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Series Preview: Seattle Mariners @ Detroit Tigers

Tiny by Matthew on in Series Previews Comment 365 comments

Seattle: 18-27
Tigers: 17-27

GAMES

Game 1: Carlos Silva vs Justin Verlander
Game 2: Jarrod Washburn* vs Kenny Rogers*
Game 3: Miguel Batista vs Jeremy Bonderman

Not sure what's going on with Miguel and Jarrod and their rotation slots. The probable pitcher listing has Miguel in game two and game three TBA and since there is an offday Monday the M's could turn to Bedard on game three. But do they have a reason to skip Washburn? No, I mean a reason the Mariners would actually employ? Sucking doesn't cut it with this group.

Justin Verlander was never as good as most people thought after his 18-win season last year and Jeremy Bonderman has been nutters for a few years now. All in all, these match ups look a lot more scary than they actually are.

Star-divide

Likely Starters:
C Ivan Rodriguez
1 Miguel Cabrera
2 Placido Polanco
3 Carlos Guillen
S Edgar Renteria
L Matthew Joyce
C Curtis Granderson
R Magglio Ordonez
D Gary Sheffield

The Tigers problems haven't been in scoring runs. This is a legitimately scary lineup, even Matthew Joyce (who?) is raking the ball. Seeing the slate of pitchers we have going against them, there is good reason to enjoy that winning streak now before this series begins.

CONTEXT

For Jeff Clement/Jeremy Reed/Jose Vidro related hilarity look toward Jeff's post on the matter. The only part that I'll add is something that came to me this morning; that if the Mariners were actually a little smarter and went with Raul at DH and Reed in LF for the foreseeable future, that either sets the stage quite well for the 2009 offseason or sets us up for utter ruin.

Raul at DH is good, he's worth keeping around in that role, worth extending even, though not for more than two years. Reed would be a solid 4th outfielder who might not kill you as a starter, Willie makes a good bench player as the pinch-runner, backup middle infielder and 5th outfielder. Raul takes up the 6th outfield spot. That leaves backup catcher, backup corner infielder and backup masher as spots to fill. Not difficult to do.

That basically leaves just signing Teixeira (and poking around for a LFer better than Reed) as the only move you have to make next winter (leaving aside the sign Felix, Bedard, Beltre issues) to end up with a solid offensive and defensive team. Problem is, Raul is now firmly entrenched at DH, so...Clement? The brilliant offseason sees us either deal off Johjima or dump Burke and go with a 50/50 split in time behind the dish between Clement and Joh. The catastrophic scenario sees Bavasi trade Clement for Griffey, wherein one (or god forbid more) of {Griffey, Ibanez} is plying trade in the field.

WOOOO! Two-game winning streak! Off-Day! House season finale! This calls for lots of beer!

THIS SERIES BROUGHT TO YOU BY:

Expedition Stout
Bells Brewing. Kalamazoo, MI

Pure black pour with a brown head. The aroma has notes of sour and sweet. The flavor is very complex with elements of smoke, cocoa and coffee as to be expected from an imperial stout.

 

 

 

 

Raspberry Eisbock
Kuhnhenn Brewing. Warren, MI

Oh ho ho, not just one sponsor for this series. This is our only trip to Detroit, so you're getting the full bevy of a state that is very much underrated in terms of beer production. Raspberries, chocolate and caramel in this delicious fruit beer that's a bit more of a dessert than a beer you'd want to have many of in a row.

 

 

 

 

Breakfast Stout
Founders Brewing. Grand Rapids, MI

That's right, a beer for each game of the series. If you like coffee taste in your beer, similar to a Kona Porter, than you'll love this. The name is spot on here, if you are going to have beer before noon, this is a perfect one.

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Comments

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Is there any explanation as to Verlander's declining velocity?

His FB has averaged only 92.9mph this year versus ~95mph in his previous seasons. Is he likely hurt, even though he’s denying it?

by Alex B on May 19, 2008 10:25 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

The Tigers continue to deny that he's hurt

but I’m not so sure I believe them. Either way, he’s fucked for a while.

by Jeff on May 19, 2008 11:27 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I hope they enjoyed 2006.

still needs more Bonds

by JI on May 19, 2008 11:30 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah

Very few guys can comfortably throw 100 for an extended period of time without their arm gradually shredding.

by Gomez on May 19, 2008 2:57 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

OH MY GOD WHY DO YOU GUYS DRINK SO MUCH BEER?

