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Around SBN: 2011 In Extreme Home Runs

On The Ryan Langerhans Non-Tender

I'm back. Yay. Stupid Harden.

So Ryan Langerhans was non-tendered today, opening up a 40-man spot and making him a free agent. As a free agent, he's free to negotiate with anyone, including the Mariners, but there's not a lot of playing time around here to be had, making his return a slim possibility. Langerhans is almost 30 years old. If he wants to have any kind of Major League job security, he's going to need to go somewhere that can promise him a little more action. I don't know if he'll find that opportunity, mind you, but the Mariners certainly can't provide it. So.

For those who understand the kind of value Langerhans can provide off the bench, this is a bit of an unfortunate move, but it essentially became a necessary one when Griffey re-signed. With Michael Saunders, Franklin Gutierrez, and Ichiro locked into the starting spots and Bill Hall available as the utility guy, Langerhans was already in a bind, but assuming a 12-man pitching staff, Griffey took away the last possible roster spot. The M's could've opted to cut Hall, of course, but given Hall's additional flexibility, handedness, potential to rebound, and the fact that dropping Langerhans is free, it wasn't a difficult decision. Langerhans ended up a neat player on the wrong team.

While there is obviously a number of different factors in play here, it is kind of sad to know that Langerhans was non-tendered by the one organization most likely to see him for all of his value. This front office - a front office that's become synonymous with run prevention - got him for a reason, and even with everything else, it can't be a good sign that even they couldn't find him a role. But then, Langerhans has received significant big league playing time in each of the last five seasons, so it's not like he won't find a job. This is just one of those depressing things that's going to make him anxious every night when he goes to bed until he gets a contract.

Realistically, losing Ryan Langerhans barely hurts us, as he's not a great player. It's always been more about what Langerhans represents than who he is specifically. That said, the day of his acquisition went to show how far this organization has come in such a short time, so his non-tender is most definitely a bittersweet occasion. For all of his faults, most of us liked Ryan Langerhans, and are sad to see him go. But if nothing else, it was because of Ryan that I found myself one August night standing in the middle of a bar hugging like five other dudes, and I will always cherish that memory. Best of luck to you going forward, Ryan. Your walkoffs were awesome. Yours will forever be the jersey I most wanted to have but couldn't bring myself to buy.

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Should he expect a call from Dayton Moore?

2009 Safeco Field Record: 6-0 ; Overall Safeco Field Record: 10-4

by Fin on Dec 12, 2009 10:38 PM PST reply actions  

Maybe he could take over for Billy Butler at first.

I mean, if he’s way out of position he might just suck enough for Kansas City.

by Johnny Slick on Dec 13, 2009 12:15 AM PST up reply actions  

I call a foul for piling on!!!

Dayton Moore wouldn’t be that stupid. But I wouldn’t put it past him to sign Langerhans, then trade him straight up for Aaron Rowand.

by Steve Nelson on Dec 13, 2009 7:16 PM PST up reply actions  

Being at that game against Tampa Bay.

I will miss him. Maybe not great but that walkoff gave him a place in my baseball heart.

Also a die-hard Hawks fan.

by Hopefulmsfan on Dec 12, 2009 11:57 PM PST reply actions  

That was one of the best games I've ever seen in the flesh.

I’ll be remembering him for awhile. This move will make me hate Griffey this season.

by MT Olson on Dec 13, 2009 12:33 PM PST up reply actions  

Okay, so I feel this is the type of move that makes me question a front office.

The acquisition of Ryan Langerhans was brilliant. I felt that it was one of the many indications that the Mariners valued important things, like above average defense, OBP, flexibility, left-handed hitting, e.t.c.

For me, bringing Griffey back was, in many ways, the complete opposite of that. But I felt that I could sorta rationalize it as long as the Mariners continued to acquire guys like Ryan Langerhans. So, this was sort of the litmus test for me. Would a 40-year old, oft-injured Ken Griffey Jr. with zero defensive value whatsoever push Ryan Langerhans off the 25-man roster?

