WTF WUZZZ That???

by PositivePaul on Apr 24, 2008 4:32 PM PDT Comment 73 comments

I just want to vent.

With SBN 2.01049302xxx (or whatever), I've yet to really feel comfortable 'round here. Reloading pages takes WAAAAAY too long during game threads, and the live commenting thing is too wonky for me to use easily -- when I'm trying to catch up, especially...

Those old jeans may have been holey and stained and, well, ugly, but at least they were comfortable. I miss my old LookoutLanding...

This recent spate of site outages has really riled me up, and added fuel to my existing ire towards SBN (not Jeff's fault, of course -- these changes were well above him). I recognize that the SBN admin staff has tried to accommodate our wonky needs 'round here, but man, I'm halfway ready to encourage Jeff to revolt and move this community to a different platform completely.

This new site frustrates me to no avail. Maybe I'm just too old. GET OFF MY LAWN!

0 recs | Comment 73 comments

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If you can't credibly shout "Get off my lawn!"

then you’re not old enough.

by Llewdor on Apr 24, 2008 4:35 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

That wasn't very positive.

I’ve actually adapted to the new format, and it’s not 1/10th as annoying as I feared.

But these system outages are out of control.

by marc w on Apr 24, 2008 4:35 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

And the "updates" make stuff work less well.

Like these nested comment boxes. The boxes are now a fixed size, regardless of whether they’re nested comments, so this box in which I’m typing right now actuall extends beyond the thread frame in two directions. Posting a nested comment creates 2 extra scrollbars.

That can’t be as intended.

by Llewdor on Apr 24, 2008 4:37 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Get a bigger monitor. ;-)

I reject your reality and substitute my own!

by Phildopip on Apr 24, 2008 4:44 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

that's a bug that we'll fix just after we make sure the servers stay up

I'm one of the guys that built the new SB Nation

by clockwerks on Apr 24, 2008 4:59 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

BUSTED

by qrsouther on Apr 24, 2008 7:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Liewdor, what browser and OS are you using?

If you can take a screenshot or give us any further description about what you’re experiencing, I’d appreciate it.

I'm one of four guys who built SB Nation 2.0. We are like the Borg, but friendly and with better features.

by sixfoot6 on Apr 24, 2008 5:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

My computer froze up when I tried to open a gamethread with IE

but I have Firefox tricked out on PCP, and the load times aren’t too offensive—but I can see why I’d cause trouble.

by JI on Apr 24, 2008 5:32 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Sure. IE7.

When I click “reply” on any comment, the comment box that appears is exactly the same width as the comment to which I’m replying. But, it’s indented (like a nested comment), so the comment box extends beyond the fixed-width frame allowed for the comment thread. So, a horizontal scrollbar appears at the bottom of the comment box to let me scroll right and see the rest of it. But that scrollbar blocks my view of the bottom of the comment box, so another scrollbar, this one vertical, appears to allow me to scroll to the bottom of the comment box.

I don’t have a handy place to post a screenshot – I’ll work on that.

by Llewdor on Apr 25, 2008 6:03 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs

I love how you can carpetbomb game threads with comments

that’s made the upgrade worth it.

by JI on Apr 24, 2008 4:59 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Overall, I am happy with the change

The live commenting is a revelation as far as I’m concerned.

The load times are still horrendous and the color scheme for the SBN affiliate links is murder on the eyes, but I have faith those things will improve over time.

by discovolante on Apr 24, 2008 5:09 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

The live commenting is impossible to follow during a game.

So I’ve disabled it, which means that’s one more thing the new format doesn’t do for me.

Did anyone really think the old format was terrible?

by Llewdor on Apr 24, 2008 5:19 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I didn't think it was terrible,

but I like this more. The auto-updating page is, I think, fantastic.

by Teej on Apr 24, 2008 5:24 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

What?

