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Huzzah! Progress!

This could possibly have gone in today's or tomorrow's OT thread, but this is such big news I think it deserves its own fanpost. Like the title says, this is a big step forward for the likes of me, Brett, and anyone else under 21 who are discriminated against in America and deemed "irresponsible" simply because of our age. 

"College presidents from about 100 of the best-known U.S. universities, including Duke, Dartmouth and Ohio State, are calling on lawmakers to consider lowering the drinking age from 21 to 18, saying current laws actually encourage dangerous binge drinking on campus."

Presidents of prestigous schools such as listed above think the drinking age is bad. This is great as everyone who is either 21 or has been under 21 knows alcohol is still pretty easily accessible if you have friends over 21 (or drive up to Canada like Brett), but yet are barred from places such as bars, concerts, pool halls, or other adult events here in the states, even though 18-20 year olds can smoke, play the lottery, go to strip clubs, buy a gun, buy porn, sign into legal contract, vote, join the army, and most importantly, buy dry ice. 

Here is a quote that states what I mean:

"But the statement makes clear the signers think the current law isn't working, citing a "culture of dangerous, clandestine binge-drinking," and noting that while adults under 21 can vote and enlist in the military, they "are told they are not mature enough to have a beer." "

Of course, with making progress there is always some roadblocks.

"Mothers Against Drunk Driving says lowering the drinking age would lead to more fatal car crashes. It accuses the presidents of misrepresenting science and looking for an easy way out of an inconvenient problem." (facepalm)

Nonetheless, this is still a huge step forward if you have very smart people gathering to propose a debate on the drinking age. 

Here is one more quote from a smart person:

"Moana Jagasia, a Duke University sophomore from Singapore, where the drinking age is lower, said reducing the age in the U.S. could be helpful."There isn't that much difference in maturity between 21 and 18," she said. "If the age is younger, you're getting exposed to it at a younger age, and you don't freak out when you get to campus.""

This is true, and I can't agree more with this statement. Here is the article to read it in full. 

A couple of fun facts: The U.S. is the only country in the world with the drinking age of 21. Also, each state can decide what to make their drinking age, but a law was passed in 1984, saying that if their drinking age is lower than 21, they lose out on 10% of their highway funding. 

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Sorry I just used the pic from the article.

I didn’t know, but I took off the pic anyway.

JI/Robert '08!

by Fin on Aug 19, 2008 6:48 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I was joking.

You probably won’t get banned. This might even get transformed into a beer thread, which brings you much respect in the LL world.

by Faux on Aug 19, 2008 6:49 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Cool, you scared me for a sec.

But yes, I enjoy beer, and I hate I can’t join up with fellow LLers over 21 at a bar because of my age.

JI/Robert '08!

by Fin on Aug 19, 2008 6:55 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Eh, kids will still freak out about beer, no matter if they are able to

purchase it legally at 21 or 18. It isn’t so much the alcohol that creates dangerous situations in college, it’s the freedom to make your own decisions that makes everything possible.

Our country is WAY too conservative to allow a reduction in the drinking age.

by brayden04 on Aug 19, 2008 6:57 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I wouldn't expect this view from someone that's lived abroad.

Considering friends I have in Europe don’t seem to have the same problems when they came out here for college as opposed to normal freshmen. They seemed to attribute it to being used to the drinking culture, but maybe it was more of a permissiveness in general.

by Faux on Aug 19, 2008 7:01 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I'm not saying it's the right view to have,

I’m criticizing us for being so conservative.

I think it’s all how you are raised. My parents were very hands-off, and I chose not to drink in high school. When I went to college, I was used to the freedom (although not used to living on my own) so I didn’t go wild. I barely drank at all actually.

I don’t think lowering the age will do anything positive. I’m inclined to think that kids will have problems with alcohol no matter the legality or what the legal age is.

by brayden04 on Aug 20, 2008 1:50 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I completely agree that the changes (in both a negative and positive sense) would be pretty minimal.

