Packing it in and fan reaction

by Lents Park Homer on May 9, 2008 10:07 AM PDT Comment 38 comments

At what point should the team reasonably and publicly call it a season?

I'm not being remotely original to suggest that it's time the M's shut it down for 2008, and trade some pieces to try and reload for 2009. Bedard, Sexson, maybe Ibanez, I don't know who else. This has probably been suggested around LL at least 947 times by now.

But apart from some low attendance figures, does it seem to anyone else that there's been relatively little negative reaction, among "mainstream" fans and media, to the team's trainwreck of a season? My point being, publicly throwing in the towel by pulling the trigger on those types of trades seems to me to be very likely to provoke a significantly negative backlash from the fanbase. The earlier in the season the teardown begins, the more likely it is to see, for instance, weekday game attendance falling consistently below the 10,000 mark.

Assuming that those trades must be made, where's the break-even point? Do they wait until the deadline to try and put up the "we're trying" facade for as long as possible, if for no other reason than to try and keep attendance marginally respectable? Or do they just say nuts to it all and start shopping Bedard now? I'll be damned if I know the answer.

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As long was we don't trade away Ichiro or Ibanez,

the vast majority of the fanbase will be entirely oblivious to the situation.

By the way, “throwing in the towel by pulling the trigger” is now my favorite mixed metaphor.

by Liebkartoffel on May 9, 2008 10:20 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

You clearly have not seen the TowelGun 3000.

It is all the craze for homo-erotic gym class towel whipping these days.

...and now I'm here

by Librocrat on May 9, 2008 12:14 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

When you're already hitting historic lows for attendance

what really constitutes a “significantly negative backlash?”

On the other hand, I’m not sure you could put together a Bedard deal and get anything near what you spent on him, plus he is pretty damned good. I know you’ve got to give up value to get value, but that wouldn’t be fun times.

by Two Rs and Two Ls on May 9, 2008 10:23 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Even worse attendance than they're seeing now, I suppose

Also I think the team has to get something, anything, back for Bedard. Unless I missed the part where they signed him to a contract past 2008 – did that happen?

by Lents Park Homer on May 9, 2008 10:29 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

From what I remember

we have him under club control for 2009, if we do not have a contract laid out for him yet.

by Two Rs and Two Ls on May 9, 2008 10:47 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

He's not a free agent until after 2009

by Graham on May 9, 2008 10:52 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

well fuck me in the ear

for not paying attention.

Although, my first reaction is that this may make him more valuable trade bait this season. I only doubt the FO’s ability to creatively construct a roster without him in 2009. Their natural impulse may be to be totally reticent to trade him until the final year of his contract.

by Lents Park Homer on May 9, 2008 11:00 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

If you are trying to reload for 2009

trading away Bedard wouldn’t be the way I’d go….. you’ve shipped off too much as it is to acquire him, and if you really want to make a run weakening the pitching staff to help the offense and defense would be pretty much the same thing as they did this year.

then the problem becomes the guys you want to dump aren’t going to garner you anything of real value. The M’s are kind of in a damned if you do, damned if you don’t situation because they just don’t have much quality to get you anything of real value back in a trade. And there’s not enough there in the Minors that’s ready to come up and be a real contributor at this point.

Midnight Baseball - No Lights - Only in Alaska!

by MfaninAlaska on May 9, 2008 10:24 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

This team has the payroll to avoid a complete roster blowup and reconstruction.

If (and that is a big if) that money can be spent wisely, this team can be a contender in a season or two.

by BrianL on May 9, 2008 10:32 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Note the fallacy in your statement

the Mariners are decent at spending money. Wisely? hmmm.

Nice Guys Finish Third - Hopelessly lost, but makin' good time.

by pdb on May 9, 2008 10:34 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I disagree on the value of the team's potential trade pieces

by Lents Park Homer on May 9, 2008 10:32 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Who do you think is a valuable potential trade piece that you would want to get rid of?

Maybe you’ll get something for Raul. I doubt you’d get much for any of the other older players on the team (that you’d consider trading) unless you start talking JJ or Beltre.

by Jed MC on May 9, 2008 10:48 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Johjima might still be decent trade bait

by Graham on May 9, 2008 10:53 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think he's going to have to regress at least a little bit to be worth much of anything

by seattlebruin on May 9, 2008 10:59 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'm hoping to get back value for Bedard, Sexson

maybe others. I realize this hope may be ill-founded, but it is what it is.

by Lents Park Homer on May 9, 2008 10:57 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

What are you going to get back for Sexson?

