Daily Rumor Open Thread IV
by msb on Dec 10, 2009 7:56 AM PST
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Printre: yesterdays news ...
Larry Stone says "Detroit general manager Dave Dombrowski explained why he settled on the Yankees and Diamondbacks as his trading partners ... "At times, there were a couple of situations that might have happened. I think the phone calls to me were much more on a persistent basis, because really, when you looked at it, there were only a few places that really satisfied what we needed. And it kept coming back to this situation, which we felt was the best one for us. Even though at times it looked like, well, this might not work, we might have to switch off...I really didn't want to give this one up, because we felt it was the one situation that kept coming back to giving us that young starter and that young center fielder, and also giving us additional pieces to the deal."
The Mariners didn't have the center fielder, and while Brandon Morrow was certainly discussed, the Mariners appeared to be reluctant to give up the bulk in pitching prospects (Josh Fields, Phillippe Aumont, Shawn Kelley) that the Tigers were seeking. And the Tigers were looking for players that would help them in 2010.
and Geoff Baker on Harden:
"Players and clubs are going to market and feel about players differently," Zduriencik said. "And some clubs will pay a player certain dollars and other clubs won't. It's the world you live in." Zduriencik was speaking in general terms and did not even officially confirm he'd offered Harden a deal. But sources had indicated the Mariners were hesitant about accelerator clauses Harden's camp had asked for, leading to his selection of the Rangers.
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Now that we have failed to sign Harden, where do we go from here? The rest of the FA starters look dodgy.
Indeed apart from Johnson, who else on the FA market do we actually want?
I think we are going to have to make some trades if we want to contend in 2010, particularly with the Rangers and Angels looking so strong.
Big Unit!
I will smash your face into a jelly.
by Phil Hatzenbuehler on Dec 10, 2009 8:12 AM PST up reply actions
Accelerator clauses?
Harden wants to do particle physics?
"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett http://mvn.com/marinersminors/
Large Harden Collider
I will smash your face into a jelly.
by Phil Hatzenbuehler on Dec 10, 2009 8:12 AM PST up reply actions 9 recs
Wish we knew what those clauses were exactly
I don’t know much about contractual mumbo jumbo but an accelerator clause basically means he can raise his price if we fail to meet a certain condition right? I don’t really get how it applies to baseball contracts.
Oh hey the M's are in on Adrian Gonzalez again.
Neat. Link here.
by ManifestDestiny on Dec 10, 2009 8:50 AM PST reply actions
Morrow/one of Fields and Aumont/Triunfel/2 lesser prospects probably
by ManifestDestiny on Dec 10, 2009 9:06 AM PST up reply actions
Gotta try to trade Lopez in that deal
by Graham MacAree on Dec 10, 2009 9:07 AM PST up reply actions
And then SB could just buy tickets on the first deck of Western Metal Supply and catch every single homer.
I think everyone wins here.
He's been asking for that surgery for years.
by abender20 on Dec 10, 2009 9:25 AM PST up reply actions 7 recs
Subtle?
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 11, 2009 6:26 AM PST up reply actions
Full article talks about Halladay as well..
by seattlesundevil on Dec 10, 2009 9:04 AM PST up reply actions
Just get both, sign them and Felix to 6-year deals, and call it an offseason.
Oh dang, just checked and we’re not named the Yankees.
Mariners should try that then sign Holliday
Boom! Insta offence
by Graham MacAree on Dec 10, 2009 9:07 AM PST up reply actions
Joey Gathright, duh!
BrockandSalk: My favorite headline of the Winter Meetings: Joey Gathright Remains Unsigned. Um, won’t that be true every day for a few months?
The impression I'm getting is that this is hot air
by Graham MacAree on Dec 10, 2009 9:19 AM PST up reply actions
I realize Holliday makes him redundant, but I like Saunders and don't want to see him go.
Especially so since I don’t love any of the outfield depth in the system within the next few years.
You don't like Ackley in terms of OF depth?
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 10, 2009 9:34 AM PST up reply actions
Certainly, and I'm not discounting that.
I’m just hoping he IS the second baseman.
He also has 80 speed.
Which means that he can stretch ordinary doubles into triples. He still might not hit enough though.
"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett http://mvn.com/marinersminors/
by JY on Dec 10, 2009 9:45 AM PST up reply actions
Seems to have good plate discipline.
But that could also be a factor of pitchers being terrible at that level.
We'll see.
Years ago, he would have been a top CF prospect with his talent, but these days his skillset is closer to a 4th OF on a contender. I think he actually could start though, and the M’s are convinced he has more power than he’s showing.
"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett http://mvn.com/marinersminors/
by JY on Dec 10, 2009 9:50 AM PST up reply actions
I don't know a whole lot about what tools transition well
but Cameron likes to point out that patience in the minors generally requires a certain amount of power to keep major league pitchers out of the zone.
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 10, 2009 9:51 AM PST up reply actions
Yep
You have to be able to hit strikes as well as know the difference between balls and strikes
by Graham MacAree on Dec 10, 2009 9:52 AM PST up reply actions
Tell that to Desmond Figgins.
I can see that, though. Will be interesting to see how Gillies develops. He is already behind a little when you consider his age (21, A+ ball his highest level). At least we don’t need to rush him.
Figgins is a mystery to me
maybe its because he’s so small… I dunno. I also don’t really expect him to exceed a 10% BB rate (compared to I think 16% last season).
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 10, 2009 10:06 AM PST up reply actions
Ah, yes
a lefty MIF would be very nice to have, and it seems he won’t have enough bat to be a star COF in any case. Buf if depth is your concern, Figgins, Hall, Ackley, Langerhans, etc etc seems alright. Ryan Church is out there too, waiting for his 2/5 deal.
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 10, 2009 9:37 AM PST up reply actions
I got that.
But the 25 man is part of the organization and is becoming flexible enough that depth in the infield can compensate for lack of depth in the outfield.
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 10, 2009 9:43 AM PST up reply actions
"seems he won’t have enough bat to be a star COF in any case."
I wouldn’t put money on that one. Ackley is the best pure hitter out of the draft in a long, long time.
by Graham MacAree on Dec 10, 2009 9:39 AM PST up reply actions
Really? I thought his projected ceiling was Erstad
which is great in CF but not enough thump to be an amazing corner. Not that I’m against Ackley developing into a Holliday, he just seems to small for it.
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 10, 2009 9:41 AM PST up reply actions
Early Erstad.
Not to be confused with career Erstad
"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett http://mvn.com/marinersminors/
by JY on Dec 10, 2009 9:42 AM PST up reply actions
His ceiling is winning multiple batting titles with 20HR/year
Let’s not sell the guy short
by Graham MacAree on Dec 10, 2009 9:42 AM PST up reply actions
But Strassburg struck him out in the AFL so hes a bust
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 10, 2009 9:45 AM PST up reply actions
Able to walk again, finally.
Knee surgery is a bitch
"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett http://mvn.com/marinersminors/
by JY on Dec 10, 2009 9:41 AM PST up reply actions
He reads the ball well, but his speed is not good.
"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett http://mvn.com/marinersminors/
by JY on Dec 10, 2009 9:42 AM PST up reply actions
Below-average, before knee surgery.
He was considered a guy you could pass out there before. Now, I don’t know.
"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett http://mvn.com/marinersminors/
by JY on Dec 10, 2009 9:47 AM PST up reply actions
Basically.
He was average before and is probably below that now.
"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett http://mvn.com/marinersminors/
by JY on Dec 10, 2009 9:49 AM PST up reply actions
Similar....
Raben’s left-handed, obviously, and more proficient at hitting for power, but Poythress is no less physically strong, which means he could show more power later, and will likely hit for a better average. They’re probably about equal defenders at first, depending on Raben’s knees.