I just think it’s absurd that alcohol is the one thing that people between the ages of 18-20 are forbidden from doing that people over the age of 21 are legally allowed to do. It just doesn’t make any sense.

J.K.L.

by acblue on Aug 20, 2008 1:57 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Like before mentioned

Its discrimination, you are not judging the person’s character when setting the laws. You are simply saying a category of people are deemed irresponsible because something that can’t be controlled by them.

JI/Robert '08!

by Fin on Aug 20, 2008 2:04 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Of course there are people between 18 and 21 who could use alcohol

responsibly. But I do think that most between 18 and 21 (In the United States) would not be able to. I think people between 18-21 in the States are a few levels of maturity behind people 18-21 in Europe. That’s been my experience at least. Europe is just more free in general, and I think that better prepares kids for alcohol use.

Plus in Europe there aren’t as many kids with cars.

by brayden04 on Aug 20, 2008 4:16 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Whoops, forgot about those.

That’s a whole different kettle of fish.

J.K.L.

by acblue on Aug 20, 2008 2:06 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

DOn't forget WA's situation with the Liquor Control Board

I bet they reset the 21 age limit even if the US brought it down to 18.

by Gomez on Aug 19, 2008 10:24 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I hate WA sometimes!!!

That wouldnt surprise me

Oh, how I love other states where liquor isn’t sold in state-owned stores…

by Smith18 on Aug 19, 2008 10:33 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

This is my favorite thing about California.

The day I moved here, I bought a fifth of Albertson’s gin. It was absolutely dreadful — as I knew it would be — but I just had to take advantage of the fact that it was possible.

by Teej on Aug 20, 2008 3:48 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

That is true

The states are the ones that control the age limit, but I am hoping they could be possibly convinced. But even so, I wouldn’t have to go to a different country in order to drink legally.

JI/Robert '08!

by Fin on Aug 19, 2008 10:43 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Also, I watched the local news report on the drinking age thing.

And it seems none of the Washington state schools have joined this movement, yet. The president of UW, the school I am now going to, seems to be against changing the law. Hopefully he’d be convinced if the facts were presented to him.

JI/Robert '08!

by Fin on Aug 20, 2008 2:07 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Me too, I have time though

A year and nine months, so it could still happen in between then.

JI/Robert '08!

by Fin on Aug 19, 2008 7:52 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

This would have been nice about... 14 years ago.

The army still had beer vending machines in the barracks back then, so that was nice.

"Ask them hitters about the curve. They'll tell you. It's Public Enemy Number 1." -Charlie Dressen.

by dpseadv on Aug 19, 2008 8:55 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

There's no way this would happen quickly.

It would need years of social pressure, which doesn’t exist.

by Matthew on Aug 19, 2008 7:43 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The movie industry will suffer

No more underage teenage adventures. If it becomes legal then it just won’t be fun anymore.

by Edgar for Pres on Aug 19, 2008 7:57 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

American Pie would become a historical document of life before 18 year olds could legally drink.

Seriously though, I am sure the movie industry would shift their focus to smoking pot or something else that’s illegal. Well, they already do, but still.

JI/Robert '08!

by Fin on Aug 19, 2008 8:03 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

This is amazing news

I live in a frat so there’s always someone to get it for me, but this will save me money from the occasional douche who wants added money because getting it is a “felony”. Fuckin fratboys…

by WCLittleGiant on Aug 19, 2008 8:20 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

They got rid of the open container law around the time I started working down there.

I’m told they consider leaving the paper on the straw on your daiquiri from the drive-through stand ‘closed’. I’m not risking finding out. It still surprises me when the ice tables full of single beers at the gas stations sell out by noon.

"Ask them hitters about the curve. They'll tell you. It's Public Enemy Number 1." -Charlie Dressen.

by dpseadv on Aug 19, 2008 8:54 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Public disturbances. Drunken driving.