I don’t see how live commenting is impossible to follow unless one’s reading speed fails to compare favourably with a very slow glacier that is in fact not moving at all.

by Graham on Apr 25, 2008 8:18 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

The jumping around makes it too hard to follow

which comments I’ve read. And I do this at work, so my reading speed takes breaks while I do other things.

by Llewdor on Apr 25, 2008 5:58 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

and Fieldgulls is still down :(

Bradtastic!!

by MFAN on Apr 24, 2008 5:09 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

We're being brought back one by one

by Jeff on Apr 24, 2008 5:12 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

"Upgrade our service." Hmmph.

):<

Cheeseburgers are delicious.

by Coach Owens on Apr 24, 2008 5:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Back in the day people didn't need downtime to upgrade

by Fett42 on Apr 24, 2008 5:43 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Back in the day, on the old format, LL and FG were perfect. :(

Cheeseburgers are delicious.

by Coach Owens on Apr 24, 2008 5:45 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

In general I agree

I know I’ve never been that active in the game threads to begin with, but with the format change I’m tending to stay away from them all together. I enjoy the dialogue, subthreads, and humor, but the GTE is way too much now. I feel like theres so much pissing and moaning comments to sift through its not even worth it anymore. Also, my computer just can’t really handle the LL autorefresh, MLB.tv, and gameday at once. I know its really a problem on my end, but it wasn’t a problem on the old format. Outside of game threads, I think the new format looks better and functions fine. I know many of like the current state of the game threads, and thats cool. It just all adds up to me being less and less active in them.

by DCMariner on Apr 24, 2008 5:44 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

About the GTE; what

can you expect from fans who knew all along that the Mariners weren’t going to do well more than the team itself? I think every loss just makes us all more mad since the Bedard traded sapped our farm system so much.

Cheeseburgers are delicious.

by Coach Owens on Apr 24, 2008 5:47 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

My general rule of thumb is add something useful,

or atleast be funny. The endless stream of “Noooooooooooo!!!”, “DIAF!!!!!!!”, and “FUUUUUUCK MCLAAREN!!!!!” are neither. I think GTE can be funny, but it seems like maybe 1 in every 100 of them are entertaining. More often than not I’m just scrolling by them trying to find something else actually worth reading.

by DCMariner on Apr 24, 2008 5:50 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

How is this any different than the older gamethreads?

Gamethreads are not there for for reading content.

by JI on Apr 24, 2008 5:52 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

It's waaaay more nasty in tone than it ever has been

used to be funny, now mostly not. I understand the concept of GTE, but I also understand the concept of perspective.

Nice Guys Finish Third - Hopelessly lost, but makin' good time.

by pdb on Apr 24, 2008 5:59 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Glad it's not just me.

Even if the content’s never really changed, some of it is probably just getting old and less funny with repeated uses. I’m all for hilarious GTE. It’s just so rare. Maybe that’s what makes it so good?

by DCMariner on Apr 24, 2008 6:10 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think some of the new people are trying to out do the regulars?

People should type in all caps for the sake of typing in all caps. When I say fuck you Squinty, it’s not to get a rise, it’s because I mean it.

by JI on Apr 24, 2008 6:12 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I call it the Coach phenomenon

Not to be confused with the Corco phenomenon

by Robert on Apr 24, 2008 6:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'm beginning to dislike game threads myself

by Jeff on Apr 24, 2008 6:16 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think its becoming fake

Like people are thinking about how to make something that fits the ‘mold’ of GTE, rather than posting something off the top of their head that’s actually funny.

by Fett42 on Apr 24, 2008 6:18 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Bingo

People suck.

by Jeff on Apr 24, 2008 6:24 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Amen, brother

Nice Guys Finish Third - Hopelessly lost, but makin' good time.

by pdb on Apr 24, 2008 6:25 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

To over think it a bit

Maybe giving GTE a title and whatnot makes it seem like a blank permission slip to whatever. Where I think the original intent was to explain a phenomenon (the instantaneous vitriol that can be produced midgame), people have taken it as an excuse to act that way. Again, I’m thankful for the great service Jeff does in running this ship and for 99% of the comments I read here. I love the stat thread and the beer thread equally. I want to know whats up with Ritchie and I also want to know when someone makes an excellent photoshop of Bavasi getting drawn and quatered. It’s a great place. I have no problem generally steering clear of game threads if they just dont do it for me.

by DCMariner on Apr 24, 2008 6:25 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

It was

three or four non regulars that were saying all kinds of creepy stuff last game. Hopefully our scolding of them fixes that.