"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett http://mvn.com/marinersminors/
by JY on Dec 10, 2009 9:56 AM PST up reply actions
Oh I thought Poythress already had a power swing
I remember reading that he was, in fact, the best pure hitter int he draft, but a righty and without a position on the diamond therefore less valuable than Ackley.
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 10, 2009 10:08 AM PST up reply actions
Poythress was the top college power bat in the draft
by Graham MacAree on Dec 10, 2009 10:08 AM PST up reply actions
POYTHRESS YES!
Indeed, he definitely was the top power bat in the draft. He’s not going to wow anyone with his glove or his basepath speed.
I thought he had more power than Raben. I don’t know the differences between the SEC and ACC w/r/t park factors and league quality, but Raben’s SLGs were .486/.514/.520 respectively w/Miami, and Poythress’s were .410/.626/.764 respectively w/Georgia. In his brief stint at W. Tenn last year, Poythress’s SLG was Bloomquistrian. And Raben’s 2008 SLG in Everett was .560. Personally, I’d say Poythress has a bit more pop than Raben (from what I’ve read), but I’d certainly defer to Mr. Yencich and others who pay far closer attention than I do.
SHOW FiFi THE MONEY!!!!
by PositivePaul on Dec 10, 2009 10:31 AM PST up reply actions
Not really.
BA didn’t mention him either in their talent rankings or our draft report card as being such. They describe him as an all-fields hitter who doesn’t pull the ball much despite his raw strength, and some wonder if he can turn on better fastballs. I’m high on him now, and he might actually be the best power hitter in our draft, but probably not the draft. Heck, BA liked Gordon Beckham better at Georgia.
"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett http://mvn.com/marinersminors/
Gordon Beckham wasn't in the same draft as Poythress
by Graham MacAree on Dec 10, 2009 10:44 AM PST up reply actions
But yeah, turns out I was wrong. Where'd I get that thing about Poythress from then?
by Graham MacAree on Dec 10, 2009 10:45 AM PST up reply actions
I don't know that you're wrong per se, it's just that
being the ‘top college power bat in the draft’ last year isn’t as noteworthy a feat as in other years.
Some concerns about bat speed, it looks like.
Still, Paul like him and that’s good enough for me. Esp. with Raben’s injury’s history, I’m glad we were able to get him at #51.
He's a big guy and hit 25 home runs last year?
I can’t fault you for thinking it, but I don’t know of anyone who views him as a traditional power hitter. I’m not saying I dislike him, or that I’ve formulated an opinion that directly contradicts that, I’m saying that’s the book on him at the moment.
And as Marc said, this wasn’t exactly a great draft for college power hitters in the first place, particularly considering the ’08 one. Holy crap that draft was loaded.
"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett http://mvn.com/marinersminors/
And yet Ackley was a better hitter than all of them :D
by Graham MacAree on Dec 10, 2009 11:10 AM PST up reply actions
Yep.
But hey – Poythress’s 1237 OPS in the SEC is not something to sneeze at. Sure Ackley’s ACC was 1280 and college stats are real tricky, but it’s safe to say that the M’s got the two best college hitters in this year’s draft.
SHOW FiFi THE MONEY!!!!
by PositivePaul on Dec 10, 2009 11:16 AM PST up reply actions
*Ackley's OPS in the ACC was 1280
SHOW FiFi THE MONEY!!!!
by PositivePaul on Dec 10, 2009 11:17 AM PST up reply actions
According to KLAW
Best Power Hitter
Davidson Stassi were the best prep power hitters in the draft and Poythress was the best college power hitter in the draft.
SHOW FiFi THE MONEY!!!!
by PositivePaul on Dec 10, 2009 11:13 AM PST up reply actions
I'll give Dr. Klaw some credit.
I’m still not sold on Poythress being the best though.
"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett http://mvn.com/marinersminors/
Who else would it be?
Lots of glove guys, some gap power guys (Jackson) and one amazing pure hitter (Ackley).
I’m just not seeing who it would be OTHER than Poythress.
It could be that we’re talking about two different things – one is the guy with the best track record/results, and one is the guy that others think might end up with the best power numbers in pro ball with wood bats. Poythress, I’d think, is clearly the ‘best’ under the former definition, but there may be some questions about his ability to retain the top spot under the latter definition.
Well, it would mean having another Adrian to holler for...
and he & Guti could bat their eyelashes at each other.
Am I the only one who thinks that Gonzalez might not be the best fit for Safeco?
True, he’s left-handed, but he hits a lot of balls the other way. It seems like Safeco might make him lose a few home runs a year, while a typical lefty who tends to pull the ball would benefit. Obviously I’d still love to have him on the team, but it seems like the Mariners would benefit less from trading for him than a club with a home park that would be more conductive to his hitting profile.
by I Lick Squirrels on Dec 10, 2009 3:22 PM PST up reply actions
The gaps at Petco are murderous, and he still hits them over the wall.
His swing isn’t perfect for the stadium, but he’d still be awesome.
This is true, however,
he would probably have less value to the Mariners than to teams who play in stadiums that wouldn’t hurt his power so much. If one of these teams were to make the Padres an offer, the Mariners would have to match or exceed it in order to land him, which would amount to overpaying, even more than is normally required to land a marquee player.
by I Lick Squirrels on Dec 10, 2009 4:26 PM PST up reply actions
Ed Wade continues to build an arsenal the French would be jealous of.
Gary Majewski signs with the Astros.
He joins the fold of LaTroy Hawkins, Matt Lindstrom, and Brandon Lyon. Roy Corcoran was promoted to the big league roster, too.
It appears teams will fear the Astros bullpen so much that they will rather face the starters for nine innings. This is an unprecedented new strategy that will surely crown the Astros the 2010 World Champions.
I'm pretty sure Hawkins went to the Brewers.
by BrettJMiller on Dec 10, 2009 9:13 AM PST up reply actions
Damn, you're right.
I’m good at mixing up which team signed him and which team let him walk. Did you hear Figgins signed with the Angels?
No but I heard the Mariners signed Harden.
angels fan in seattle
by Eyebrows on Dec 10, 2009 9:43 AM PST via mobile up reply actions
Well, these winter meetings turned out to be pretty uninteresting from a Mariners perspective
I just hope we don’t have to wait till January for anything else big to happen
My Mariners blog - SodoMojo, Twitter Feed, Fuck the fucking Angels!
That would also work but Holliday is better
by Graham MacAree on Dec 10, 2009 9:24 AM PST up reply actions
And how does that differ from Griffey?
by nathaniel dawson on Dec 10, 2009 1:46 PM PST up reply actions
Ken Griffey Jr. is one of the best baseball players who ever lived
so there are some differences I think.
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 10, 2009 2:09 PM PST up reply actions
If only he would sit dejectedly holding his head in his left hand when his career tanks
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 10, 2009 10:09 AM PST up reply actions
Seconding this.
If the Red Sox have to eat ~$9mil of Lowell’s contract in a trade and THEN pay ~$10mil/year for Beltre, I wonder if that knocks them down to the second tier of LF’s (Cammy, Byrd…Nady?)
by ManifestDestiny on Dec 10, 2009 9:51 AM PST up reply actions
The Yankees are trying to cut payroll, plus they added Granderson
So I don’t see why they need to commit that much money to him
Yeah, I really haven't been following the national news outside of the winter meetings.
I was thinking of last year’s market, but if the Mets get Bay and the Yankees drop out, maybe a 5/80 to 5/90 is all it will take to get him.
Highly unlikely he goes to the Bronx
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 10, 2009 9:38 AM PST up reply actions
I don't. Too much Money.