I reject your reality and substitute my own!

Also, I'm always down for some online Grand Theft Auto IV or Rock Band. Gamertag: Phildopip

by Phildopip on May 19, 2008 10:44 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

HEY LOOK AT ME ME MARINERS FAN ME GET TO DRINK BEER

AND DRIVE DRUNK AND KILL EVERYBODY HEHEHEHOOHOOHOO

by JI on May 19, 2008 10:46 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ive puked on my mayors lawn on the town i live in

I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me.

by wadswerth on May 19, 2008 3:22 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I downed a quater of a fifth of Barcardi last night

While just staring at that ALCS picture that Jeff posted during the Yankee series a few weekends ago. And was working on a FanPost where I tried to write out the lyrics to “Goodbye Yellow brick Road ” until my friends confiscated my laptop.

by Robert on May 19, 2008 5:38 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Churchill thinks Clement will be traded.

I’m kind of glad we’ve given up on the idea of Griffey as our DH.

by JI on May 19, 2008 10:44 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

You know, given that Joh is probably servicable for the next couple of years

and then we have a few catchers in the minors (say, Adam Moore), I’m not entirely opposed to trading Clement. I just don’t trust Bill Bavasi to get anything worthwhile in return for him.

by seattlebruin on May 19, 2008 11:07 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Let me change it to:

he strongly implied that it would happen before he got a real shot

by JI on May 19, 2008 11:09 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Maybe I'm overeacting

but that’s what I took from his comment.

still needs more Bonds

by JI on May 19, 2008 11:12 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

CORRECT LINK

still needs more Bonds

by JI on May 19, 2008 11:13 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I assume so.

The Johjima signing makes no sense otherwise. I don’t see how they could keep him if they want to, other than at DH where he’s less useful.

...and now I'm here

by Librocrat on May 19, 2008 11:14 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I see Clement as a Darren Daulton typr player

(minus being bat-shit crazy, of course), if he’s moved to DH or 1B, he basically turns into Paul Sorrento. We know the Mariners aren’t going to put up with four years where there’s catcher controversy. We also know they don’t cut ties with veterans until they completely roll of the edge of a cliff, and even then typically only in the last year of a contract. This leads me to believe that it’s only a matter of time until Clement is moved for something useful (or something perceived as useful) to plug up a hole on the roster for an 09 run. The only hope I think we have of keeping him is if the scapegoating of Kenji continues (which has its own racist overtones that are a different discussion altogether), the clubhouse sours and he is run out of town this offseason.

still needs more Bonds

by JI on May 19, 2008 11:27 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'm all for someone convincing they can make Lincoln and Chucky more money

I just don’t see it given their absolute contempt for any school of thought post-1980.

still needs more Bonds

by JI on May 19, 2008 11:40 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

It's a highly variable thing.

Gillick left, he really wasn’t fired, and he left at the perceived height of the team, after the ‘03 season, so we really haven’t seen what the higher ups would do in response to needing a new front office to radically alter the team. In their minds, they didn’t need a departure from Gillick when they hired Bavasi, why would they? They’d just won some 400 games over the last four years and were raking in tons of money.

If the Ms bottom out and win 70-odd games this year and attendance stays low, do we know what Lincoln and Chuck will look for? I don’t doubt that the number one priority for both of them is to make money first, win games second (or third or Xth), but I also don’t think they’re stupid. It’s unlikely they got to the position they’re at by being bad businessmen, and good businessmen don’t see a failing strategy, fire the guy who implemented it, and then hire someone who’s going to use that same strategy.

I’m not saying it’s likely we get a Freidman-style overhaul, just that it’s possible, and it really all begins with that one hire.

by Matthew on May 19, 2008 12:30 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I just don't think they know what good baseball stratgey is

and I am worried they they may just think they were “unlucky” this year. And I worried they think hiring a “nerd” isn’t PR savvy, especially after they have their broadcasters openly mock the methods that successful teams use to win.

still needs more Bonds

by JI on May 19, 2008 12:36 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

The Royals and Pirates figured things out

that’s enough to give me at least a glimmer of hope.

by Jeff on May 19, 2008 12:37 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

They don't need to identify good baseball strategy to hire a good baseball strategist

I highly doubt things like replacement level come up in GM interviews. It’ll be about the new GM convincing them that his way is the best way to make the team financially healthy in the long run.

by Matthew on May 19, 2008 12:38 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Hopefully.