An open-container law obviously doesn’t strike at the root of either problem, but it’s an understandable way to either cut down on problems or at least make it easier to crack down.

by Teej on Aug 20, 2008 3:50 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

If I'm not mistaken, New Orleans as a whole prohibits open containers in public

It’s just that the French Quarter is exempt. And it has to be in a plastic container. I could be wrong.

by Teej on Aug 20, 2008 3:54 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

It must be in a plastic container, yes.

Although it is the FQ that is technically exempt, throughout the city you can get a go-cup. In addition, policemen do not care if you’re walking with a beverage in any of the other neighborhoods. It’s nice to not have to smuggle your drink around. It’s also nice not to have to slam your drink when your friends are ready to leave the bar and you just started sipping your beverage.

Finally, some recognition.

by NOLAmarinergirl on Aug 20, 2008 7:00 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I realize I'm on the far side of this issue, but....

“discriminated against”? That’s a bit strong, doncha think? I fully agree that the drinking age should be 18, but still. It may be an unfair law, but discrimination it isn’t.

Presidents of prestigous schools such as listed above think the drinking age is bad.

Translate as: Presidents of prestigious schools such as listed above want to foist the problem of binge drinking and its effects onto high schools and parents and away from their prestigious universities.

Nice Guys Finish Third - Hopelessly lost, but makin' good time.

by pdb on Aug 19, 2008 9:28 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Well younger people are discriminated in more than just drinking

like higher insurance rates for instance. But yes, its discriminating, because you are putting everyone that is under 21 into one category and saying they are not allowed to do something solely based on that characteristic, regardless of how responsible they are.

Also, people binge drink in high school regardless of the age. I know because I was in high school and I’ve seen it happen. It could be slightly easier for 16 and 17 year olds to obtain alcohol, but people are still drinking in high school regardless of the age limit.

JI/Robert '08!

by Fin on Aug 19, 2008 9:39 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Don't misunderstand, I think it should be 18 as well

but I don’t think that it’s “discrimination” – your description…

you are putting everyone that is under 21 into one category and saying they are not allowed to do something solely based on that characteristic

…is pretty much how all laws work, replacing “under 21” with words like “speeding”, “stealing”, “murdering”, etc. Just because you don’t like a law doesn’t automatically make it discriminatory.

And the insurance thing? Less a matter of discrimination than of decades of evidence that males under 25 are involved in a significantly higher percentage of auto accidents and speeding incidents than those over 25; rates are set accordingly.

And believe me, I know all about binge drinking in high school; me and my friends were the poster children for it. But colleges don’t want it to be their problem any more, so they are recommending that the law be changed to allow 18 year olds to drink; I think it’s a great idea, personally, because while it will never eliminate binge drinking, what it does is make the novelty of it wear off so that when a kid goes off to college for the first time, it’s not also the first time he tastes (and overdoes it with) alcohol.

Nice Guys Finish Third - Hopelessly lost, but makin' good time.

by pdb on Aug 19, 2008 9:51 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

No. You're missing the point.

Murdering and speeding are choices and things a PARTICULAR individual has done. You have no choice to be a particular race, gender or age and classifying someone to have less rights based on criteria outside of their control is discrimination.

by batura on Aug 20, 2008 1:11 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

And many more males under 25 are guilty of speeding and causing accidents.

Insurance companies are basically gambling; they’re betting that you’re not going to get in a car accident. If certain things about your age and gender make it more likely that you’re going to be involved in a car accident, they have every right to charge you more for it. Does it suck for responsible people? Yes it does. But that’s life.

J.K.L.

by acblue on Aug 20, 2008 1:29 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I'm fine with that.

I am fine with a company making its own prices. I am not fine with the government denying rights based on classifications.

by batura on Aug 20, 2008 1:35 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Exactly.

It sucks but it’s completely understandable.

I’m still pissed that my little sister, who is three years younger than me and has been in two accidents of her own fault, pays much less for auto insurance than I do.

by Teej on Aug 20, 2008 3:56 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The law defines 18 as an adult.

It bothers me that it is inconsistent after that. To make someone fully legally liable for their actions but classify them as irresponsible enough to have certain rights due to a class they belong to doesn’t seem right to me.

by batura on Aug 20, 2008 1:33 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Of course it's discrimination.

What if you did a study that found that black people were completely unsafe under the influence of alcohol. You then created a law that stated that states couldn’t receive interstate highway funds if they served alcohol to black people. All the sudden, it would sound a lot like discrimination.

The law is basically stating that a group of people is unfit to handle the same rights and responsibilities as the rest of society. Even though these people are legally adults under the law, and fully responsible for their actions.

by batura on Aug 20, 2008 1:09 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

How? How is it different?

Both define classes and both say a certain group is unfit for responsibility the rest of society has.

by batura on Aug 20, 2008 1:33 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Pretty much as clear as it could be.

Discrimination:
Treatment or consideration based on class or category rather than individual merit; partiality or prejudice: racial discrimination; discrimination against foreigners.

http://www.answers.com/discrimination&r=67

by batura on Aug 20, 2008 1:17 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I think we are retarded to be the only country with the drinking age of 21

If you can vote, why shouldnt you be allowed to drink? Okay that doesnt have much ground…but still, 18 year olds can buy cigarettes and gamble .

16-17 is a bit young but 18 would be fine. If someone really wants it, they’ll find a way to get it. Weed is illegal for everyone but still, people of many ages still obtain it pretty readily.

I wouldnt mind if between 18-20 they had harsher DUI rules than the normal 21. The main probblem wityh young drinking is how their drunkeness affects others. I always thought mid-college was an odd time to finally be allowed to drink. Kids under 21 will still drink and that is where the issue of house parties comes into play. There would be less of those if everyone (well almost…some like me enter college at 17) was just allowed to go to the bars…a designated drinking place. I am sure there may be more of an issue of who’s the designated driver. But it usually is someone over 21 whjo is the DD anyway I found.

I think it would not eliminate binge drinking of course BUT binge drinking would be lowered to high school ages…which most HSers are still under the guardianship of parents which would make it “safer” and more controllable than in college where there are virtually no rules, no parents. Not saying parents can control their kids, they cant always and dont, but they are a heck of a lot easier to control within a mile of their house (or even at theirr house) than possibly states away at college

by Smith18 on Aug 19, 2008 9:58 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I can't agree with you more.

A co-worker from my old work was saying how he preferred to smoke weed because it was easier to obtain than alcohol, since he was under 21, and really, the drug dealer doesn’t care about age. I am sure weed usage could possibly lower if 18-20’s were allowed to drink.

A designated drinking place would also benefit greatly because bars are supposed to stop selling alcohol after the customer purchases a couple drinks or if they are visibly drunk, reducing the amount of binge drinking that happens around 18-20’s. And yes, I would agree that the DUI laws should be made for severe for 18-20’s if this plan ever comes into fruition, because this would be one of the main concerns of the other side.

And your argument about the high schoolers drinking is as good as one could be. High schoolers drink regardless, but if they have to worry about sneaking around parents, it will be much more easily controlled.

JI/Robert '08!

by Fin on Aug 19, 2008 10:16 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Obtaining alcohol isn't the hard part.

It’s being able to hang out in places legally that restrict because of the drinking age.

JI/Robert '08!

by Fin on Aug 19, 2008 10:43 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I look about 25. I've been carded exactly two times

(and one of those, oddly enough, was at the movie theater). Lesson: look older.

by Liebkartoffel on Aug 19, 2008 11:18 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The only thing I could really think is growing out my facial hair. Many people do think I look I am in my early 20s.

But I don’t want to risk the humility I would face being kicked out of a bar because I am under 21.

JI/Robert '08!

by Fin on Aug 19, 2008 11:22 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

As Fin mentioned, 18 year olds can do so much already

that it is rather silly that they not be allowed to drink. However, I’d prefer we do it Canada-style and move the drinking age to 19, thus effectively denying any high schoolers the pleasure.

by Omerta on Aug 19, 2008 11:52 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Well that's the point of the argument.

Is that people bypass the law no matter what the age limit is. Its just that if you lower the age to 18, more people will be inclined to go to bars than house parties, thus putting them in controlled environments where binge drinking wouldn’t occur. And yea, maybe 19 like Canada would be a good idea, if they are worried about it carrying over to the high schools.

JI/Robert '08!

by Fin on Aug 19, 2008 11:59 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Lowering the drinking age is a perfectly reasonable idea.

Even better would be a drastic change in the way alcohol is viewed in our culture. Some people are never going to learn how to drink responsibly; there will always be drunk drivers, alcoholics and binge drinking deaths. Unfortunate, but true. If our priorities weren’t so out of whack, though, it would go a long way towards lessening such occurrences. Alcohol is simultaneously glamorized and demonized, which is as sure a way as any to ensure that people who have no business messing with it will try to do so as soon as possible.

In my family, throughout my childhood and teenage years, the image of “THE DEMON RUM” prevailed. Although the motivations are often different than they were in my household, this sort of thing isn’t all that uncommon. Kids aren’t stupid though, and they know all sorts of people enjoy alcohol with few ill effects. If they’re not getting any constructive advice about responsible alcohol use, though, they figure it out on their own, and the results can be disastrous.

I probably started drinking way too early, but luckily, nothing all that bad happened. I’ve certainly overindulged a time or two hundred in my day as well. I also realized when it was time to grow up, and when I wasn’t capable of going out and getting hammered on a Wednesday night with few ill effects the next day. I still drink, but typically now it’s a beer after work and maybe a beer before bed. (The weekends are a different story, but fuck it, you’re only young once.)

Until we drop this whole “no mixed messages about drugs or alcohol” bullshit that seems to be the prevailing wisdom these days, binge drinking in college will continue to be the rule rather than the exception. And until we enact penalties for drunk driving that are an actual deterrent, drunk driving will continue to be a huge problem. An 18 year old can vote, buy cigarettes, go to a strip club and join the military, but cannot legally buy a six-pack and unwind at home on a Friday night. An adult of legal drinking age can get arrested for DUI, and after 90 days of treatment and no jail time served, they’re allowed to drive a car again. It’s absurd.

J.K.L.

by acblue on Aug 20, 2008 1:25 AM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I completely agree with this

The problem with the drinking age is that the government is denying rights to a group of individuals based on weak science that it protects society.

By addressing the cultural issues, you can avoid the discrimination. Moving the artificial age bar up or down doesn’t change anything other than the age at which people learn to be responsible with alcohol, not the overall impacts the learning process has on society. You change the learning process, you change the impact.

by batura on Aug 20, 2008 1:39 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Agreed.

I was raised by parents who made alcohol available to me but demanded responsibility. I still probably drink more than I ought to, but I learned how to be responsible way before I went to college and was confronted with the “drink as much as you can” culture.

The friends of mine whose lives took the worst turns after high school were the kids who were most guarded as teenagers.

by Teej on Aug 20, 2008 4:03 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

My dad never drank, so I never knew more than what was on TV commercials, which isn't a whole lot.

When I went to a party when I was 14, I was a freshman in high school, and I did end up drinking too much, because I didn’t feel it right away, so I kept going, until I passed out. I apparently almost had to go to the hospital, it was that bad. But fortunately I think since then I learned from my mistake and swore never to drink more than I would need to get a buzz, even though I do at times feel pressured to take more shots or beer than I want to, so I feel that it is the culture of drinking that needs to change too, not just the age limit.

