Cat's Out of the Bag
by Matthew on Jan 4, 2009 3:37 PM PST
in Great News
121 comments
Baseball Prospectus Interview with Blengino
It's a big Q&A with Tony Blengino, who by the way, you can ask questions to directly, perhaps as follow-ups to answers presented above. There is lots of great stuff in the interview.
DMZ pulls two exciting quotes out and mentions something that, if you are familar at all with the internet baseball community could be the most exciting news of all this winter. Remember how Bavasi "used" Mat Olkin as a consultant except that the Ms were so backwards that a 1996 edition of the Sears holiday catalog would have been just as useful? Well, Blengino has his own consultant, but since we have a very good inkling that this administration actually cares about statistical analysis, the identity of the consultant is pretty damn important.
That person is Tom Tango.
It's literally beyond wildest dreams. I never thought we'd have to create a "Great News" section for our stories here.
Graham's addendum, presented without comment:
So it really is vital that statistics and traditional scouting work hand in hand for an organization to succeed, and I think you see that with the most successful organizations in the game; they do both well.
-Tony Blengino
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BUCK FUTTER!
You may gain some yards on the ground, but eventually Lofa will end up biting you in the ass.
by Scruffy Lefty on Jan 4, 2009 9:25 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
One of my favorite parts:
It’s a matter of the Mariners maybe not having had someone with my skill set in the front office before, and that kind of frees you up to look for more long-range, big-picture-type projects from a consultant, rather than asking them for basic statistical analysis that I can answer myself.
Bavasi: So hey, Mat, how many wins did we have last season?
Olkin: Do you mean overall or based on the true talent of the roster? Because I think if you look at the true talent, you’re going to find th
Bavasi: I mean overall.
Olkin: 88?
Bavasi: Good work. Thanks!
by Jeff on Jan 4, 2009 3:58 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
It's one thing to have Great News simply because where we are coming from.
And a 100 million times better to get something that would be Great News to every other team in baseball.
by Robert on Jan 4, 2009 4:00 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Tango
Wow. And here I was a few years ago thinking the Red Sox pulled a coup by getting Bill James. Just wow. This is fantastically cool. A great start to 2009.
I know a lot of ya’ll personally away from LL. If one of you wants to hook a brother up with the transcript, I would be appreciative.
by katal on Jan 4, 2009 4:05 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Wasn't Tango working for the Red Sox?
by Edgar for Pres on Jan 4, 2009 4:30 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
My first question,
if I lived anywhere near Seattle and were going, would be along the lines of ‘how closely will tango be consulting you?’.
Great news indeed, and in an offseason full of it so far, so it’s not, you know, a contrast thing.
by Bearskin Rugburn on Jan 4, 2009 4:05 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
If you told me last year that Tom Tango would be a consultant for the Seattle Mariners
I would’ve kicked you right in the crotch for lying. And now I would feel guilty about having done so, because holy shit you were right.
by JLC on Jan 4, 2009 4:10 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Also, if you're reading this, Tangotiger
You’re ours now. You are not allowed to share your brain with anyone else ever.
by JLC on Jan 4, 2009 4:12 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
If you did not smile at this news, shame on you
by Graham on Jan 4, 2009 4:15 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
I started laughing which was awkward because I was standing outside of the dressing room at the Gap.
by acblue on Jan 4, 2009 4:42 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Phone internet sometimes leads to weird situations.
Big Z is the MAN.
by Taylor H on Jan 4, 2009 4:45 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Well, sorry...
….but I hurt my jaw when it hit the floor….
by rtang on Jan 4, 2009 7:37 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Awesome news.
I wish I could read the whole interview. I may have to subscribe for a month just for this interview.
by Happybelly on Jan 4, 2009 4:29 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
I'm still having difficulty comprehending that this is the Mariners
It’s like we’ve been possessed by a competent baseball organization
by Nick S on Jan 4, 2009 4:58 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Holy crap. What an unbelievable interview.
The meetup is going to be a total lovefest. I might have to go after all.
the other angels fan
by Eyebrows on Jan 4, 2009 5:12 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Tango...
So is he M’s property or is he independent where he’ll sell his services to anyone who pays him?
by PLU Tim on Jan 4, 2009 5:17 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
He's a consultant, not an employee
so he’s certainly not M’s property; as to the rest, it depends on the contract terms.
by The Ancient Mariner on Jan 4, 2009 5:22 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
For some reason the key word of that sentence was deleted
that word was “sentient”
by JI on Jan 4, 2009 5:25 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
In a couple Bill James interviews I've read, he's declined to answer certain questions.
The one that specifically comes to mind was in regards to sunlight reflecting off the Green Monster at Fenway and it’s potential effect on left handed batters. He declined to answer stating the BoSox had him look at that issue and the information he developed was proprietary.