Hopefully they’re not just stubborn old men.

still needs more Bonds

by JI on May 19, 2008 12:40 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't think they're stubborn about the baseball side of things.

I just think that $$ = everything to them.

If the team sucks and attendance reflects that…

by Matthew on May 19, 2008 12:42 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

The attendiance has yet to become dire.

If it does, yeah I see people getting fired. I’m a bit surprised McLaren hasn’t been fired yet.

still needs more Bonds

by JI on May 19, 2008 12:44 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I know we joke that this team's management can't get much worse

and then we say “just wait” and point to McLaren as Hargrove’s replacement or something. But it won’t be much longer before this team actually can’t get much worse. Clement is probably going to be traded, Beltre may not be re-signed… I’m actually not sure how much worse a new FO could be? Beyond trading Felix, there isn’t much else they can do. There are so few players left that even matter.

...and now I'm here

by Librocrat on May 19, 2008 12:13 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

If Peavy's hurt bad, then they too enter the fray

we’re bad, but we’re not bad enough.

by Jeff on May 19, 2008 12:22 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I should also point out

that there’s always a chance that the other teams will pass on Strasburg if another prospect emerges between now and next June. The Padres would almost certainly select him, given that he’s worth of #1 already, is from SD, and is a lifelong Padres fan. If you’re going to make the #1 pick in the draft and there’s a kid like that sitting there, it’s a great PR move and a good baseball move.

by seattlebruin on May 19, 2008 12:24 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

like Lincecum would have been >:(

:(
>:(
>:(
>:(
>:(
>:(
>:(
>:(
>:(
>:(
>:(
>:(

by Matthew on May 19, 2008 12:25 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

And also doesn't mean it wouldn't be awesome

and yes, I’d rather have Adam Jones. And GS52. And hell, Chris Tillman and Tony Butler too. But Baltimore can keep Kam Mickolio if they care that much.

by seattlebruin on May 19, 2008 12:55 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well, the obvious question becomes then

do you think his mechanics leave him more susceptible to injuries down the road?

by seattlebruin on May 19, 2008 3:20 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I have no idea

Nobody else does either. It looks like they should, but we just can’t tell.

by Graham on May 19, 2008 3:22 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

oh the irony

“marriage”

Nice Guys Finish Third - Hopelessly lost, but makin' good time.

by pdb on May 19, 2008 12:34 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I only like this type of irony

when it’s someone else mis-spelling “marriage” :(

by seattlebruin on May 19, 2008 12:36 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I assume you are mocking me

but I cant tell because that seems like the correct way to spell it

still needs more Bonds

by JI on May 19, 2008 12:40 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

It is

I am mocking myself as well as pdb pointed out the incredible irony in my inability to spell the word “marriage” :(

by seattlebruin on May 19, 2008 12:43 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

He got better

in the form of going away.

by Gomez on May 19, 2008 3:18 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

79 OPS+

pitching staff ripe for collaspe

still needs more Bonds

by JI on May 19, 2008 12:22 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

If you don't mention it, perhaps you can pass it off as intentional

like you’re trying to be more family friendly… or get around those amusing curse work blocks, so you use words like “fuking,” “chit,” ”@sshole,” etc.

by seattlebruin on May 19, 2008 12:23 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I agree with you.

We’re just not bad enough.

This is why I look forward to a lineup featuring Vidro, Griffey, and Ibanez.

by Graham on May 19, 2008 12:19 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ah, that's a good point, I hadn't considered drafting.

Though we’re not perfect at that either. But I was asking a serious question. Assuming we do trade Clement and don’t re-sign Beltre. Beyond… what… Triunfel, Wlad and Felix (2 of which I expect this team to trade as is), what else could a new FO do? There aren’t really any players that matter on this team anymore. Most are on the decline, so replacing them with other declining players don’t matter….

I’m really curious… I don’t think even a worse front office would make any difference right now, but maybe I’m not thinking about certain players.

...and now I'm here

by Librocrat on May 19, 2008 12:17 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

*doesn't.

...and now I'm here

by Librocrat on May 19, 2008 12:18 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

You can always do worse

always always always.

No single statement contains more truth.

by Jeff on May 19, 2008 12:18 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well, okay.

I agree. I think I mean what can we do that would matter to anyone. Yeah, we can replace, say, Ibanez with a 47 year old coming out of retirement John Olerud, but who cares? It may be considerably worse, but “considerably” is on such a low end of the graph as to not really matter.

It’s like working for an entire week and your employer only paying you $1.00 total. You can say “it can’t get worse” and then find out that the next week of work you only get paid $.50, so yea, it got worse, but who cares at that point?

...and now I'm here

by Librocrat on May 19, 2008 12:23 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

That's a different question

there’s definitely a diminishing-returns factor when it comes to how we respond to increasingly stupid decisions. (One could argue that we’re already just about maxed out.) But in terms of quantitative team performance, there exists no lower bound.

by Jeff on May 19, 2008 12:26 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah, I agree.

I was asking on more of a “who cares” level. And we’re definitely within one or two trades of reaching the point where it doesn’t really matter what they do anymore, because we’re just going to be bad. Maybe varying degrees of bad, but bad enough that those degrees are irrelevant in terms of caring about this team.

One could argue that a 0 win team would actually be more entertaining than a 40 or 50 win team but that’s another issue.

...and now I'm here

by Librocrat on May 19, 2008 12:30 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think a 0 win team would be the most entertaining thing I've seen

because that’s a level of crapitude (craptitude?) that is completely beyond anything I’ve ever seen in any sport, anywhere.

Nice Guys Finish Third - Hopelessly lost, but makin' good time.

by pdb on May 19, 2008 12:35 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't know

I think that’s too bad, because in order to lose 160+ games, you’d have to basically have a high school team play in the big leagues. It’s fun to watch ineptitude sometimes, but it’s no fun to watch a team get destroyed 15-0 every night.

by Matthew on May 19, 2008 12:40 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think it would be like this season's Dolphins

you’re always on the edge of your seat, because even though you have the #1 pick all locked up, there’s still that drama anytime the game was close after halftime. It’d be the same way – any close game after the 5th or 6th would be must watch TV

by seattlebruin on May 19, 2008 12:44 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah fuck them

I either wanted them to go 0-16 or get their lone win against NE.

still needs more Bonds

by JI on May 19, 2008 12:45 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Oh God, speaking NE,

I drove out to get some lunch and on the way back, there was a guy with a Patriots sticker, two Red Sox stickers, one for 07, one for 04, a license plate holder that said “BOSTON RED SOX 2007 WORLD CHAMPS” and I SWEAR THIS HAPPENED, his license plate was P8RIATZ.

Yes, I live in SD. Red Sox nation, please go back to Massachusetts.

by seattlebruin on May 19, 2008 12:47 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah, I'm pretty sure the '62 Mets set the floor

for how few games a team could win. But still, it’s an intriguing concept.

Nice Guys Finish Third - Hopelessly lost, but makin' good time.

by pdb on May 19, 2008 12:45 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'd like to watch a 0-win team that wins game 1 on September 28th

that would either be the happiest or saddest fan base of all time.

This team is close to leaving us numb and emotionally crippled, but actually getting to that point at which we literally just don’t care anymore…that’s quite a hurdle. Nobody’s dumb enough to trade Felix.

by Jeff on May 19, 2008 12:35 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

If it got to where my team was 0-161

I would root as hard as I possibly could for that final loss. To see something that perfect…there’s not a lot a chances in one’s life to see something like that.

Nice Guys Finish Third - Hopelessly lost, but makin' good time.

by pdb on May 19, 2008 12:40 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

And the best part is that in the 162nd game of the season, down 2-1

entering the bottom of the ninth and facing Jonathan Papelbon, Miguel Cairo would hit a line drive single, followed by Vidro hitting a two run walkoff. When he finally finished circling the bases, Bavasi would already have a new three year extension drafted out for him and ready to sign.

by seattlebruin on May 19, 2008 12:42 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah, don't care anymore = I stop watching games

I doubt that ever happens.

Numb = unfazed by their stupidity. That’s already happened.

by Matthew on May 19, 2008 12:43 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Even the Giants have a player worth watching

but what if, five years down the road or whatever, the M’s look like the Nationals? How do you watch that?

by Jeff on May 19, 2008 12:52 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Drunk.

Nice Guys Finish Third - Hopelessly lost, but makin' good time.

by pdb on May 19, 2008 12:53 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

make Dimirti Young jokes

still needs more Bonds

by JI on May 19, 2008 12:53 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'll cross that bridge if it comes

but yeah, if so, the games not watched to watched ratio would probably swing above one.

by Matthew on May 19, 2008 1:02 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Looking to trade prospects is never a good thing

It doesn’t seem like teams usually do very well when they actively shop their prospects- and given Bavasi’s history, well…no

Determined, Jonesing Commentor

by I'm NOT Corco on May 19, 2008 11:23 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

eh

I think a challenge trade of good prospects can make sense.

still needs more Bonds

by JI on May 19, 2008 11:27 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Washburn

Did his relief appearance last week lead to a shuffling of the rotation?

by G_ on May 19, 2008 11:00 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

One Tree Hill finale tonight!!!!