It’s not like I believe the loss of Langerhans is going to have a huge impact or anything, but I had this faith that the new FO wouldn’t put so much value on clubhouse chemistry, and lean more towards maximizing talent on the roster. Sure, we could replace Langerhans with someone better, but that still means Griffey is getting paid to just sit on a bench. So, yeah, I guess I’m a slightly disappointed.

by JLC on Dec 13, 2009 12:24 AM PST reply actions  

Realistically I just don't think the M's had much of a choice

They couldn’t force Griffey into retirement, and if he wanted to come back, it would make them look all sorts of awkward to let him go somewhere else.

by Jeff Sullivan on Dec 13, 2009 12:25 AM PST up reply actions  

But from what Griffey's been quoted as saying

The decision was entirely in the hands of the Mariners. Obviously, he wanted to come back, but I don’t think Griffey makes a scene if the Mariners tell him they’re not offering him a contract. I can’t fathom another team offering him a contract – Griffey obviously wouldn’t except a minor league contract – and Griffey loves his family, so the Mariners have a perfect out.

Of course, this is all supposition. But I really don’t feel that Griffey wanted a lot playing time in 2010. I feel that he just wanted to be part of the clubhouse and wanted one last shot at the ring. The problem is that he’s always going to want that, and at some point the Mariners are going to be forced to cut him loose. What happens if the Mariners get close again next year? Another guaranteed spot on the roster for Ken? Griffey has to accept the inevitable at some point, and why that couldn’t be this year as opposed to next year really doesn’t seem evident to me.

I suppose, like most players, Griffey is choosing to have baseball beat him into retirement.

by JLC on Dec 13, 2009 12:46 AM PST up reply actions  

It's also possible that they deam the value of Griffey,

when you include his impact on the rest of the team, to be greater than Langerhans’ on field value. Remember, they would only be a sub/pinch hitter, so the difference between the two in on field value can only be so much. However a “presence” like Griffey wouldn’t need playing time to have an effect.

by vivaelpujols on Dec 13, 2009 7:53 AM PST up reply actions  

It's...

a really low impact move. The organization clearly gets it in the important respects.

It’d be one thing if keeping Griffey meant there would be no roster spot for an impact player. The team gave a small contract to a guy who will bring casual fans to the ballpark and who everyone loves in the clubhouse. If we were paying Griffey $10 million and guaranteeing him a starting job, this move would be a reason to question the front office. As it is, there’s like half a win’s worth of downside from a roster construction standpoint.

When Zduriencik cripples the team’s flexibility by locking up a roster spot for years on a player with league average upside and below-replacement-level downside (like, say, Jose Vidro), you can start questioning the front office. A cheap one-year deal to bring back the most popular Seattle Mariner of all time in a bench role is striking a balance between maintaining competitiveness and reaching out to casual fans. As long as the sacrifice to the competitiveness is extremely minimal (which it is here), I’m fine with it.

by slamcactus on Dec 13, 2009 12:18 PM PST up reply actions  

Maybe...

but only a little bit at most.

by slamcactus on Dec 13, 2009 2:02 PM PST up reply actions  

I don't know

We all have our off-season strictly stat hats on right now, but Griffey was a huge reason that team was so fun to watch last year. Statistically, it’s far from the best move we can make, I think Griffey is the only exception where I’m OK with that.

by edddgar on Dec 13, 2009 5:03 PM PST up reply actions  

Other people certainly have different opinions and that's cool

but Griffey was not a huge reason that the team was so fun for me to watch last year, and his being on the team really fucking annoys me.

by Aaron Campeau on Dec 13, 2009 5:38 PM PST up reply actions  

I have to agree with acblue here.

The value that Langerhans would’ve brought to the team on the field would be more than enough to compensate for anything Griffey brings in the clubhouse.

Say it with me: Washington Capitals. Capitals.
Preserved In All His Greatness - R.I.P. The Reignman 1989 to 1997

by JLProck on Dec 13, 2009 6:33 PM PST up reply actions  

And I'm not really that big on nostalgia, so Griffey had little to do with me enjoying the team last year.

Most of my joy was derived from Ichiro, Gutierrez, and Branyan, and… would you look at that! They all produced on the field!

Say it with me: Washington Capitals. Capitals.
Preserved In All His Greatness - R.I.P. The Reignman 1989 to 1997

by JLProck on Dec 13, 2009 6:35 PM PST up reply actions  

I didn't find Griffey fun at all

Clearly if you did find him fun, bringing him back is no big deal.