It’s amazing that LL can have it’s best / worst thread in the span of a week and a half.

by JI on Apr 24, 2008 6:29 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I gotta say

from what I’ve seen Boise’s been making some excellent gamethread posts. His Felix day stuff was excellent, and one of the reasons I havent given up on game threads completely.

by DCMariner on Apr 24, 2008 6:33 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yeah I know.

I think it’s slightly different for 2 reasons. 1) It’s simply easier to make comments. So therefor whenever anything happens, theres a mad rush to spew explitives as the entire mariner online community spasms onto their keyboards. I know there was GTE bofore, but it certainly seems like there more on the new format. And 2) My old system of game watching had me watching MLB.tv, then flipping over to LL for the gamethread and refreshing during a lull in the action. Now if i leave on autorefresh, it grinds my MLB.tv to a halt whenever anything happens as comments pour in, or i turn off the refresh and wait a day and a half for the page to reload manually. It all just adds up to me being less interested in the gamethreads than I use to be. I know I sound like some crotchety old guy, and I won’t belabor the point. It just seemed like this thread was as good as any to mention some of my dislikes about the new format.

by DCMariner on Apr 24, 2008 6:00 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

really?

mine grind to a halt once the thread is loading but after that it’s fine.

by JI on Apr 24, 2008 6:11 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

yeah,

grinds to a halt may be an overstatement, but it gets pretty choppy and pretty much unwatchable. My work computer is horrible and my personal one is beginning to show its age after almost 6 years.(6? yikes, I remember working all summer to save up for it before college started like it was last year). I know I can’t really be upset that the website is moving forward while I’m the one lagging behind, but dammit I can still be bitter.

by DCMariner on Apr 24, 2008 6:29 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I fear change

but I don’t really mind the new format at all.

by Fett42 on Apr 24, 2008 5:46 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Performance issues, aside...

Another thing that seems to be a nasty side effect of the centralized user ID is precisely what Jeff is trying to put a halt to in the intro to today’s game thread.

Seriously—the trolling and annoying comments have increased 3-or-4-fold since the launch of the new format. The site performance issue (I had to upgrade my browser to FF3 Beta for a refresh of LL not to take over my entire computer resources, whereas before, it really wasn’t much of a problem) aside, I really don’t like what it’s done to the community.

Honestly, I’ve spent MUCH less time over here since then upgrade, and I can’t exactly enunciate why exactly I feel much, much less a part of the community, but I do and it sorta bothers me.

Ill Ligitamus Non Carberendum

by PositivePaul on Apr 24, 2008 6:20 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Some people are trying too hard... and/or people in general try too hard sometimes

Game threads work when everyone speaks their mind naturally and doesn’t try to force anything. A lot of the over-the-line stuff is a product of people trying to make waves with shock value for shock’s sake, and fortunately we’re now actively trying to avoid that and get back to reacting and just letting things happen naturally.

Of course, game threads also work when the servers and web interface works, and when they don’t, then yeah, that screws everything up.

by Gomez on Apr 24, 2008 11:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Too many new people

by Graham on Apr 24, 2008 11:33 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Hehe

Veteran commenters (who have been through wars) only please.

*tongue-in-cheek

by Alex B on Apr 25, 2008 4:09 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Didn't the outages happen because their RAM exploded?