This finale brought to you by:

Haha Yankee Stadium is going to be awesome

Go Nova

by dbroncos31 on May 19, 2008 11:24 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

They'll probably get him anyway

The same way they got Miller and Porcello

by discovolante on May 19, 2008 2:05 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Slot, baby, slot!

The Tigers don’t care about Selig’s damn slot rules!

by Gomez on May 19, 2008 3:31 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Is that on tonight?

I like midgets more than I should.

by Thingray on May 19, 2008 2:30 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

It sure is.

It will be awesome

by BrianL on May 19, 2008 2:34 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

House.

No question about it.

by BrianL on May 19, 2008 2:35 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Saw your comments on Baker's blog.

His post disappoints me again. Oh well. I did have some fun with the poll on the M’s website.

Couldn’t believe there were no “none of the above” or “bench” options.

...and now I'm here

by Librocrat on May 19, 2008 2:39 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Have you not seen the Willie Bloomquist sex tape?

Scene 3 is the hottest. It’s him, vegetable oil, and dirt.

by Last Fan Of Jose Lopez on May 19, 2008 2:49 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

You obviously haven't seen Scene 2

Bloomquist, Eckstein, Erstad, and every sportswriter in America form the largest orgy in the world

by Last Fan Of Jose Lopez on May 19, 2008 2:52 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

It wasn't because of the grit.

It was because he has too big a head.

Thank you, thank you, I’ll be here all week. Don’t forget to tip the waitress.

...and now I'm here

by Librocrat on May 19, 2008 2:56 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Had trouble sitting for a month. Painful experience.

Not worth talking about.

...and now I'm here

by Librocrat on May 19, 2008 2:50 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Trying something new?

This does not look like an Asian chick to me

by seattlebruin on May 19, 2008 2:51 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

When I see Willie Bloomquist,

have of me wants to take him out, talk to him, be real nice and sweet and treat him right. The other half wonders what his head would look like on a stick

by Last Fan Of Jose Lopez on May 19, 2008 3:11 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I really want to give Baker the benefit of the doubt

but the last month has forced me to give up on him. Either he really doesn’t “get it” or he’s just trying to pick a fight with the blogosphere. Either way it’s lousy journalism.

Even his own blog commenter’s have turned on him. A small handful of people agree with his idea that Vidro > Clement, but most people are calling him on his bullshit now.

by BrianL on May 19, 2008 2:50 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah, it's too bad.

His posts may be poor, but he’s still good at beat writing. He is getting nothing but attacks now so I expect him to resign soon, which is probably why he has had people fill in for him time and again of late.

...and now I'm here

by Librocrat on May 19, 2008 2:51 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

In his defense

very few people thought the team would be this horrendous, and it’s got to be really hard covering a team with playoff aspirations that just falls on its face early in the season like this.

by seattlebruin on May 19, 2008 2:53 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

He makes direct attacks now.

He deserves some backlash. Doesn’t mean he’s bad at his job. I still expect him to quit, considering the frequency of attacks thrown at him on a regular basis.

...and now I'm here

by Librocrat on May 19, 2008 2:55 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'm a little surprised at all the shit Baker gets

Is this his reward for being infinitely better than Pocket Lint and trying to interact with the fans and blogosphere? Sure, he’s not a very good analyst, but so what? He’s a journalist.

by Graham on May 19, 2008 2:57 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

He actually will ask the manager questions posed by the fans.

There are probably 50 people who frequent this site that are much betters analysts than he is. He should stick to beat writing and giving us tours of the ballparks.

still needs more Bonds

by JI on May 19, 2008 3:01 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

This isn't fair

Just because people are better than him at something means he shouldn’t be allowed to try his hand too? Everyone has to learn.

Sure, I give people a lot of grief for coming over here and being stupid, but this is our house and we don’t like getting retard on the carpet. People shouldn’t be getting flamed on their own blogs. Disagreed with, certainly, but the kind of shit Baker gets (and yes, he does bring some of it onto himself but whatever)... that’s just not right.

by Graham on May 19, 2008 3:07 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

but the kind of shit Baker gets (and yes, he does bring some of it onto himself but whatever)... that’s just not right.

I think we here all agree on this, though.

...and now I'm here

by Librocrat on May 19, 2008 3:10 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

yeah

still needs more Bonds

by JI on May 19, 2008 3:15 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think he goes over the line when he calls people losers

and attributes strawman arguments to them.

still needs more Bonds

by JI on May 19, 2008 3:15 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

If I disagree with his analysis

I’ll state why and then back it up. However there are a lot of people there who resort to shit-throwing as opposed to any rational, well-thought argument.

Geoff takes more shit than he deserves, but on the same token, he can ignore it. Some of his debates with Adam were good stuff, but when he resorts to devoting entire blog posts to bashing the idiots who post there his writing quality suffers.

Geoff doesn’t have to be an analyst. He’s a great beat-writer.

by BrianL on May 19, 2008 3:03 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think so too

I can kinda understand why he says what he says. Personally, I’m not sure he really believes a lot of it, because some of it makes no sense at all (Shifting Raul to DH is gonna throw off his game? Uhh, he was our DH for all of 2005)....

He’s a beat writer and his ties to the team are important, he has to have a good relationship with them or he might lose access to some of his sources and whatnot. He has to interact with those people on a daily basis and if he were half as openly critical of them as most of us would like him to be that would make his job much more difficult, and he’d probably be hurting the quality of the unbiased information he provides because his opinions…which is kinda the opposite of what a journalist is trying to do.

by OlSalty on May 19, 2008 3:36 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think it's a direct result of making his site too good a forum for discussion.

For a long time – and for good reason – he promoted open dialogue and he started discussions by presenting some opinion. People agreed, disagreed, etc., but it didn’t matter.

What happened now is that it has come back to bite him. When he openly disagrees with some stats or opinions, and he is clearly wrong, all of those people that used to be participating in open discussion are now attacking him for his incorrect analysis – a direct result of his doing too good a job earlier presenting himself as if he actually is good an analysis, which it turns out he is not.

Now that he is getting attacked, he, too, has become more offensive, and starts to attack back, and the whole thing spirals from there.

...and now I'm here

by Librocrat on May 19, 2008 3:04 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

It's not a result of an open forum.

It’s a result of attacking. The attacking is optional (on both sides).

by Matthew on May 19, 2008 3:13 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I disagree.

Most other times blogs don’t even get commenters at all, let alone 150 a day. But regardless, the conclusion is still the same.

...and now I'm here

by Librocrat on May 19, 2008 3:15 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well also, for a beat writers blog,

Geoff’s is a hell of a lot better than most of the crap out there.

by seattlebruin on May 19, 2008 3:17 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

He's a great beat writer

but my problem is that he’s just picking fights now. If he would just stick to reporting what’s going on in the clubhouse, I’m fine. That’s why I liked Baker’s blog.

Hell, his coverage of the Winter Meetings was fantastic. When he’s doing stuff like that I really enjoy his material.

by BrianL on May 19, 2008 2:55 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I agree, he does pick fights now.

In fact, he has started to actually insult the beliefs of not just the blogosphere but also his own commenters. As I said, he has earned some of the flack he has received, and it has caused the quality of his writing to go down.

That said, his beat writing ability is still good. He is, generally, good at his job. So him leaving is not a good thing. But I expect him to do so anyway, within the not too distant future.

...and now I'm here

by Librocrat on May 19, 2008 2:57 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

So him leaving is not a good thing. But I expect him to do so anyway, within the not too distant future.

At which point we find out that Reed was in fact called up to replace Baker and not Raul.

by Alex B on May 19, 2008 3:31 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well, THAT would qualifiy as "something stupid"

The Mariners have reduced us to this – wondering if the new backup LF is going to be the new beat writer instead

by seattlebruin on May 19, 2008 3:33 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

...

Huh, Geoff?

What the hell happened there yesterday?

by seattlebruin on May 20, 2008 10:04 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

A lot of people (his own followers included) called bullshit

when Geoff suggested Vidro was a better option at DH than Clement, and a better option than shifting Raul to DH and placing Reed in LF.

Now it looks as if he’s gotten very defensive/assholish as a result of the backlash.

by BrianL on May 20, 2008 10:18 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Maybe instead of DRaysBay invasion we should have

Geoff Baker’s blog invasion. Then maybe Geoff will be happy about people who know baseball chatting on his blog… and flaming each other less.

Though the guy who told him to go back to Toronto was amusing.

by seattlebruin on May 20, 2008 10:24 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Link. I could use a laugh. Or a beer.

I’m trying to plan a dinner for my senior friends and one of the girls that I’m supposed to be working with has learned from her new boyfriend that when you don’t get your way, passive-aggressively bitch whine and moan until people get tired of you and give in. The results have not been good.

by seattlebruin on May 20, 2008 10:55 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Meh.

I’m not going to dig into that archive to find it. All that really happened is the statistics I posted were promptly dismissed because Beltre is “unclutch” and a free-swinging loser who is a “bust.”

He promptly hit a game-winning home run that day.

by BrianL on May 20, 2008 10:56 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ugh.

...and now I'm here

by Librocrat on May 20, 2008 11:17 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well...

Dave has never been shy about openly responding to Baker’s comments. But he still likes him and defends him in the comments section of his blog most of the time;

...and now I'm here

by Librocrat on May 20, 2008 11:45 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'm not quite sure why, really.

All he seems to do is attack everything Dave tries to do, including attacking the basic premise of USSM as not understanding what baseball is about.

If he makes a valid point, it’s ignored, and if he openly disagrees, he’s snapped at, usually under the name “some blogs”.

I would say I refuse to go there anymore, but reading that crap is a quick way to wake yourself in the morning, and be alert and ready to drive on NJ highways.

by Faux on May 20, 2008 12:17 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ugh.

...and now I'm here

by Librocrat on May 20, 2008 11:18 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sweet.

If it was on again next Monday I’d miss the end.

I like midgets more than I should.

by Thingray on May 19, 2008 3:55 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Come on man.

Live a little.

I like midgets more than I should.

by Thingray on May 19, 2008 4:22 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Living is bad

it leads to discussions about tuna hotpockets

still needs more Bonds

by JI on May 19, 2008 4:28 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Cameron's butt > Squinty's butt.

I reject your reality and substitute my own!

Also, I'm always down for some online Grand Theft Auto IV or Rock Band. Gamertag: Phildopip

by Phildopip on May 19, 2008 4:22 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

What is that from?

The artist formerly known as Katal

by Katal LM on May 19, 2008 5:36 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't expect it open until 8:59.59

Because, in addition to it being a disaster, some asshole will eventually spoil the episode.

still needs more Bonds

by JI on May 19, 2008 4:23 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

It's not lupus.

I like midgets more than I should.

by Thingray on May 19, 2008 4:24 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

We don't know that yet.

still needs more Bonds

by JI on May 19, 2008 4:28 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Maybe I do....

I have my fingers in many sinister stews.

I like midgets more than I should.

by Thingray on May 19, 2008 4:30 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'm not even going to touch an open House thread.

I’ll stop by after I watch it in peace.

by Matthew on May 19, 2008 4:49 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

The best I could offer would be a

HOLY SHIT! or STFU CAMERON!

during the commercial

still needs more Bonds

by JI on May 19, 2008 4:55 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Fox Sports article

they’ve got a nice little article up about the frugalness of using homegrown talent over high priced free agents.. comparing the big spending teams records against the low payroll teams to this point in the season.

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/8152284/New-ideology-will-be-on-display-this-week-

Midnight Baseball - No Lights - Only in Alaska!

by MfaninAlaska on May 19, 2008 4:56 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

BTW the rerun of OTH was ridiculous today.

Season 1 episode like 6. or 5. whatever.

I’d say what channel it was on, but then I’d have to kill myself

Fantastic episode though

Go Nova

by dbroncos31 on May 19, 2008 5:24 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Ummm,,, so i recovered from the Tequila

That was a poor choice…So? What we drinking tonight?

And Jeff Hamilton hit a HR in the first inning

by laxtonto on May 19, 2008 5:37 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Well i had a great time

was having trouble with trying to figure out what was going on in the gameday thread, but on the LL gameday, thats not anything new

by laxtonto on May 19, 2008 5:45 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Corconcurred

unless beautiful girls are giving out body shots

Determined, Jonesing Commentor

by I'm NOT Corco on May 19, 2008 6:39 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

This is so BS

You can’t just chill in someone else’s hospital room without being family…especially when you’re a convicted murderer

Go Nova

by dbroncos31 on May 19, 2008 6:16 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

fuckin ugly baby

Nathan better start playing ball very soon

Go Nova

by dbroncos31 on May 19, 2008 6:17 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Journey to the Center of the Earth...