Formerly dpseadvr.
by Kermit. on Jan 4, 2009 8:22 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Nothing bad will ever happen to the Mariners ever again
by Fogel on Jan 4, 2009 5:26 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I for one, will enjoy watching Albert Pujols everyday.
by Robert on Jan 4, 2009 5:37 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Albert Pujols isn't available for trade you fool.
by JI on Jan 4, 2009 5:38 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
The Mariners are bringing Kevin Pritchard on board as trade master.
Pujols will be the Mariners for Brian LaHair and Phat Andy.
Jeff's guide to not looking stupid:
+/- is an absolutely terrible stat, so don't use it, and don't give up on young players before they turn 24.
54!
by joof on Jan 4, 2009 7:16 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
This is super nitpicky in comparison to the towering ascent our front office has gone through in a matter of weeks,
but I’m curious: Are there any reservations about Blengino favoring RZR over BIP metrics, or is that just something that will have to be asked next week?
by Double06 on Jan 4, 2009 6:15 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
No
And this is coming from the guy who has publicly said that we don’t need RZR anymore now that we’ve got UZR on FanGraphs from the same data source.
His point in the interview was that he liked the breakout of RZR as “in zone, out of zone” as separate entities. He then goes right on to mention PMR and UZR, so there’s no chance that he’s just looking at RZR and ignoring everything else.
These guys get it. They really are all we could have hoped for. This won’t be the last time we jump up and down and say “holy crap I can’t believe this is the Mariners we’re talking about.”
by davidcameron on Jan 4, 2009 6:18 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Oh I'm sure he doesn't just use one.
However, I remember you saying that RZR shouldn’t be given much weight anymore so my question came from the different opinions you two have. Thanks.
by Double06 on Jan 4, 2009 6:31 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I feel like this is too good to be true
my inner pessimist (or since the bavasi era, realist) says the Mariners can’t possibly have something like this start going right. It just isn’t normal, there’s some mistake. It’s just too improbable that we now have such an upper hand in our management and that we may start making intelligent decisions.
And yet, here we are, I’m in shock
by mariners124m on Jan 4, 2009 6:23 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
This must be some really poorly timed April Fools joke
because good things don’t happen to the Mariners.
But anyway now that we’re making solid decisions, where will people around the league direct their laughter?
by Scrupio on Jan 4, 2009 8:43 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Dayton Moore is infuriated
have Mike Jacobs, HoRam, and Kyle Farnsworth acquisitions been forgotten so soon?
Bringing you more-or-less replacement level analysis and commentary since sometime in 2008.
by devil_fingers on Jan 4, 2009 9:12 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
The Battle for Grass Creek is not over!
You dirty Mariner Scum may have Tango, but I’m sure Dayton Moore is hard at work, and will answer with the acquisition of Christina Kahrl and Will Carroll!
Bringing you more-or-less replacement level analysis and commentary since sometime in 2008.
by devil_fingers on Jan 4, 2009 8:45 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Has Tango been used by teams before?
Curious to how the relationship works. Do the M’s tell him upfront what they are going to run by him and he tells them how much it cost? Or do they use him exclusively and pay him enough that the m’s can throw as much shit as they want at him and see what he has to say? Nonetheless, very exciting
by coasty141 on Jan 4, 2009 9:16 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
From the Book blog:
“My involvement is on a consulting basis, not employee basis, so I don’t have as much insight as you might think. I am happy with the direction.”
“Right, I’ve done some consulting work in the past for MLB and NHL. MGL and Andy as well. I think "The Book" also acts as a "brochure" of sorts.”
Every day I hear about Seattle sports' failures. Every night I fall asleep to the sound of my own tears.
by Benne on Jan 4, 2009 10:30 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
So, a sabermetrically inclined FO + an ability to support a $100MM+ payroll,
what’s stopping the Mariners now?
by craig3410 on Jan 4, 2009 10:00 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Hmmm. Sunk cost concept finally understood???
This signature space for rent.
by PositivePaul on Jan 4, 2009 10:10 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Ahem
The pup that laughs when you're down on your luck.
by Scrappy the Scapegoat on Jan 4, 2009 10:32 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
That's either cynical, cruel, or wildly pessimistic.
by The Ancient Mariner on Jan 5, 2009 7:55 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
In the absence of any clear biblical prophecy to that effect
I see no reason to believe that.
by The Ancient Mariner on Jan 5, 2009 8:56 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
This A's fan has only one thing to say
FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU
Webmaster of Driveline Mechanics
http://www.drivelinemechanics.com - An Unconventional Look at Scouting
by Kyle Boddy on Jan 5, 2009 12:14 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Go back to /b/
Fans are typically idiots.
by The Typical Idiot Fan on Jan 5, 2009 12:06 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I literally do not know how to process this information
This organization has been so bad for so long, and I’ve been watching it be so bad for so long, that I can’t actually bring myself to be optimistic about this off season yet, because a large part of me thinks it’s either some cruel joke or that the best statistical minds in baseball will be lobotomized by the ownership group before being allowed to do their jobs to the best of their ability.