Personally, I found Ryan Langerhans fun.

by Graham MacAree on Dec 13, 2009 6:42 PM PST up reply actions  

Watching Griffey be a below average player wasn't very fun for me, either

I get that a lot of people like him, but I would have preferred to have Langerhans around as injury insurance.

It’s not a huge deal but it is the less ideal option.

by Gihyou on Dec 13, 2009 9:00 PM PST up reply actions  

If non tendering Langerhans is the most annoying thing about this offseason.

I think we’re ok.

Hard work never killed nobody, but I won't take my chances.

by JAH on Dec 13, 2009 7:32 PM PST up reply actions  

That's true.

But this is more along the lines of stubbing ones toe rather than being mauled by a velociraptor

Hard work never killed nobody, but I won't take my chances.

by JAH on Dec 13, 2009 9:56 PM PST up reply actions  

Here's what I worry about.

What happens when Griffey doesn’t want to retire after next year, either? Or the year after that?

How long are we committed to wasting a roster spot on nostalgia?

by Jeff Nye on Dec 13, 2009 12:53 PM PST up reply actions  

I personally don't think this is even possible.

Remember last year when we went after Griffey there was a ton of discussion about how much time he’ll play on the field?

Now, with the return of Griffey, the biggest issue is that he takes up a roster spot. We’re pretty confident that his playing time will be managed accordingly.

I honestly don’t see Griffey playing after 2010.

by ThundaPC on Dec 13, 2009 2:11 PM PST up reply actions  

Maybe the front office will

start scheduling some “Griffey Appreciation Nights” and “Griffey Retirement Parties” toward the end of the season so he gets the hint.

by FlaskInSafeco on Dec 14, 2009 9:10 AM PST up reply actions  

I know a lot of people are going to miss Langerhans and would rather have him over Griffey

but if it’s any consolation, the reason JackZ brought Griffey back was to give himself a challenge. Having one less roster space makes him even more of a tuff guy.

by 200tang on Dec 13, 2009 12:27 AM PST reply actions  

It's only gay if there are even numbers

If you can’t pair off, it’s totally hetero. That’s why I always say if you’re going to have a late night pillow fight with your bff, always bring a buddy along.

...and now I'm here

by CapSea on Dec 13, 2009 3:54 AM PST up reply actions  

This was a surprise.

Strolling around SBN, I found this quote on AA(Mets) under a post similar to the trash heap diary:

Ryan Langerhans—The Mariners replaced Endy Chavez with Ryan Langerhans and the Mariners are smart, so let’s do that too. Good BB% and decent power make for a league-average hitter with tremendous defensive ability.

I’m not sure whether I’m more surprised that someone thinks the M’s are smart or that I’m pretty sure only last year AA was one of the dumbest, anti-stat blogs in SBN. These might be two sides of the same coin.

It's hard to convince people to let you eat them if you're an asshole. - Thingray

by Faux on Dec 13, 2009 4:00 AM PST reply actions  

One could make a halfway decent outfield out of non-tendered ex-Braves

Kelly Johnson — LF, Langerhans — CF, Ryan Church —RF

#Langerhans needs to be trending on Twitter. Ryan Langerhans Fact: He’s built like Adam Dunn, but hits and fields like Endy Chavez. Langerhans rules.

I'm not a sabermetrician, but I do play one at FanGraphs.

Can't get enough of me? Check out my Twitter feed.

by Matt Klaassen on Dec 13, 2009 8:26 AM PST reply actions  

Matt - I know you're really trying to get the #RyanLangerhansFacts Twitter feed to go ....

… but I think you just need to accept it isn’t going to go viral like #JasonKendallFacts did. Now, if you could get Keith Law tweeting it might get some legs …

by Steve Nelson on Dec 13, 2009 7:21 PM PST up reply actions  

I was at both walk-offs

They were awesome. Fair sailing, friend.

Mariners/D Broncos/BSU Broncos fan in Seattle

by appleshampoo on Dec 13, 2009 11:06 PM PST reply actions  

Heh

You could pretty easily substitute Gabe Gross’s name for Langerhans’s and write the exact same article.

Bad Left Hook - The SB Nation boxing blog
"Baseball is played on the field, not on a calculator."

by Brickhaus on Dec 14, 2009 11:09 PM PST reply actions  

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