Racer X. You have to love those amarillo hops.
p.s. fuck you angels
It would keep the Angels from taking our 1st-round pick.
So there’s a plus to go along with the player.
And it would go to the Cardinals, my 2nd-favorite NL team!
So yay again!
SHOW FiFi THE MONEY!!!!
by PositivePaul on Dec 10, 2009 10:37 AM PST up reply actions
I like Holliday, but he'd cost us the moon.
I’d rather sign Bay+.
Can't have Bay in left, forces you to use Saunders, can't trade Saunders for an upgrade somewhere else
by Graham MacAree on Dec 10, 2009 9:52 AM PST up reply actions
I'm not understanding why everyone is so anxious to sign a LFer/trade Saunders away.
We’re going to have him under team control throughout most of the next decade, and he projects to be at least league average after 2010. Why not focus on upgrading other parts of the club?
I'm not anxious to do it
But Holliday is better, would be under control for almost as long, and Saunders is a valuable trade chip. Bay closes doors.
by Graham MacAree on Dec 10, 2009 9:56 AM PST up reply actions
I see your point.
I suppose I would be fine with Holliday, although if we’re going to splurge on a youngish power hitter, I’d rather he be left handed.
Re: Saunders though, I would be disappointed if the team targeted one of the second tier left fielders (Cameron, Byrd, Nady) over offering Michael playing time.
Me too but that's not what I am suggesting
by Graham MacAree on Dec 10, 2009 10:02 AM PST up reply actions
Not saying you are.
It’s the reports I keep seeing that link the team to Mike Cameron. I have no tolerance for that.
Which forces you to use Saunders in left yes?
by Graham MacAree on Dec 10, 2009 10:02 AM PST up reply actions
We could always have Bill Hall out in left
by Dewey N on Dec 10, 2009 10:05 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
It's like you don't want this team to win
by Graham MacAree on Dec 10, 2009 10:06 AM PST up reply actions 2 recs
Honestly, the way this team is being built, the use of Griffey in any capacity terrifies me.
Nick Johnson, Jason Bay, Adrian Beltre, Matt Holliday – whoever we sign this offseason, it’s hard to imagine many instances next season when it will be worthwhile to start Griffey at DH.
I suppose he could pinch hit for Jack Wilson or the catcher in late-game situations, but that seems like an awfully specialized role.
Unless we sign none of those players
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 10, 2009 10:14 AM PST up reply actions
But he'd be worth it
and we have some mooney to spend.
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 10, 2009 9:52 AM PST up reply actions
This seems like it would be the best way to spend our money now
Sign Holliday and trade Saunders/Morrow/etc. for the pitcher we need.
I can kind of see a way for it to happen too. If more interest doesn’t arise in Bay elsewhere and he ends up heading back to Boston, we’d have a much better shot at getting Holliday for a not-insane price.
He’d still be really expensive but he’s a ~6 win player and he’s been worth more than 25mil a year the last 3 years.
Gammons said "I've heard the Mariners have offered Beltre three [years?] times nine [million?] to move Figgins to second base, not sure I believe that..."
But the word is out there I guess.
If that's true the Mariners have some Loafie trade candidates lined up
by Graham MacAree on Dec 10, 2009 9:34 AM PST up reply actions
Yeah you don't bring in Beltre
unless you are trading Lopez. There just isn’t a big enough gain between Lopez and Beltre in production to justify spending that much money unless you trade Lopez to fill another hole on the team.
by Edgar for Pres on Dec 10, 2009 9:45 AM PST up reply actions
Yeah so its not worth spending 12 million on beltre
to give you 2 WAR more than what you already get
by Edgar for Pres on Dec 10, 2009 11:19 AM PST up reply actions
The real question is
can you. I feel like if they would have gotten a nice offer he would have already been gone. I think we might overestimate what we can get for Lopez.
by Edgar for Pres on Dec 10, 2009 12:46 PM PST up reply actions
True
And we shouldn’t trade him if we don’t have a plan.
by Edgar for Pres on Dec 10, 2009 12:49 PM PST up reply actions
But he's a power hitting Second baseman. Do you know how hard those are to find?
Racer X. You have to love those amarillo hops.
p.s. fuck you angels
You can't always look to maximize value.
Especially as you get closer to contention.
by Aaron Campeau on Dec 10, 2009 7:07 PM PST up reply actions
Yes please.
Racer X. You have to love those amarillo hops.
p.s. fuck you angels
I'm really disappointed in how well Texas has done the last few days
Although I guess the Marlins saved them from themselves to some extent.
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 10, 2009 9:27 AM PST reply actions
I really don't understand how the Marlins said no to that.
by BrettJMiller on Dec 10, 2009 9:29 AM PST up reply actions
The reports seemed solid enough and its kinda their MO
Its only his first arb year anyhow
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 10, 2009 9:31 AM PST up reply actions
They never cease to amaze
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 10, 2009 9:30 AM PST up reply actions
Sounds like a samurai movie.
angels fan in seattle
by Eyebrows on Dec 10, 2009 9:46 AM PST via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
Paging Mr. Herman...Mr. Herman.
I will smash your face into a jelly.
by Phil Hatzenbuehler on Dec 10, 2009 10:35 AM PST up reply actions
According to MLB.com we got Kanekoa SEXeira
Determined, Jonesing Commentor | Proud proprietor of Wyomingroutes.org & Washingtonhighways.org
Ahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
Fangraphs fallout ahoy!
You'd think they'd want someone with such an awesome name to play.
But his name might be too foreign for Kansas City.
by Mariner John on Dec 10, 2009 11:32 AM PST up reply actions
I wonder what's happening with Sheets?
I haven’t heard anything about him.
A Mariners fan in Seattle
More lemon pledge, please.
I fucking hate you Mariners
by kentroyals5 on Dec 10, 2009 10:42 AM PST up reply actions
Family Guy is so awful these days.
A Mariners fan in Seattle
by Coach Owens on Dec 10, 2009 10:46 AM PST up reply actions
Basically, yes.
It’s horribly formulaic and sometimes it’s pretty obvious that they’re just transcribing some stupid conversation that the writers had and interjecting it with some cultural reference for spice.
"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett http://mvn.com/marinersminors/
Funny thing is I remember that sketch being funny.
Funny thing is Family Guy used to be funny, now they don’t even try. It’s the same fucking joke over and over again and I don’t understand why people haven’t turned on it.
When it came back, they started recycling their earlier one-offs.
I think that was the beginning of the end because it made what was already formulaic all the more predictable.
"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett http://mvn.com/marinersminors/
Greased-up deaf guy was the turning point for me.
"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett http://mvn.com/marinersminors/
Same with me. And there is something about Seth MacFarlane
that makes me want to punch him in his smug, smirking face. At least PBS has good shows on Sunday night.
The fact that they make and air The Cleveland Show makes me lose faith in humanity on a daily basis.
Watch "The Hammer", then tell me you don't respect Adam Carolla.
That movie is incredibly good.
I will smash your face into a jelly.
by Phil Hatzenbuehler on Dec 10, 2009 11:49 AM PST up reply actions
What is this based on?
The Man Show and Crankyankers?
by Mariner John on Dec 10, 2009 11:58 AM PST up reply actions
Thanks.
The Man Show, Love Line, and his FM radio show are not funny to me. I haven’t seen “The Hammer” and I got bored with crank calls when I was an early teen.
Meh, that's why sense of humor is subjective I guess.
I like his podcast and liked his radio show but I haven;t really been exposed to anything else (besides The Hammer).
by Mariner John on Dec 10, 2009 3:32 PM PST up reply actions
There were some good ones
and the fact that it was getting more out there was good for a time, but then it morphed into being 100% random bullshit, and when the “crazy stuff” is painfully predictable it’s just not funny anymore.