I am fully hoping to be proven wrong, and I expect that I will be – and I can’t wait until I am. I just can’t get my hopes up yet.
Nice Guys Finish Third - Hopelessly lost, but makin' good time.
by pdb on Jan 5, 2009 8:05 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
At least one part of the ownership group
is probably happy…Chris Larson….
by rtang on Jan 5, 2009 8:22 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Can't wait for Baker's take on this
he will surely have more info on Tango’s role and level of involvement, and possibly on the structure and size of the stats dept in the FO.
by Bearskin Rugburn on Jan 5, 2009 10:21 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
I'm not sure Baker will notice
or consider it worthy of comment if he does.
by The Ancient Mariner on Jan 5, 2009 10:31 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
He's usually pretty good about reporting
any personnel developments, whether they be players, coaching staff, scouts or whatever. He reads this blog as well as USSM so he will certainly notice. I don’t have any beef with him really.
People seem to think he’s a hack of some sort because he often disagrees with the LL/USSM authors and has reported on the clubhouse atmosphere. I think he’s just doing his job – writing about the things he hears and sees as a beat writer with clubhouse access; as for his analysis… it’s much more thought through and critical than what I was used to, and if it’s sometimes wrong, well, so what? He’s a beat writer not an analyst. I ignore it for the most part.
by Bearskin Rugburn on Jan 5, 2009 11:12 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think he's a hack, and I'm not banging on him
It’s just that hiring a consultant can mean as little or as much as you want it to mean, as Bavasi showed with Olkin; as such — unless I’m wrong and Baker is in fact a Tangotiger fanboy — I could easily see Baker thinking nothing of this move until it actually starts to make a difference. Obviously, you don’t sign a guy like Tom Tango and then ignore his work; but to know that, you have to have a sense of who Tom Tango is and how important his work is. If Baker does, then yes, he’ll give this move real play. If he doesn’t, he may not think it matters.
by The Ancient Mariner on Jan 5, 2009 1:31 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Baker has shown a tendancy to pick up on this kind of stuff, though.
A lot of users on his blog discuss the whole “stats versus scouting” thing (which is stupid because they should both coexist in an MLB front office). He has indulged those users in the past with this kind of information.
by BrianL on Jan 5, 2009 1:41 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
That's true
and certainly, there’s enough excitement in this corner of the blogosphere to justify a mention — and enough interesting stuff in Tango’s work to make a really good “introducing him to the rest of the fanbase” post. Good point.
by The Ancient Mariner on Jan 6, 2009 6:57 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Tom Tango is ours, and you can't have him.
I like homeless people. They are funny. I like cake. It is not funny but really delicious.
by Humongo on Jan 5, 2009 11:41 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
I kind of miss the incompetence and laughable effort by our previous FO
by Fogel on Jan 5, 2009 11:57 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
I hope Wakamatsu makes a lot of stupid decisions so that we still have things to complain about.
Or that I get hired by the Ms.
by Matthew on Jan 5, 2009 12:01 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Even Barry Bonds goes 0 for 5
we’ll always have something
by JI on Jan 5, 2009 6:01 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Thanks
Guys, thanks very much for all your kind words.
by tangotiger on Jan 5, 2009 12:32 PM PST reply actions 2 recs
Congratulations, Tango.
This is awesome!
by ThundaPC on Jan 5, 2009 12:37 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Seconded.
I wish you well, sir.
Nice Guys Finish Third - Hopelessly lost, but makin' good time.
by pdb on Jan 5, 2009 12:41 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Congrats, Tango.
Looking forward to you helping out the Mariners.
by Phildopip on Jan 5, 2009 2:58 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
You're the man
Determined, Jonesing Commentor | Proud proprietor of Wyomingroutes.org & Washingtonhighways.org
by I'm NOT Corco on Jan 5, 2009 4:44 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Chris Larson can anything that he wants from me.
by Robert on Jan 5, 2009 12:55 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
He told me he wants verbs in sentences.
Jeff's guide to not looking stupid:
+/- is an absolutely terrible stat, so don't use it, and don't give up on young players before they turn 24.
54!
by joof on Jan 6, 2009 3:50 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm ok
I just got something in both my eyes.
by zeeehjee on Jan 5, 2009 1:20 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Holy crap
I don’t know that anything could be said right now to put a bigger smile on my face
Determined, Jonesing Commentor | Proud proprietor of Wyomingroutes.org & Washingtonhighways.org
by I'm NOT Corco on Jan 5, 2009 4:44 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
The only bad part about this
is that Tango won’t be able to publicly comment on M’s transactions anymore.
by Edgar for Pres on Jan 5, 2009 10:00 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
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