He’s owed ~$11M this season, is not under club control next year and has no real skills outside of occasionally hitting the ball a long way. If we got a Ryan Feierabend-level prospect in return for him, I would jump for joy. Basically the only value of trading him would be to get rid of his salary, and as we’ve seen, the M’s have plenty of money to throw around.

by seattlebruin on May 9, 2008 11:02 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Honestly, I haven’t given a lot of thought to exactly who the team can or can’t, should or shouldn’t, trade. I posted this more to try and get people’s feelings on where the line can and should be drawn on the team publicly giving up on 2008, and the economic repercussions in terms of attendance and fan reaction.

by Lents Park Homer on May 9, 2008 11:04 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Any GM who trades for Sexson this season should be hauled into the street and shot.

No one that dumb deserves to live.

I like using semi-colons; they make me feel smart.

by Llewdor on May 9, 2008 12:58 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Sabean?

by acblue on May 9, 2008 1:07 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

News headline: BAVASI TRADES SEXSON FOR SEXSON

The ultimate PTBNL trade

by eponymous_coward on May 9, 2008 1:08 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Since people seem to be oblivious to the situation now

I can see this being entirely accurate. Bleh.

by Lents Park Homer on May 9, 2008 10:26 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

meant to be reply to Liebkartoffel

but i’m too retarded to click the right buttons

by Lents Park Homer on May 9, 2008 10:27 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

It's too early in the season for most people to care

Seattle’s casual fan base doesn’t start noticing the Mariners until the weather gets warm, so by and large the gnashing of blogosphere teeth is an echo chamber – we’re the only ones doing it right now. Come July, when the M’s are dead and buried, casual fans will start noticing, and you’ll start hearing rumblings, but nothing will change dramatically. This is how Seattle rolls.

But, in an encouraging note, there were 22K paid last night for a Felix start, which is a spike from Monday. If only the front office would notice the correlation between good players and attendance.

Nice Guys Finish Third - Hopelessly lost, but makin' good time.

by pdb on May 9, 2008 10:28 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Yes, it's too early

But those same people would pay attention now if the team started actively tearing down the 2008 roster. Could be the difference between 22-25k attendance for a weekday Felix start in June, and 10k attendance for that same game if the casual fan already knows the team has given up.

by Lents Park Homer on May 9, 2008 10:36 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

The problem is

not many other teams are interested in making major changes on their club until there is more definition to who is going to be competitive and who’s not. Major trading doesn’t start taking place until mid-june thru the deadline, so to tear it down now would not be that easy unless you are just power flushing players and bringing up kids…. and the M’s have done that with Wilkerson, Norton – Clement and Wlad.

Midnight Baseball - No Lights - Only in Alaska!

by MfaninAlaska on May 9, 2008 10:40 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Don't forget this is Seattle you're talking about

When a team sucks, people just stop going. It’s not Philly, New York. Chicago, etc. where the fans will be loud and angry when things go bad.

by speedomike on May 9, 2008 12:57 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

I envy Philly in that regard.

Attending an Eagles game is a unique experience.

I like using semi-colons; they make me feel smart.

by Llewdor on May 9, 2008 1:00 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

As long as you like beer showers

by eponymous_coward on May 9, 2008 1:08 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

It's funny how Boston isn't one of those cities even though that is the perception now.

I lived in in the Boston area from 95 to 02 and until the end of 02, you could buy a ticket to any game except the Yankees before the season started. In 97 my buddy and I got to sit in the 2nd row about 30 or 40 feet towards 1st base down the right field line for the 2nd game of the season. Our head was level with Buhner. Even in 01 or 02 you could get good bleacher seats the day of the game.

I don’t even need to go through the Celtics, Patriots, and Bruins when they were bad during that time.

by Jed MC on May 9, 2008 1:33 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

The team will never publically surrender

because then what few fans are still coming and holding out hope will stop, and suddenly those 15K crowds become Montreal Expos “crowds”.

by Gomez on May 9, 2008 1:09 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

I think I speak for myself when I say:

If they get rid of the vets and play some of the promising new kids (hence punting the season) I will probably go more often, because at least I’d have the young players to root for.

...and now I'm here

by Librocrat on May 9, 2008 1:26 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I like using semi-colons; they make me feel smart.

by Llewdor on May 9, 2008 4:31 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I guess it would be nice in the sense you see your team up close, almost like viewing them live from your home

But the problem would be that the team sucks. I guess the Expo did have one year where they were making a run to the playoffs in like 2002, but nothing came of it.

by Fin on May 9, 2008 4:51 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs