ESPN Writers' HOF Ballot
by Sentinel on Jan 10, 2009 10:08 PM PST
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PrintReally, Pedro? Really?
I'm sure a lot of you have seen this already, but I figured I'd put it up. As is always the case with these things, there is a lot that's up for debate. One thing did jump out at me, though, as is probably the case with a lot of people.
Apparently, Pedro Gomez believes this guy belongs in the Hall of Fame. Now, I'm a big proponent of "to each is own", but voting for Jay Bell on a Hall of Fame ballot seems pretty ridiculous to me.
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I'd say Brendan Roberts' ballot was the best.
No on Rice, yay on Blyleven, Raines and McGwire. That gets a thumbs-up in my book.
Every day I hear about Seattle sports' failures. Every night I fall asleep to the sound of my own tears.
I like Michael Knisley's ballot.
Those are some good names, but not HOF worthy.
And what is Pedro Gomez thinking? Willie Bloomquist is going to have a shot to get a vote.
I don't know, I think Blyleven, Raines, and Trammell all have solid resumes,
but I’m generally in favor of a bigger Hall, primarily because there are more teams and much more players in the modern era than there were before. I’d definitely like to see McGwire in as well, but that’s a loaded issue. The only thing that will bother me if/when Rice gets in is that he will be going in ahead of some of his more deserving contemporaries.
by FlaskInSafeco on Jan 11, 2009 10:35 AM PST up reply actions
Lynn is probably as deserving as Rice, yes.
But I was thinking more along the lines of the three I mentioned above who I view as clearly superior to Rice.
by FlaskInSafeco on Jan 11, 2009 10:45 AM PST up reply actions
Yeah, I guess I shouldnt have said "the only thing that will bother me"
and should have gone with “the primary thing that will bother me.” I really dont want to see Rice go in. If he hadnt played in Boston, no one would really talk about him much for HOF, both because of park effects and the sway of Boston media. And a lot of his case is built on a bullshit “most feared hitter of his time” argument that doesnt hold water because the man was almost never walked, intentionally or otherwise.
by FlaskInSafeco on Jan 11, 2009 10:51 AM PST up reply actions
Yeah when you factor in defense you might even be able to make a strong argument that Bell was better.
by FlaskInSafeco on Jan 11, 2009 10:54 AM PST up reply actions
I'm not sure how to adjust for league and park
But if you were to say that in today’s game Bell (who was ~league average hitter, and a very good defensive short stop) would average something like a .335 wOBA, and a +6 on defense, and Rice averaged a .380 wOBA and a 7 in LF, Bell would be better- but obviously I’m assuming a lot there.
I've always hated the "most feared" argument
By that rationale, Albert Belle and Mo Vaughn should be HOF locks as well.
But don’t try telling that to Dan Shaughnessy.
Every day I hear about Seattle sports' failures. Every night I fall asleep to the sound of my own tears.
Mark McGuire's fucked isn't he?
Fans are typically idiots.
by The Typical Idiot Fan on Jan 10, 2009 11:35 PM PST reply actions
Not true
I mean, I understand what you’re saying. However, the writers have shown, again and again, that the entire steroid thing only matters on a case by case basis. In other words, they’re complete fucktards and the world would probably be better if they were forcibly castrated.
When I was a kid I used to pray every night for a new bicycle. Then I realized God doesn’t work that way, so I stole one and prayed for forgiveness. - Emo Philips
Neglectful father of David Quinowski
Sosa probably will, I doubt Palmeiro will, and if Roger Clemens doesn't get into the HOF I'm burning something important down
I don’t like the guy but if there were ever a HOF eligible player he’d be it
Determined, Jonesing Commentor | Proud proprietor of Wyomingroutes.org & Washingtonhighways.org
All of them not getting in does help Edgar's chances of getting in though
Determined, Jonesing Commentor | Proud proprietor of Wyomingroutes.org & Washingtonhighways.org
I dont see how the fate of the steroids bunch affects Edgar's case.
Frankly, I dont see Edgar going in under any circumstances, as much as I love the guy. He didnt reach either of the 500/3000 marks, he didnt play a premium defensive position, and his legend as a postseason hero is confined mostly to the Northwest. That pretty much seals his fate as far as the HOF writers are concerned. Harold Baines has a much better shot of being the first DH, simply because his counting numbers are higher, and I really dont see that happening either.
by FlaskInSafeco on Jan 11, 2009 10:28 AM PST up reply actions
The steroids bunch were the best the years Edgar played
Eliminate good players from contention and there’s less competition for Edgar
Determined, Jonesing Commentor | Proud proprietor of Wyomingroutes.org & Washingtonhighways.org
I guess I just dont think the writers vote that way.
In the past they’ve seemed perfectly content to elect no one if they no candidate is deemed worthy.
by FlaskInSafeco on Jan 11, 2009 12:44 PM PST up reply actions
I guess we just have to hope he gets voted in because he was a good "natural" hitter
Where they play up what a great guy he was and how he was better than all those steroid taking assholes
We’ll see
Determined, Jonesing Commentor | Proud proprietor of Wyomingroutes.org & Washingtonhighways.org
I don't think the writers really give this much thought at all.
I like using semi-colons; they make me feel smart.
I agree he was a much better hitter,
but I just dont think he stands a chance as a DH who didnt get particularly close to 500 or 3,000 and didnt play in a World Series.
by FlaskInSafeco on Jan 11, 2009 12:54 PM PST up reply actions
Very good point
Determined, Jonesing Commentor | Proud proprietor of Wyomingroutes.org & Washingtonhighways.org
It's not an argument about his effectiveness
It’sabout his noteworthiness. MLB believes him to be the best DH in history.
by Graham MacAree on Jan 11, 2009 4:13 PM PST up reply actions
Reasonable counter argument
But you’re still talking about giving credence to these “experts.” Maybe the same people who invented the Edgar Martinez award are the ones who vote for HOF. I don’t know.
Awards that should exist:
Johnny Bench Award
Albert Pujols Award
Joe Morgan Award
Alex Rodriguez Award
Mike Schmidt Award
Ted Williams Award
Mickey Mantle Award
Babe Ruth Award
Mariano Rivera Award
by JI on Jan 11, 2009 1:17 PM PST up reply actions
That last one's just silly.
Unless it’s just for relief pitchers generally, but then I might want to name it after Gossage.
I like using semi-colons; they make me feel smart.
'
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Big Z is the MAN.
by .Taylor on Jan 12, 2009 10:07 PM PST up reply actions
I think they all will (and should) get in eventually.
But first the writers have to give them the stern reprimand of making them wait somewhere between several years and a decade.
by FlaskInSafeco on Jan 11, 2009 10:20 AM PST up reply actions
And Jim Caple has a HOF vote?
Sounds about right, he’s one of the better writers out there right now
There was a great article on HOF balloting, regarding the holdout vote.
For HOF calibre players that should be an obvious 100 percent vote in (Babe Ruth, Ted Williams, etc), there is always at least one voter that says no. Does that ring any bells with anybody? I can’t remember the title or locate a link.
Formerly dpseadvr.
Thanks! That was pretty good, and it had a link to the one I was thinking of.
A Posnanski piece for S.I. Oh Rickey, You’re So Fine.
Formerly dpseadvr.
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