I think that’s more of a random unforeseen occurrence than a consequence of a bad upgrade.

by Gomez on Apr 24, 2008 10:49 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

I'd wager that they knew the upgrade was going to use way more physical resources

and put a ton more strain on the RAM than the old interface

Determined, Jonesing Commentor

by I'm NOT Corco on Apr 24, 2008 11:02 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Weren't they switching servers too?

Maybe they switched to a server with some bad hardware.

Not that I’m defending anybody… just trying to make some more sense of this garbage sequence of events.

by Gomez on Apr 24, 2008 11:25 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

An idea.

Maybe it’s time to take a break from the game threads for a bit. Like a week. Just to give the community some time to straighten out a little.

I propose a week where we have no game threads at all. Just a series preview, and a recap after the game. No threads on the main page, and no threads in the diaries. No Felix Day’s, no nothing for a week.

We need to do something. Because I completely agree that the community is starting to lose it’s grip a little. And I really really really don’t want to lose it.

Felix Hernandez may be The King, but Justin Upton is a GOD.

by Goose on Apr 25, 2008 2:09 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Seconded

Game threads reached their peak last year, in my opinion. There were some truly historic, great events. Now it’s just over the time, as has been mentioned a billion times. I think it started to reach it’s tipping point during the Bedard trade. People lost their shit.

by okdan on Apr 25, 2008 3:41 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I don't have a problem with people losing their shit.

Hell, people freaking out have made some pretty glorious moments too. The Soriano-HoRam trade thread(entitled “Balls”) is easily one of my top 10 favorite threads of all time. Because we were all going apeshit, and it’s just HILARIOUS to go back and read now.

People yelling and screaming FUCK! and it’s variants during frustrating moments has ALWAYS been a part of GTE and the game threads. The natural frustration and anguish that comes with a Mariners game.

So I don’t have any problem with any of that.

Felix Hernandez may be The King, but Justin Upton is a GOD.

by Goose on Apr 25, 2008 7:47 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I don't think that an exclamation of FUCK is the problem

at least for me, the general tone of the game threads has gone from bitingly funny to just kind of unpleasant; people used to at least be creative with their epithets, now it’s seemingly a race to see who can post DIAF first or something.

Losing one’s shit is a fine thing – it just used to be funnier.

Nice Guys Finish Third - Hopelessly lost, but makin' good time.

by pdb on Apr 25, 2008 8:00 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

The problem appears to be people posting stuff because they think it's clever to be vile/over the top

I haven’t been in game threads much recently, what with the combination of time zones, food poisoning, and exams, so I (fortunately) haven’t seen too much of the crap. As Goose says, game threads basically are places for us to lose it with anger/happiness, and that’s the way they always have been.

Anyway, onto my take on this whole situation:

LL is supposed to be a self policing community and that people should really just rip the crap out of anyone acting inappropriately on the site (and if I’m not around, someone else can do it). Waiting for Jeff to come around to clean things up isn’t fair on him, and it’s not the way we do things around here. If nobody feels comfortable with harassing idiots until they leave, under the ‘actions’ link at the bottom of each comment is a flag button, which will alert the moderators to inappropriate comments/trolling/whatever. Use it.

by Graham on Apr 25, 2008 8:01 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I agree

It almost makes me want to start reading game threads, just so I can harass morons. But definitely, use the “flag” button if someone goes over the line.

I made passing reference to it yesterday, and it bears repeating – this site is streets ahead of other blogs in the quality of its commenters – one of the things that keeps me coming back here is the quality of the wit, in addition to the excellent baseball content – and I want it to stay that way and will actively do what I can to keep it that way.

Nice Guys Finish Third - Hopelessly lost, but makin' good time.

by pdb on Apr 25, 2008 8:07 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Exactly...

this site is streets ahead of other blogs in the quality of its commenters – one of the things that keeps me coming back here is the quality of the wit, in addition to the excellent baseball content – and I want it to stay that way and will actively do what I can to keep it that way.