Stupid or not stupid? I can’t decide

Go Nova

by dbroncos31 on May 19, 2008 6:18 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

the book? awesome

the upcoming movie? looks decidedly stupid.

by Matthew on May 19, 2008 6:26 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I was gonna say terrible.

But then I saw dinosaurs…so it’s a wash. I am basically a 10 year old child. If I see a dinosaur I get hard

Go Nova

by dbroncos31 on May 19, 2008 6:27 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I hate it when film destroys good literature

so I won’t be seeing it, but it might be fine on its own.

by Matthew on May 19, 2008 6:35 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

YES

basketball and fighting

God listens

Go Nova

by dbroncos31 on May 19, 2008 6:23 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

FUCKKKKKKKKK

he stops playing because his son says its okay. Fuck that shit Nathan

Go Nova

by dbroncos31 on May 19, 2008 6:25 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Make it rain like you fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck

GET THE FUCK OUT LINDSEY YOU SLUT was not supposed to be in caps

godammit this episode sucks donkey dick

Go Nova

by dbroncos31 on May 19, 2008 6:26 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Why are you rooting against him?

"I'm out there Jerry, and I'm llllllovin' every minute of it!"

by Coach Owens on May 19, 2008 6:29 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

But he's from Tacoma!

"I'm out there Jerry, and I'm llllllovin' every minute of it!"

by Coach Owens on May 19, 2008 6:30 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Eh. He's on the Red Sox. Why does it matter where hes from?

Yesterday's Pants
A blog-thingy about the Mariners and stuff.

by BrettJMiller on May 19, 2008 6:34 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

He went to Bellarmine Prep

that makes him doubly loathsome.

He also graduated a year before me. I guess if I had continued playing baseball there is a chance I might have faced him. He was probably varsity the year I was a freshman so I probably never saw him.

The poster formerly known as Matt.

by bluemax on May 19, 2008 6:51 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

he went to Bellarmine Prep?

Screw that fucker

Determined, Jonesing Commentor

by I'm NOT Corco on May 19, 2008 7:11 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Because fuck the red sox that's why

And he probably milks his cancer too much like in the something awful thread

Yesterday's Pants
A blog-thingy about the Mariners and stuff.

by BrettJMiller on May 19, 2008 6:31 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

COME ON ROYALS

FREE JEREMY REED!!

by MFAN on May 19, 2008 6:31 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Jesus

Leadoff walk…pena swing swing

Go Nova

by dbroncos31 on May 19, 2008 6:32 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

GODM DAMMIT CANCER

YOU DONT DESERVE IT.

ESPN-”Lester and Buchholz OMG SPLAAAATTT”

Go Nova

by dbroncos31 on May 19, 2008 6:38 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

ugh, horrendous

made worse by the fact that Lester has been ungood all year and how he has a shiny ERA and a no-no. I’m so glad I don’t follow the MSM.

by Matthew on May 19, 2008 6:40 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Whatever...I'm happy for him..I don't care what you all think

Good for Lester…just avoid all those ESPN channels and it’ll go away.

I fucking hate you Mariners

by kentroyals5 on May 19, 2008 6:42 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Yes basketball!

If this ends up not happening I will be furious

Go Nova

by dbroncos31 on May 19, 2008 6:43 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Oh the stupidity of the Mariners Mailbag!

This from “Kara M.”: “Why is Willie Bloomquist not an everyday player? In my opinion, he is one of the best players on the club and he deserves so much more playing time. He could really help the Mariners so much!”

"I'm out there Jerry, and I'm llllllovin' every minute of it!"

by Coach Owens on May 19, 2008 6:56 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

No Vasgerian tonight?

Is that normal?

still needs more Bonds

by JI on May 19, 2008 7:16 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Must be taking a day off

he sounded pretty fed up over the weekend. Probably just needs a break from that sack of crap team.

by Jeff on May 19, 2008 7:18 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Dave neihaus would have died on three spereate occaisons alredy.

I was hoping for his reaction to the latest Ryan Ludwick homer.

still needs more Bonds

by JI on May 19, 2008 7:21 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I liked the pickup at the time.

But I never expected that he would demand starting.

We have to be the last org on earth that doesn’t understand this concept—or at least understand it enough to see that it’s ok to give these guys significant roles.

still needs more Bonds

by JI on May 19, 2008 7:28 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

and I find it comical

that Cleveland traded one at bat of Juan Gonzalez for him.

still needs more Bonds

by JI on May 19, 2008 7:29 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

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