There's a 95% chance Salk doesn't know his ass from a hole in the ground
by lemonverbena on Dec 10, 2009 1:12 PM PST up reply actions
Wrong half of that show's hosting crew...
SHOW FiFi THE MONEY!!!!
by PositivePaul on Dec 10, 2009 1:26 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
It was so nice when their dad retired and other people started winning the SPSL
[DELETED ZOMG NO POLITICS]
No, it doesn't..
I can personally attest to that…
SHOW FiFi THE MONEY!!!!
by PositivePaul on Dec 10, 2009 3:12 PM PST up reply actions
They might be 3 years old, but they're credible!
I will smash your face into a jelly.
by Phil Hatzenbuehler on Dec 10, 2009 11:49 AM PST up reply actions
I don't expect them to talk, I expect them to die
by Graham MacAree on Dec 10, 2009 11:54 AM PST up reply actions 8 recs
They all do but it takes a while usually
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 10, 2009 12:04 PM PST up reply actions
Cubs still trying desperately to trade Milton Bradley
Cubs officials say they are “close” to trading outfielder Milton Bradley, with all indications saying he’ll be headed to the Rays, reports Bob Nightengale of USA Today.
Could it finally happen? We’ve heard reports of “imminent” and “close” involving Bradley before, only to have them fall through. That said, Tampa has made the most sense all along. It’s been rumored that Pat Burrell would head to Chicago to complete the trade, but Nightengale doesn’t name who the Cubs would receive in return. What he does say is that the Cubs would look to sign Mike Cameron or Marlon Byrd once they shed Bradley.
FUCK THE DBACKS!
How can they take the salary
if they’re also picking up Soriano? They’d have to lose Crawford I think.
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 10, 2009 12:05 PM PST up reply actions
The cubs are so desperate to rid themselves of Bradley
I’d guess they’d make up most of the difference in the salaries.
Cubs will likely eat a million or two per year and take on Burrell.
angels fan in seattle
by Eyebrows on Dec 10, 2009 12:11 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Oh I forgot about Burrell
Shit. I wanted Bradley here as a OF/DH.
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 10, 2009 12:16 PM PST up reply actions
Churchill's heard from 3 ML sources, including the Mets, that the M's and Mets are the two teams most in on Lackey.
Situation expected to be resolved within a week or two, Lackey may not demand 5 years. I don’t want to go in to too much detail since I don’t want to reveal all his “subscriber” content, but that’s an interesting part of it…
I don’t really want Lackey for even four years at his price, but he’d still improve our club and make it more fun to watch next year.
This makes sense to me
Who else would be in the market besides us and the Angels. Both the Yankees and Red Sox would probably rather trade for Halladay.
Angels supposedly aren't really in on Lackey...at this time.
by BrettJMiller on Dec 10, 2009 12:29 PM PST up reply actions
I would love to have Lackey if only to see how angry it would make the Angel fans.
A Mariners fan in Seattle
by Coach Owens on Dec 10, 2009 12:34 PM PST up reply actions
I'd love him at 4/50
Except I’d think of Carlos Silva every time I saw his contract and would die a little on the inside.
by arbeck77 on Dec 10, 2009 12:36 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
That and them getting defensive
Lackey was NEVER good.
Lackey has two, maybe three years left, but probably only one.
Ervin Santana had a fluke year last year and will easily replace Lackey!
Good, he was ugly!
Chone Figgins all over again.
Carlos Silvelite
What's not to like?
SHOW FiFi THE MONEY!!!!
by PositivePaul on Dec 10, 2009 3:20 PM PST up reply actions
I didn't know Chris Shelton was being converted to a reliever?
d_a_cameron
Chris Shelton won’t be back in Tacoma – signs with Astros. No confirmation on if Wade gave him $75 million yet.
FUCK THE DBACKS!
Boodrian. :(
I will smash your face into a jelly.
by Phil Hatzenbuehler on Dec 10, 2009 12:59 PM PST up reply actions
Go Mets Go!
Jon Heyman of SI.com reports that the Mets offered free agent outfielder Jason Bay a four-year contract worth roughly $65 million.
Bay turned down a similar contract from the Red Sox before hitting free agency, so the Mets would likely need to kick in another year to get a deal done. Interestingly, Heyman writes that the Mets didn’t want to get into “protracted talks” for Matt Holliday, who could make up to $100 million this winter. The Mets are confident that Bay’s pull-hitting style will translate to Citi Field, so it looks like they’ve finally made their preference known. Stay tuned.
FUCK THE DBACKS!
So if its between us and them for Lackey
If they get Bay do we get to royally piss off Angels fans?
Carlos Silvelite
That's just silly
may as well make it 3/15. I will be shocked if he signs for less than 16 per year average.
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 10, 2009 1:20 PM PST up reply actions
I just have a hard time seeing who gives him that much
I don’t think the Sox will. I don’t think the Mets will, especially if they sign Bay or Holliday. I don’t think the Yankees are going to do it either. Who else is going to spend any money?
Angels
Why not?
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 10, 2009 1:35 PM PST up reply actions
At realistic market prices anyway.
I’d rather spend that money on something less disconcerting.
I'm really torn on Lackey
If he’s not going to take less than a 5 year deal though, fuck that.
My Mariners blog - SodoMojo, Twitter Feed, Fuck the fucking Angels!
Hey, I know a right-handed extreme pull hitter who could be available...
Batted .393/.614/.464 for 2009 Diablos, #5 in OBP for PSSBL Rocky Division.
by Two Rs and Two Ls on Dec 10, 2009 1:25 PM PST up reply actions
No, Johjima went back to Japan.
angels fan in seattle
by Eyebrows on Dec 10, 2009 3:06 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
A blast from the past:
David Wells could have been given to the Yankees in what would wind up, no doubt, as the single most retarded trade in the history of professional sports:
The Baltimore Orioles got stronger yesterday — again. This time they did it at the expense of the Yankees, with whom they have had a monthlong competition for players in preparation for their seasonlong competition for the American League East championship next year.
The Orioles, adding their sixth new player in the past 10 days, acquired David Wells, a veteran left-handed starting pitcher, from the Cincinnati Reds for Curtis Goodwin, a promising young outfielder, and a minor league outfielder, Trovin Valdez.
….
The Yankees, who last Thursday beat Baltimore to David Cone, wanted Wells for their rotation, but a weekend bid by George Steinbrenner fell short. Given this latest turn of events, the Yankees may feel compelled to become serious about signing one of two free-agent left-handers, Kenny Rogers or Chuck Finley.
….
Jim Bowden, the Reds’ general manager, declined to discuss the Yankees’ involvement, but an official familiar with the Wells talks said Steinbrenner called Bowden Saturday night and offered pitcher Mariano Rivera and catcher Jorge Posada.
AHAHAHAHAHA
The Mariners are looking for starting pitchers, according to Jon Paul Morosi of FOX Sports. John Lackey, Doug Davis and Jarrod Washburn are all on Seattle’s list, according to Morosi.
http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/10502558
BRING BACK THE DOLPHIN!
angels fan in seattle
by Eyebrows on Dec 10, 2009 3:48 PM PST via mobile reply actions
Doug Davis?
Of all the starters we could be looking at, Doug Davis? Ha ha ha. Good to see Lackey and Wash on there.
I only took a short look at Davis's stats, what makes him better than Washburn?
I believe you, just curious as to why.
Honestly, Lackey is looking more and more likely
Seattle can sign him @ ~$18mil and have enough to sign Johnson. Still leaves a hole @ DH though, but with Lackey gone Z would maybe be more aggressive on trading Morrow for a cheap young bat (Gamel? Kai’ihue?)
by ManifestDestiny on Dec 10, 2009 7:24 PM PST up reply actions
$18M a year would be overpaying by a long shot
My Mariners blog - SodoMojo, Twitter Feed, Fuck the fucking Angels!
Anything over $13 million or so a year would be bad.
$18 million would be horrible.
Lets piss off Angels fans
Sign Lackey and Washburn, then bring in Glaus as a DH just to be safe. =/
Carlos Silvelite
And then win the world series.?
"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett http://mvn.com/marinersminors/
by JY on Dec 10, 2009 9:25 PM PST up reply actions
Zombie Nick Adenhart for the rotation!
by I Lick Squirrels on Dec 10, 2009 10:43 PM PST up reply actions
In my MLB 09 The Show RTTS mode, it's 2014 and Adenhart pitches for the Royals.
He’s currently 1-9 with an 8.63 ERA and I’ve hit at least one home run off of him.
Someone tell me why this plan is crazy
Assume $25M budget
Sign Matt Holliday to play LF
Trade Jose Lopez and Michael Saunders to the Twins for Scott Baker
Sign Felipe Lopez to play 2nd
Sign Carlos Delgado to play 1st
Sign Felix for whatever he wants.
by Graham MacAree on Dec 11, 2009 10:12 AM PST reply actions
Griffey DHs? Or Carp? Or what?
Otherwise yeah, I’d do it.
by BrettJMiller on Dec 11, 2009 10:16 AM PST up reply actions
Their second base situation is awful and their left fielder is Delmon Young
by Graham MacAree on Dec 11, 2009 10:22 AM PST up reply actions
It'd kill our budget, plus Vazquez would never come to Seattle
by Graham MacAree on Dec 11, 2009 10:25 AM PST up reply actions
I didn't realize he was being paid $15m per
At those prices I’d rather chase down a free agent unless the Braves ate a significant portion of the contract
I am basically trying to leverage Lopez and Saunders for cheap effective pitching
Twins were a good fit.
by Graham MacAree on Dec 11, 2009 10:29 AM PST up reply actions
And the Dodgers
and Houston. The Baker trade is my favourite permutation, and I talked to a few neutrals about it to make sure I wasn’t screwing the Twins.
by Graham MacAree on Dec 11, 2009 10:34 AM PST up reply actions
Works too
Like Baker a little bit more – he’s under contract through his arb years.
by Graham MacAree on Dec 11, 2009 10:36 AM PST up reply actions
They seem to be at an impasse with Johnson too
because of the money they might move him, I just don’t know whether it’s realistic or not
I wonder if the Dodgers have soured on Billingsley
The fact that he didn’t get a start in the post season seems criminal.
[DELETED ZOMG NO POLITICS]
I figured that one been too one sided in fovour of the M's and thus discarded the idea
by Graham MacAree on Dec 11, 2009 12:13 PM PST up reply actions
Well I figured you wanted a young guy from them
and they aren’t going to deal Kershaw, not sure how you feel about either Elbert or McDonald. I think McDonald might be a guy they’d part with since he hasn’t done too well in the bigs.
[DELETED ZOMG NO POLITICS]
The problem with the Dodgers is that apart from Billingsley there's nobody who'd make an impact on our rotation
by Graham MacAree on Dec 11, 2009 12:25 PM PST up reply actions
well yeah ok
but he could make an impact dangit
by ManifestDestiny on Dec 11, 2009 12:40 PM PST up reply actions
Jason Vargas!
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 11, 2009 11:27 AM PST up reply actions
If you truly believe Holliday is worth the money, I'm with you.
Racer X. You have to love those amarillo hops.
p.s. fuck you angels
He's a ~6 win player
Worth more than more than 25mil each of the past 3 years.
I think rigidly subscribing to the $4m/win system is a bit crazy
Because the market doesn’t really reflect that after the 3rd win or so
Yeah I'm just saying even at the crazy amount of money it's going to cost us to land him he's worth it
Unless the Red Sox don’t take Bay back or the Mets do something crazy and drive the price up.
I was under the impression you rarely, if ever, assume a player is over 5 wins
But I can’t remember where I heard that.
...and now I'm here
Seeing you rosterbate publicly is amusing.
angels fan in seattle
by Eyebrows on Dec 11, 2009 10:23 AM PST via mobile up reply actions
I'm allowed to because I do my best to be sane
by Graham MacAree on Dec 11, 2009 10:25 AM PST up reply actions
I love the idea because I have a serious man-crush on Baker
In the end we’d still have Morrow, and his development would be pretty big.
I'd be wary of how much Safeco would sap Holliday's power and would rather have Johnson than Delgado...
but sure.
A Mariners fan in Seattle
by Coach Owens on Dec 11, 2009 10:27 AM PST up reply actions
Holliday has adjusted wOBAed at least .400 the last four seasons
He’s more like, say, Edgar without the walks then being a slugger that was a product of high altitude
I wouldn't worry about loss of power
A guy like Holliday, you would expect him to lose maybe a couple homers playing in Safeco Field. It really wouldn’t make that much difference.
by nathaniel dawson on Dec 12, 2009 2:39 PM PST up reply actions
I like this, but I can't help but think, with us already comitting $9m to Figgins, we don't have the money left.
After that, aren’t we left with ~$16m to play with?
Kenji's money is off the books now
Basically we swapped Johjima for Figgins
by Graham MacAree on Dec 11, 2009 10:35 AM PST up reply actions
Didn't most of the "money available" also include...
Not paying Jack Wilson 5.5 million and Griffey 3 million? I thought Dave’s numbers also already included Jojima opting out.
By my count, if it was 25 million + Johjima, then we’ve used 8.5 of the Johjima money and 9 for Figgins. Not sure there’s still 25 left.
Then again, we have no damned clue what the actual budget is. It could be more than that. Much more.
Fans are typically idiots.
by The Typical Idiot Fan on Dec 11, 2009 1:49 PM PST up reply actions
I think itd be a completely dick move for them not to give a new GM something to work with
when they are doing so well relative to other franchises. Especially with him being able to move Wash midseason and attendance not suffering as much as they had projected.
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 11, 2009 2:04 PM PST up reply actions
Wilson's option was also included in that
So no, we still have that money – Wilson was marked at $8M
by Graham MacAree on Dec 11, 2009 2:04 PM PST up reply actions
Couter-bation
Assume $25m budget
Sign Lackey @ ~$15mil for SP
Sign both Branyan and Johnson for ~$10mil total
Extend Felix
by ManifestDestiny on Dec 11, 2009 10:39 AM PST up reply actions
There's no way you can get Holliday/Lopez/Delgado for $25mil
by ManifestDestiny on Dec 11, 2009 10:40 AM PST up reply actions
That only works if you give Holliday like 5 or 6 years
by ManifestDestiny on Dec 11, 2009 10:42 AM PST up reply actions
Huh, apparently he's not 30 yet...
I guess giving 35 y/o Matt Holliday 20m/per (in the case of backloading) wouldn’t be all THAT egregious…
by ManifestDestiny on Dec 11, 2009 10:44 AM PST up reply actions
With all the talk of Nick Johnson and Branyan (who would probaly cost 12-14m total)
Let us not forget that, even though his upside isn’t as good, Adam LaRoche could probably be had for peanuts in this market
A cheap 2-win player?
Not a bad idea
by ManifestDestiny on Dec 11, 2009 10:47 AM PST up reply actions
A completely different plan, I suspect
Holliday’s the only guy I’d be willing to trade Saunders to accomodate
by Graham MacAree on Dec 11, 2009 10:42 AM PST up reply actions
Mike Cameron for a year?
Racer X. You have to love those amarillo hops.
p.s. fuck you angels
A large chunk of Felix' money is currently paying Silva's contract
Seriously, a large chunk of that $12mil has to be going towards Felix
by ManifestDestiny on Dec 11, 2009 10:48 AM PST up reply actions
CHONE has Carlos Delgado at .244/.320/.447 - That's Griffey-esque, with maybe a bit more power and a bit fewer walks.
Why would we want that over Russell Branyan?
Delgado is essentially filler - 'Oh shit, I just realised my team has no first baseman!'
Put whatever name you want that would sign for under $4M there
by Graham MacAree on Dec 11, 2009 10:46 AM PST up reply actions
Mike Jacobs!
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 11, 2009 11:22 AM PST up reply actions
Well we'll see what the bottom offer for Holliday is
Cardinals just made him an offer, expect response in 48 hours. No details yet.
by ManifestDestiny on Dec 11, 2009 11:03 AM PST up reply actions
I'm curious how many games you'd project this team to win.
A quick and dirty modification of Dave’s spreadsheet got me to 88 wins. Is that a bit optimistic?
Sounds about right to me
I’d expect that team to be in the high 80s and be competitive in the AL West
by Graham MacAree on Dec 11, 2009 12:16 PM PST up reply actions
I'm trying to do some quick math here
Assuming Felix gets 6/80 deal = 13 mil +/- a few mil per year
Hollliday is expensive too.
Isn’t that pretty much all the money right there?
by Edgar for Pres on Dec 11, 2009 11:53 AM PST up reply actions
Felix is getting about 10M this year
Whatever his contract is, the first years will not be much more than his arb awards would have been I think. Signing bonuses aside. And Felix’s 10M for this year have already been figured into the budget so they don’t count against it.
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 11, 2009 11:56 AM PST up reply actions
And as someone pointed out
by the time Felix will be hitting FA, Silva will be off the books meaning the team can pay Felix ~22M and be in an identical budget situation as it is now.
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 11, 2009 11:58 AM PST up reply actions
Felix's money is already accouinted for prior to the 25 million figure
He’ll get 10mil from arbitration this year and that’s not likely to change hugely in an extension
I like the Delgado move
Talk about him has been pretty quiet this offseason.
by Edgar for Pres on Dec 11, 2009 11:57 AM PST up reply actions
Don't Shoot
Add Milton Bradley for Silva to that list.
SH Bat
Plays OF and DH
Good OBP
But for his complete battiness, Bradley is EXACTLY the kind of player Zduriencik would like.
Yes, I’d rather have Bradley than Silva on this team. So shoot me.
It's not going to happen
The idea has been shot down by both sides
I've wanted Bradley here for a while
but its funny you should say that he’s EXACTLY the kind of player Zduriencik would like because when the Pierre/Silva/Bradley rumors were flying the FO was fast and vicious in saying there was nothing to them because they did not like the kind of player Bradley is. Not the hitting I mean, but the personality. For all the stat love, these guys seem to put a lot of emphasis on character as well.
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 11, 2009 1:07 PM PST up reply actions
Take character out of the equation
And Bradley is just their type of player. Versatile and gets on base.
But yes, I understand that character plays a role.
Look, I don't care if he's a dick
I was just pointing out that the FO specifically said they want nothing to do with Bradley, and this is in an offseason when Zduriencik has said yes were interested to virtually every single player agent and GM.
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 11, 2009 1:14 PM PST up reply actions
Everyone would rather have Bradley than Silva. Everyone.
Silva is not tradeable, and every GM, even the bad ones, know that. Why give up anything of value for a guy who’s liable to get DFA’d?
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 11, 2009 1:10 PM PST up reply actions
Silva is tradable, but we would have to eat a good portion of his contract.
Even then, I don’t how good the return would be in that scenario to make it worth it.
A good question to ask yourself is what you would sign Silva for
if you had to sign him to a two year deal (+2mil to buy out his 3rd year). Lets be generous and say he’s worth 0.5 WAR/yr. That means you are looking at a pitcher people would be willing to sign for around 2 million dollars for 2 years + 2mil to buy out his 3rd year for a total of 4 mil. He has $25 mil on his contract still.
To give him away you are looking at sending Carlos Silva + 20mil in cash and getting nothing in return. If Carlos Silva is tradable then anybody is tradable.
by Edgar for Pres on Dec 11, 2009 1:57 PM PST up reply actions
If you can't get anything in return
its not a trade. Its paying him to go away.
by Edgar for Pres on Dec 12, 2009 3:34 PM PST up reply actions
If he gets anything back, a Jinx JJ combo is going to be sick.
Racer X. You have to love those amarillo hops.
p.s. fuck you angels
HA
Damon’s looking for 4/52 or 3/39.
His away line last year was .284/.349/.446, and he’s only an average corner fielder now.
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 11, 2009 11:36 AM PST reply actions
Heyman made his report card on the WInter Meetings
I was surprised to see he had Chone under the Loser’s, but turns out it was for signing too soon:
“Chone Figgins: The excellent new Mariner has to realize now that he signed the only obvious under-market contract this winter. The improving, newly patient All-Star (he led the AL in walks with 101) may actually wind up receiving the same salary in 2010 as Penny, who was a mid-2009 giveaway by the Red Sox. He led the league in walks and is maybe the most versatile star player in the game.”
Should we be interested in Randy Winn?
Determined, Jonesing Commentor | Proud proprietor of Wyomingroutes.org & Washingtonhighways.org
I don't know
Mike Cameron, Randy Johnson, Miguel Olivo…
We’re getting precariously close to a reunion tour.
"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett http://mvn.com/marinersminors/
Let's sign Yorvit as a backup!
A Mariners fan in Seattle
by Coach Owens on Dec 11, 2009 11:56 AM PST up reply actions
Winn's hitting scares me. His LD% got better but he still hit worse.
.302 wOBA this season. He’s an excellent defender in the corners, but I doubt he’ll go anywhere to be a backup.
A Mariners fan in Seattle
by Coach Owens on Dec 11, 2009 12:00 PM PST up reply actions
Just an fyi
Money coming off books after next year:
Griffey 2
Snell 4 (if 6 mil club option isn’t picked up)
Basically no money is coming off the books after next season. All of this will probably be used to deal with arb increases. The only money we will have for FA next year is whatever you spend on 1yr contracts this year. Something to think about. (I hope I did all the contract stuff right)
by Edgar for Pres on Dec 11, 2009 12:18 PM PST reply actions
Which kinda makes me think
Picking up guys like:
Delgado, Sheets, Branyan (Bedard too?). Might be a good idea. Fill up on cheap guys who fill holes on our team and give them 1 yr + club option contracts and hope for the best. It doesn’t give us the best team this year but it allows us some flexibility in our future spending.
Harden would have been so great!….
by Edgar for Pres on Dec 11, 2009 12:26 PM PST up reply actions
True
we are only paying something like 1-2 mil this year for him though right?
by Edgar for Pres on Dec 11, 2009 12:49 PM PST up reply actions
Yeah, but it's as relevent as Griffey I think
by Graham MacAree on Dec 11, 2009 12:50 PM PST up reply actions
Yeah its pretty much chump change
Hopefully they increase the budget. 10 mil increase would be very helpful.
And in 2 years we have
Jack Wilson 5 mil
Lopez 2 mil (4 club option)
Which is also not much coming off the books then either. Damn you Silva!
by Edgar for Pres on Dec 11, 2009 12:54 PM PST up reply actions
$10 million of Silva comes off the books after 2011.
We pay him a mere $2m to go away.
True
I forgot he’s gonna be gone.
His money gets rerouted to Felix anyway though.
by Edgar for Pres on Dec 11, 2009 12:59 PM PST up reply actions
I'd assume all of it
Silva makes a lot but Felix should command a salary at least equal to what Silva gets
by Edgar for Pres on Dec 11, 2009 1:01 PM PST up reply actions
Felix has 10mil of his salary included in the budget already
So add that to Silva’s money. Assuming we don’t sign him for 20mil a year there should be a little bit extra.
Yes but his money is already in the budget
I don’t think we’re too likely to spend $20M on Felix in 2012
by Graham MacAree on Dec 11, 2009 1:04 PM PST up reply actions
Ok add on 5mil
That gives us ~ 12 mil total which isn’t too bad as long as we can fill either 2B or SS in house. Still probably not going for an elite FA although its so far away at this point its really probably not worrying this far in advance because of all the things that can be done to free up money in the budget.
by Edgar for Pres on Dec 11, 2009 1:07 PM PST up reply actions
Not sure if anyone is listening to Brock & Salk
but the caller just said no way he’d give up Jose Lopez in a deal for Adrian Gonzalez, who is only marginally better and probably in the 2nd tier.
People like this actually exist.
This is why I don't listen to phone-in shows.
Fuck Anaheim.
by Eyeball Kid on Dec 11, 2009 12:32 PM PST up reply actions
The best thing about Brock and Salk.
I also like it when Salk basically calls someone out and calls them stupid without saying it directly when they have retarded ideas.
by BrettJMiller on Dec 11, 2009 12:42 PM PST up reply actions
Baffled is a good way to put it.
It’s pretty funny.
by BrettJMiller on Dec 11, 2009 12:59 PM PST up reply actions
This reminds me of Steve Kelly's trash article in the Times today.
Ugh. Sometimes I really have to count my lucky stars for having Stone, Baker, Drayer, and company. It could be so, so much worse.
Robert is a master bater
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 12, 2009 2:41 PM PST up reply actions
I think Jack Zduriencik's strategy for not leaking information about trade/FA targets
is to put out there that he’s in on everyone. Much easier to let out bad information than to contain good information.
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 11, 2009 1:37 PM PST up reply actions
It's a good policy.
Something’s bound to leak anyway, so why not give the appearance of interest in everyone and keep the level of interest close to the chest?
"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett http://mvn.com/marinersminors/
by JY on Dec 11, 2009 2:01 PM PST up reply actions
Seriously, that Figgins news came out of nowhere
I am just waiting to wake up one day and find, lo and behold, we’ve made some other massive move out of nowhere.
by ManifestDestiny on Dec 11, 2009 2:12 PM PST up reply actions
That's almost certainly part of it and I think he has an almost annoyingly thorough approach to roster construction
Even if someone is Plan G he wants to know what it’s going to take to acquire them if plans A-F go wrong.
Some of them are obviously just complete bullshit to mess with people, though. Hank Blalock, riiiiight.
He can hit, right?
Determined, Jonesing Commentor | Proud proprietor of Wyomingroutes.org & Washingtonhighways.org
Ah Dayton Moore:
Royals signed C Jason Kendall to a two-year contract.
No terms yet, but I’m guessing $10M.
FUCK THE DBACKS!
They were talking six I think
but… man. What a roster.
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 11, 2009 4:46 PM PST up reply actions
Hahaha, SIX MILLION
That’s just spectacular. Why the fuck didn’t we deal them Rob Johnson?
...and now I'm here
Wait, do they even have anyone worth getting anymore?
...and now I'm here
They probably have someone in the famr system they've evaluated poorly.
"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett http://mvn.com/marinersminors/
by JY on Dec 11, 2009 7:53 PM PST up reply actions
Most likely everyone in their farm system has been evaulated poorly
Even if the end result of the analysis was accurate.
...and now I'm here
Greinke?
Determined, Jonesing Commentor | Proud proprietor of Wyomingroutes.org & Washingtonhighways.org
Good grief.
Heh, Keith Law has a bunch of Jason Kendall facts on his twitter. Some are kinda funny. My favorite is this:
In 2010, a manager will intentionally walk Yuniesky Betancourt to pitch to Jason Kendall. #jasonkendallfacts
about 3 hours ago from web
FUCK THE DBACKS!
They go together 'cause opposites attract!
And you know
by Johnny Slick on Dec 11, 2009 10:52 PM PST up reply actions
Since one could argue that Mike Jacobs is better than Jason Kendall, I'd say they took 3 steps back.
Two bits I kinda enjoyed from this Fangraphs article on the signing.
If Dayton Moore and Jack Zduriencik switched places today, the Royals probably wouldn’t be ready to contend until at least 2012.
And this quote from Kendall:
"There were other offers," [Kendall] said, "but one thing about Dayton and the Royals is, they called me the first day I became a free agent. That’s something that kind of speaks for itself."
FUCK THE DBACKS!
DO NOT QUESTION THE PROCESS JERKFACES
He is going to continue to overpay for the shittest free agents and make foolish, baffling trades until someone stops him.
Ken Rosenthal "has a hunch" that Seattle could fit in a 3-way Jays/Phils/M's trade revolving around Lee/Halladay
The M’s “could” send Canadians Michael Saunders, Phillippe Aumont and Carlos Triunfel to Philly for Lee, 2 of which are then flipped to TOR for Halladay.
Rosenthal is just thinking out loud but…it’s an interesting thought. The M’s would have to be given a negotiating window or something with Lee for an extension to make it work though.
by ManifestDestiny on Dec 12, 2009 7:36 AM PST reply actions
What if we flip Cliff Lee for Adrian Gonzalez?
just thinking out loud.
Why on earth would the Padres want Cliff Lee?
by I Lick Squirrels on Dec 12, 2009 10:44 PM PST up reply actions
So they can flip him for Miguel Cabrera
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 12, 2009 10:47 PM PST up reply actions
I don't know.
Can we work Brent Lillibridge into this deal somehow?
"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett http://mvn.com/marinersminors/
Jason Bay rejects Red Sox' offer
Agent says that there are “other offers on the table that are of greater interest” to Jason that are out there.
If Bavasi was still our GM, I’d be scared that tomorrow I would wake up and find him an overpriced Mariner
by ManifestDestiny on Dec 12, 2009 1:10 PM PST reply actions
It could still happen!
Jack Z is a smart guy but Bay is too tempting. I’ll be sweating that out until he actually signs with someone.
by Johnny Slick on Dec 12, 2009 1:22 PM PST up reply actions
Bay is only tempting at that price to lousy GMs.
GMZ is not one of those people
by seattlebruin on Dec 12, 2009 2:27 PM PST up reply actions
Mets are giving him the same years plus 5M
and the ALE is a hell to play in so that must be what he’s referring to.
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 12, 2009 1:36 PM PST up reply actions
Well...
a. He’s local.
b. He hits a lot of homeruns.
c. Geoff Baker loves him.
d. Did I mention he’s local?
Baker doesn't love him
he’s aware of the problems. He just thinks the roster needs more power and sees Bay as the likeliest source. Given that Holliday is unlikely to want to sign here unless we overpay he may be right (if you accept that the roster needs power).
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 12, 2009 1:38 PM PST up reply actions
I wasn't talking about the articles
I mean Geoff Baker is in deep love with Jason Bay. He tries to hide it in public by making semi-noncommittal statements but in reality he would like nothing better than to wake up to Jason Bay’s sleeping face.
Seriously I think you’re right. However, I also think that Baker is way too infatuated with the need for power and in a way that still counts as Bay love. And heck, I’d love Bay for 3/27 as well… but that’s not his price level of course. I’m not saying that I actually want Bay on this team, I’m saying that Bay has significant GM lures about his person and as much as I like Jack Z I wouldn’t be surprised if anybody bit onto those… lures.
by Johnny Slick on Dec 12, 2009 1:45 PM PST up reply actions
Didn't Bob Whitsitt turn down a Kemp-Pippen trade because of local sportswriter outcry?
Maybe that was local sports talk radio, which in a way is even worse. I don’t think it’s an overriding reason to bring Bay in but I think that it is a reason, conscious or subconscious. I just look at the guy, think “Bavasi would have signed him for 5/125 by now”, and pray every morning that Jack Z continues to act nothing like Flying Bill.
by Johnny Slick on Dec 12, 2009 3:01 PM PST up reply actions
I'm pretty sure Jack Zduriencik is our GM, not Geoff Baker
by seattlebruin on Dec 12, 2009 2:28 PM PST up reply actions
Well I guess somebody doesn't read the paper then.
Baker was just promoted on Thursday morning following the M’s inability to sign anyone of note at the winter meetings. It’s weird that the Seattle Times would allow Baker to keep his job there but you know. Politics.
by Johnny Slick on Dec 12, 2009 2:57 PM PST up reply actions
Re the need for power
I’m not sure what to think on this issue. I mean, an offense of crazy good BABIP guys with no power but mad speed will do ok probably. But I wonder if Figgins would have walked nearly as much as he did without Abreu, Hunter, and Napoli hitting behind him.
On a micro scale think about a player like Willits. He’s got a good eye but an anemic swing, so his eye will never translate into good BB rates because really whats the harm in piping fb after fb to him? He’s still going to ground out 73% of the time.
Likewise, without some players who can do some damage to a pitch in the zone, pitchers may be less worried about giving Figgins or Guti or Wilson strikes because what are the chances that Lopez is going to hit another one of his dinkers? Not real high.
This is just me thinking out loud here. I’m not confident that what I’m saying is right, and I obviously havent researched it. I’m basically taking what we know about individual player tendencies and extrapolating it onto a lineup. So… there goes another five minutes of my life.
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 12, 2009 2:40 PM PST up reply actions
My favorite thing about getting a lot of high-OBP guys...
…is that they all conspire to take 40 million pitches and cause opposing pitchers to reach the 100 pitch mark in the 4th inning. ISTR the 2001 team doing that a bit.
by Johnny Slick on Dec 12, 2009 2:58 PM PST up reply actions
Your first point there holds no water really because what you're suggesting is a form of protection, if I'm not mistaken.
You should know that protection does not exist. I think that Chone will still do fine because he does make solid contact as evidence by his 20% plus LD rate. Also he has an amazing eye because he takes very few strikes looking. I just don’t see him having any problem maintaining an 11% or higher walk rate.
You don't think Holliday would come to Seattle for 6/100?
If a player is getting paid, I don’t think he really cares where he’s at. Location-wise, at least.
I think that fits the dictionary definition of "overpaid".
Maybe not for the first couple years but I’m having a hard time believing he’s got a better than 50% chance of continuing to put up 140+ OPS+ marks at age 33.
by Johnny Slick on Dec 12, 2009 3:03 PM PST up reply actions
Holliday a consistent 6+ win player
He’s a plus fielder. He’s an outstanding bat.
What’s so hard to believe?
That he's not going to have a normal aging pattern.
by Johnny Slick on Dec 13, 2009 12:09 AM PST up reply actions
A normal aging pattern means he's probably still going to be worth the money in 2014.
by Aaron Campeau on Dec 13, 2009 2:38 AM PST up reply actions
Apparently Holliday has old player skills.
by Mariner John on Dec 13, 2009 4:25 AM PST up reply actions
Okay, I will stand corrected.
But if he does regress I will pretend this conversation never happened! I mean, other than the part where I predicted he wouldn’t be worth his contract!
by Johnny Slick on Dec 13, 2009 12:18 PM PST up reply actions
He may. Depends on how the market develops
Either way if that’s what it takes itll be more than Boston would have had to pay.
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 12, 2009 3:18 PM PST up reply actions
Hmmmm
A major league source told WEEI.com that one team has extended an offer beyond four years for free agent outfielder Jason Bay.
It’s not the Red Sox. The Mets are the most recent team to enter the bidding, having submitted an offer in the range of $63 million over four years. Just this afternoon, Bay’s agent Joe Urbon said there were better offers than Boston’s on the table, so perhaps the Mets decided to add another year. Stay tuned.
FUCK THE DBACKS!
Not gonna lie
I’m a little scared that this might be us.
by ManifestDestiny on Dec 12, 2009 3:03 PM PST up reply actions
I'm pretty sure I heard someone say it was the Giants.
by BrettJMiller on Dec 12, 2009 3:52 PM PST up reply actions
Or that the Giants were willing to go five.
But he absolutely doesn’t want to play there.
by BrettJMiller on Dec 12, 2009 3:52 PM PST up reply actions
In other news, Jon Morosi thinks that Jose Lopez for Derek Lowe is a good idea
by ManifestDestiny on Dec 12, 2009 5:07 PM PST reply actions
They probably don't. Nor do we want Lowe for 3/45.
Morosi thinks its a ‘good idea’.
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 12, 2009 5:55 PM PST up reply actions
I'm kind of missing Langerhans now
Just spoke to Ryan Langerhans down in southern Texas, where he’s off with some buddies on a white-tailed deer hunting trip. Langerhans joked that his hunting party included "some potential Mariners.’’
One of them? Adam LaRoche.
I could hear LaRoche saying something to Langerhans in the background.
“He says we’re a package deal,’’ Langerhans said with a laugh.
Anyhow, LaRoche didn’t intervene to deny the Mariners are talking to him.
"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett http://mvn.com/marinersminors/
John Lackey reportedly taking a physical for Boston
This+news that Lowell needs thumb surgery, thus preventing a trade+Beltre signing, could mean Adrian is more likely to come back to Seattle
by ManifestDestiny on Dec 14, 2009 9:02 AM PST reply actions
Ken Rosenthal confirms that Lackey is taking a physical and is prolly gonna get AJ Burnett money
Link here
It’s nice to take Lackey away from the Angels, but it makes it more likely that the Sox are gonna trade Bucholz++ for A-Gon :(
by ManifestDestiny on Dec 14, 2009 9:54 AM PST up reply actions
Also, I think it's not only nice to see Lackey away from the Angels.
I think it’s nice that we didn’t fork over too much money for him.
by BrettJMiller on Dec 14, 2009 9:58 AM PST up reply actions
Aroldis Chapman set to become the BoSox's very own Kei Igawa
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 14, 2009 10:15 AM PST reply actions
Not just yet.
For one thing, I don’t know that BP would be breaking that particular newsbit, and for another, he only has that offer, and since he’s supposed to do another workout soon, I don’t think he’ll bite immediately if he has a chance to raise his stock.
"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett http://mvn.com/marinersminors/
Well okay
but the money is similar and somehow my expectations of him are about the same.
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 14, 2009 10:57 AM PST up reply actions
Angels are in talks w/ Hideki Matsui
Link here
by ManifestDestiny on Dec 14, 2009 11:23 AM PST reply actions
I think the Angels could be in talks with anyone and this point and I wouldn't like it.
"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett http://mvn.com/marinersminors/
*at this point
I can’t type for shit today.
"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." - Samuel Beckett http://mvn.com/marinersminors/
Apparently Matsui's deal with LAA is for $6.5mil
Link here
by ManifestDestiny on Dec 14, 2009 11:40 AM PST up reply actions
Dammit
thats a good deal. Surprised no one would offer him more years.
De Gutibus non disputandum est
by Bearskin Rugburn on Dec 14, 2009 12:06 PM PST up reply actions
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