This is precisely why I wrote this ~~FanPost~~ Diary, dammit! Since the switchover, I’ve noticed a huge drop in the quality and a huge change in the atmosphere around here. I didn’t like that, so I said something.

Ill Ligitamus Non Carberendum

by PositivePaul on Apr 25, 2008 8:56 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

When I say "Drop in quality"

I don’t mean in the main posts—I’m talking about the sub-thread discussion and the community. I’ve somehow felt less and less a part of this community, and since I’ve been visiting this blog since darn near day one (talking about the L43/FireBavasi/L43/LookoutLanding1/LL2 days), I’m not sure I’m really happy about that…

Ill Ligitamus Non Carberendum

by PositivePaul on Apr 25, 2008 9:00 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'll put it the way DMZ put it:

The closer you get to stream-of-consciousness, the worse the quality of discussion.

Auto-refresh is a blessing and a burden.

I wish we could limit the auto-refreshing to game threads.

by Jeff on Apr 25, 2008 9:10 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs

We still love you anyway

by Graham on Apr 25, 2008 9:43 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

You're not berating me enough.

I don’t feel welcome enough.

Ill Ligitamus Non Carberendum

by PositivePaul on Apr 25, 2008 3:38 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Not fooled

Graham’s more machine than man now

by Fett42 on Apr 25, 2008 3:45 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Oh hey, the flag button

Thanks for reminding me. I actually completely forgot about it.

by Gomez on Apr 25, 2008 9:26 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Me too.

I forget to rec things too.

I fail at SBN 2.0.

I reject your reality and substitute my own!

by Phildopip on Apr 25, 2008 10:32 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

It's an acquired taste

I do remember to rec posts. Does that make me a positive thinker?

by Gomez on Apr 25, 2008 12:44 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'm not sure, but I haven't figured out how to do any of that stuff yet.

We need a new instructional link for blog idiots like me.

I like midgets more than I should.

by Thingray on Apr 25, 2008 1:22 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Click "actions"

on a post and you’ll see two options, “Flag” and “Rec”. Click. Rec. Done. You can unrec or unflag by clicking a second time.

Nice Guys Finish Third - Hopelessly lost, but makin' good time.

by pdb on Apr 25, 2008 3:03 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I've thought about this several times

there’s actually a rule in the SBN contract that we have to have an open thread every day, but I think they’d understand if we took a temporary break.

However, last night was a step in the right direction. If that can keep up then I think I can avoid having to do anything rash.

by Jeff on Apr 25, 2008 8:58 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Given last night's thread (SSS, I know, but...)

I don’t think we’ll need to go that far. That we’re actively discussing and addressing the issue is also positive.

by Gomez on Apr 25, 2008 9:35 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yeah

I followed last nights thread and it was pretty entertaining. The game however . . .

by DCMariner on Apr 25, 2008 9:57 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

really?

that’s not actually enforced though- there’s tons of SBN blogs that don’t even post every day

Determined, Jonesing Commentor

by I'm NOT Corco on Apr 25, 2008 11:45 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Every game day I mean

by Jeff on Apr 25, 2008 12:19 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Ah, I see

Determined, Jonesing Commentor

by I'm NOT Corco on Apr 25, 2008 12:53 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Uh

So I meant to say, “Now it’s just over the line…”

I think.

by okdan on Apr 25, 2008 3:42 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

I haven't participated in a game thread

since the new site started. Every time i try to get involved in one my computer blows up. I thought i just had shitty computer, but I’m glad to see that’s only part of the problem.

by WCLittleGiant on Apr 25, 2008 6:10 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Same thing here

I have a combination of a shitty PC, shitty connection, and a shitty website. I can’t handle the game threads anymore. It’s just too much. Too many posts, too much is forced and not kneejerk creativity. Hopefully things will work themselves out though.

by AZSEAfan on Apr 25, 2008 11:41 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs