actions  

Shit, no subject line.

Sorry.

Say it with me: Washington Capitals. Capitals.
Preserved In All His Greatness - R.I.P. The Reignman 1989 to 1997

by JLProck on Dec 16, 2009 11:57 AM PST up reply actions  

Jack Z says:

: You guys have no idea how much wood I had while writing that.

Fans are typically idiots.

by The Typical Idiot Fan on Dec 16, 2009 7:14 PM PST up reply actions  

Cliff Lee doesn't hit dingers, though.

Say it with me: Washington Capitals. Capitals.
Preserved In All His Greatness - R.I.P. The Reignman 1989 to 1997

by JLProck on Dec 16, 2009 12:01 PM PST up reply actions  

He can't, he's left-handed.

"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett http://mvn.com/marinersminors/

by JY on Dec 16, 2009 12:02 PM PST up reply actions   1 recs

Add Adam Jones, Chris Tillman, et al., to the list.

Maybe we wouldn’t have traded for Guti, but Jack would have had much more ammunition to upgrade everywhere else.

by Wilder. on Dec 16, 2009 12:26 PM PST up reply actions  

I'd keep Tillman.

That rotation would be fearsome.

"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett http://mvn.com/marinersminors/

by JY on Dec 16, 2009 12:28 PM PST up reply actions  

For sure.

But it would make Morrow that much more movable. We could sit here all day fantasizing the moves Jack would make if Bavasi didn’t pillage our system. It’s remarkable what he has done with what we had. I can’t wait for another 2-3 years of drafting players and see Jack working at full capacity.

by Wilder. on Dec 16, 2009 12:33 PM PST up reply actions  

Small sample size warnings should apply.

I wonder if you could construct a “Wins Above Average GM” stat? It would just measure wins going in vs going out plus some adjustments for draft picks and cash. You might have to assume that trades are a zero sum game, or you could try to adjust for win-win and lose-lose trades by hand. I think if you were to do this, Jack Z and Co. would lead the league for the last two years.

That said, the “stop looking at your spreadsheets and actually watch a trade” eye test says that we’re doing pretty darn good.

by PDXTai on Dec 16, 2009 12:24 PM PST up reply actions  

Awesome done deal.

Now onto some offense, AGon would be my wet dream. I’ m nore than willing to give up Saunders + for him.
Ihave still major concerns about the offense when there is still inexperience at C/LF plus low OBP of Lopez, wilson, still an unknown situation at 1b (unless Branyan resigns), and Griffey in the lineup. At least need 2 more allstar level hitters minimum. AGon + Holliday/Bay makes us AL West Front runners, possibly even World Series contenders

by MagicMike23 on Dec 16, 2009 12:44 PM PST reply actions  

Here's a serious question

Why “allstar level” hitters? Why not just rock solid producers?

by pdb on Dec 16, 2009 1:04 PM PST up reply actions  

I (stupidly) checked out some of the comments on the ESPN story,

and there are Phillies fans who are legitimately pissed to be getting Roy Halladay — not because they don’t like the whole downgrade-in-prospects thing, but because he doesn’t have nearly as much playoff experience as Cliff Lee and has played for a losing team his whole life.

Cliff Lee has been to the playoffs once — a few months ago. Thank God the Phillies didn’t trade for perennial loser Cliff Lee.

by Teej on Dec 16, 2009 1:16 PM PST up reply actions  

Red Sox are pushing for AGon

Supposedly building a deal around Ellsbury/Buzholz, we cant let this happen.

Saunders, Triunfel, Morrow IMO beats that offer.
Ellsbury and his 1.9 WAR value makes me laugh

by MagicMike23 on Dec 16, 2009 12:50 PM PST reply actions  

Turns out there was a medical issue, but it really had nothing to do with the larger trade. Rotoworld:
Blue Jays acquired 1B-3B Brett Wallace from the Athletics for OF Michael Taylor.
It turns out that an MRI on Wallace’s shoulder was the hold-up on the deal, but everything eventually checked out. It’s curious that the Athletics would give up on him, but it’s probably an acknowledgment that he’s bound to play first base or be a designated hitter in the long-term. Wallace, 23, was actually originally drafted by Toronto in 2005, but went to college and signed with the Cardinals after being drafted in the first-round in 2008. Wallace has a .305/.384/.475 line over his first two professional seasons, reaching as high as Triple-A last season. Using Wallace at first base could be one possibility should the Jays trade Lyle Overbay this winter.

All Hail Zduriencik!

by Goose on Dec 16, 2009 2:06 PM PST reply actions  

OF COURSE IT WAS OAKLAND'S FAULT!

Should have known. Bastards!

Fans are typically idiots.

by The Typical Idiot Fan on Dec 16, 2009 7:17 PM PST up reply actions  

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