Of course, in Europe don’t they binge drink on special occasions too, like Oktoberfest and such (I don’t know if St. Patrick’s Day is a real Irish holiday or if its just an American holiday.)

JI/Robert '08!

by Fin on Aug 20, 2008 4:27 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Oh yeah, I had a few days where I had to be cared for by friends.

These events might be natural — at least in our country — but they damn sure prevented me from acting like an idiot later in life. You learn your limits. This isn’t so much an argument for a certain drinking age, because I think everyone’s destined to have a night or two when they do something stupid, but it’s nice to get it out of the way at a young age and know where to draw the line. That’s assuming you’re smart enough to learn from it, though. I know a lot of people who aren’t.

by Teej on Aug 20, 2008 4:32 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

It is in Dublin.

About 5 years ago, Dublin realized that the world was full of stupid idiots who thought that green beer equaled St. Patrick’s day and decided to cash in ramp up their Paddy’s Day celebrations accordingly. Now Dublin, an annoyingly touristed city in the best of times, is overrun by douchebags on the 17th March every year, and it sucks. The rest of the country takes a decidedly more “no big deal” view.

Nice Guys Finish Third - Hopelessly lost, but makin' good time.

by pdb on Aug 20, 2008 10:53 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Personally, I think it should be 18 across the board for everything.

Driver’s License, Alcohol, Tobacco, Voting, Military. All of it.

Fear the NPE

by thewyrm on Aug 20, 2008 6:47 AM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

18 for a driver's license I can get behind.

I know for a fact I wasn’t ready for a license at 16.

by BrianL on Aug 20, 2008 9:45 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

As much as I was dying for my driver's license at 16

I can agree that I probably wasn’t ready until I was 18.

JI/Robert '08!

by Fin on Aug 20, 2008 11:01 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I got my license a few days before I turned 18

out of necessity more than anything else. Even then I only drove to school and work.

by BrianL on Aug 20, 2008 2:05 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Really getting your driver's license is kind of hyped up.

I remember sitting at home my first night I got my license. Wasn’t a big deal really, but I still need the car out of necessity, so I don’t take for granted that I can drive. I assume drinking might be the same (even though I plan on a 21 run when I turn 21).

JI/Robert '08!

by Fin on Aug 20, 2008 2:41 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Yea, in my little experience i'd say you're about right

I didnt get my license til I was 17 just cuz it wasnt that big of a deal. It was a necessity since I went to college at 17. But I didnt bring a car until second year, at 18 and I am glad i didnt in hindsight. I look at my sister’s friends (16-18 yr olds) who all have licenses and SHOULDNT. Including her-they just do stupid things like use their car in anger and race out of the driveway just because.
As for drinking being hyped…I will say this. I definitely COULD NOT WAIT until turning 21. All my friends were older and were going to the bars-without me. I couldnt get a beer at Safeco. It’s been about a month (little less) after my birthday and it isnt a huge deal in as much as there are no halos or earth shattering fireworks but it is so nice to go to public places and get a beer. I did go on a 21-run but turning 21 hasnt made me a big drinker except for that. I think I used that up my first yr in college.

by Smith18 on Aug 21, 2008 1:23 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I'll assume you're being honest.

You’re in a small group. Most 16 year olds are in no way ready to handle the responsibility of driving on their own.

by BrianL on Aug 20, 2008 2:04 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I have been in an accident

but it was a unique day. 4 hours sleep, my dad having surgery, road narrower unexpectedly due to construction.

I’m not as dangerous a driver as most my age.

by Mariner John on Aug 20, 2008 3:17 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

It was always fun watching the wrecks that would occur right in front of my high school.

I was loading up the band trailer for a competition after classes let out for the day and saw a sophomore fly down the road at break-neck speed, promptly getting herself into a head-on collision.

by BrianL on Aug 20, 2008 5:44 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

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