Geoff Baker is dead to me

by hcoguy on Aug 1, 2007 1:02 PM PDT

Go read his new blog entry. I have to go to work and am too disgusted to attempt to critique it. Some highlights: He specifically denounces those who gave Bavasi a "standing ovation" (hmm where did that come from?), He goes on and on about how perfect Gagne is and points to all the "holes" in the pen. The funny one is mentioning Lowe's surgery but neglecting Gagne's. He wants us to count all the blown leads after a starter leaves the game and blame it on standing pat at the deadline. That should be easy, they can probably get counted on the left hand of a disfigured fireworks stand salesman. I hate going to work pissed off.

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I thought about writing a point-by-point

critique of his post, but decided against it. Too many people have written similar screeds, with little to show for it.

Not unlike Buttercup, Geoff Baker keeps building me up with pretty decent posts on his blog, only to let me down with nonsense like today's entry.

by Katal LM on Aug 1, 2007 1:07 PM PDT reply actions

I agree

I am getting so sick of him preaching this. There are so many reasons to take shots at this org, yet he rags on Bavasi for not getting an Al Reyes.

by Zack on Aug 1, 2007 1:09 PM PDT reply actions

Question

What was the general Blog response to the Mariners not making a deadline trade in the Gillick years, mainly 2003?

by Robert on Aug 1, 2007 1:10 PM PDT reply actions

Was there a blog response?

I just tried digging through USSM's archives, and couldn't find a single post about the 2003 deadline. Entry #408 was from 7/1 and about TicketMaster, while #409 was from late August, and also dealt with TicketMaster.

I can't get to the Leone For Third archives, either.

SportSpot didn't exist back then, either... There were the AOL Message Boards, but those don't count.

Does anyone remember the online reaction to the '03 deadline?

by Katal LM on Aug 1, 2007 1:22 PM PDT up reply actions

Yes, and it can be summed up in one word

"BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO"

"Players have two things to do. Play and keep their mouths shut." - Sparky Anderson

by Omerta on Aug 1, 2007 10:33 PM PDT up reply actions

I'm guessing a shrug

There was very little talent available in 2003, and the one who got away (Aaron Boone) would have made no difference (and the only reason they lost him was that the Yankees sent the Reds a wheelbarrow of cash and took back all of the Reds' bad contracts).

by G_ on Aug 1, 2007 1:45 PM PDT up reply actions

I still like Baker for other reasons

and he's entitled to his opinion, but he needs to realize that blowing leads in the 8th and 9th happen, and this team will probably blow a couple more of those down the stretch, adding Gagne wouldn't change that. Baker mentions that lefties have hit Green hard and that Sherrill has only been a LOOGY before this season. Doesn't that make them the perfect fit for the 8th?? Green vs. righties, Sherrill vs lefties.

This organization is filled with relievers that throw strikes and can get outs. If Lowe does get hurt a guy like Huber can fill in, Huber had no problems has the set-up man in September last season. I would also mention Mikolio(sp??) but he's never thrown an inning in the majors, so it's probably unfair to count on him as a top set-up man.

WHAT ARE YOU DOING JOHNNY MAC?!?!

by MFAN on Aug 1, 2007 1:24 PM PDT reply actions

Geoff Baker will come around. He's not there yet.

Remember, this is the same guy that defended Hargrove's use of Julio Mateo to get a groundball.

He makes some interesting points but ends up falling back on specific situations where going out to acquire an "impact player" actually worked. However, he does not go over why the "impact player" worked for the team. Plus, his example is Shannon Stewart from the Twins who is a hitter, not a relief pitcher.

I think most of us agree that it's pretty silly to think that acquiring a relief pitcher will put us over the top. Despite all the "problems" Baker mentioned about the bullpen (one college graduate, one coming off an injury, on who is a lefty specialist, etc) it's not what is costing us games.

Having Octavio Dotel or Eric Gagne in the bullpen doesn't change the fact that you still have Raul Ibanez patrolling Left Field and clogging up the lineup along side Richie Sexson. There is no bigger potential upgrade for the team than calling up Adam Jones. That's the move that needs to be made.

by ThundaPC on Aug 1, 2007 1:27 PM PDT reply actions

I'll say it again

Baker has his beliefs, and some of those agree with us and some of them disagree with us. This was one of those instances where his ideas clashed with the blogosphere's ideas. Given he and we all heartily agree on several things, I don't see how crucifying him for disagreement on trades, especially given he does not control the FO in any real way, is at all productive.

Give the anger some time to subside and let's see what he says as this passes and the season progresses.

by Gomez on Aug 1, 2007 1:29 PM PDT reply actions

Obviously you don't understand the internets

We all have to agree. On everything. All the time. If someone writes something different, BURN THEM AT THE STAKE!!!!

Remember, individuality is fine, as long as we all do it together.

Nice Guys Finish Third - Hopelessly lost, but makin' good time.

by pdb on Aug 1, 2007 1:32 PM PDT up reply actions

Because you're special... just like everyone else

We don't subvert the dominant paradigm around here, because it's dominant for a reason.

by Gomez on Aug 1, 2007 1:35 PM PDT up reply actions

Completely off topic

On Capitol Hill, through most of the 90's that little mini-mart at 15th & Mercer, across from Walgreens, used to be a lesbian collective book store (Red & Black Books).

In addition to the books you'd expect to find at a radical lesbian bookstore, they also had a bunch of bumperstickers behind the counter for sale, and one of their most popular sellers was "Subvert the Dominant Paradigm".

I always thought that a bumper sticker that required the viewer to put in that much thought (there's too many variables there - subvert how? Whose paradigm is dominant?) probably wasn't an effective bumpersticker.

Nice Guys Finish Third - Hopelessly lost, but makin' good time.

by pdb on Aug 1, 2007 1:40 PM PDT up reply actions

Yeah

It's like those activists' cars that had like 45 clever bumper stickers on the back. How in the hell am I supposed to read all of those before the light turns green and you take off? Brevity is the soul of wit, like I told Coach in that other thread, and when there's that much white noise on the back of your car, each clever message means less as they get obscured by the others.

by Gomez on Aug 1, 2007 1:44 PM PDT up reply actions

Baker

The problem with Baker is he has been writing the same blog entry for the past week, and it was wrong then and it's still wrong today and writing 2500 word blog entires isn't going to change that.

by thepull on Aug 1, 2007 1:35 PM PDT reply actions

There is no problem with Baker....

He's awesome...unlike Raul!!!

by Rizo on Aug 1, 2007 1:41 PM PDT reply actions

He has his slip-ups...

but he's leagues ahead of what we'd been used to from the much of the local media. He doesn't always "get it" in the same way the rest of the blogosphere wants him to, but he seems to think about what's going on much of the time and will at least entertain multiple viewpoints rather than just shut them out.

"Ever tried? Ever failed? No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better." -- Samuel Beckett

by JY on Aug 1, 2007 1:50 PM PDT reply actions

We'll miss him in 2 years

when he jumps to a NY, LA, or Chicago newspaper, and the Times will replace him with a Pocket Lint-type.

by G_ on Aug 1, 2007 1:55 PM PDT reply actions

I read this

As 'Geoff Baker is dad to me' and was really confused.

by Graham MacAree on Aug 1, 2007 1:56 PM PDT reply actions

meh.

He's way off-base on this one, and it's all the more exacerbating because he's been on this podium for a good week and a half now. Not to mention his tone which I feel is, at times, belittling and patronizing to those who disagree with him on this.

Still, it's nice to hear from the other side. I admit that he's helped me better understand the FO reasoning for pursuing another arm for the pen, even if I don't agree with it. And, to be honest, can you imagine how annoying LL and USSM must be to those that don't agree with the analysis? It's not like we're particularly courteous to those that don't agree with us.

by sammy on Aug 1, 2007 2:26 PM PDT reply actions

But....we're right ;)

I fucking hate you Mariners

by kentroyals5 on Aug 1, 2007 2:27 PM PDT up reply actions

Particularly Curteous?

I thank god everyday that I live in Alaska and not anywhere close to quite a few of the posters here, less I would be found strapped to concrete blocks at the bottom of Lake Washington for my indifference towards Adam Jones.

by MfaninAlaska on Aug 1, 2007 2:45 PM PDT up reply actions

Alaska's a big place,

But you can't hide from my ninjas forever, MFIA...

Actually, it's pretty good to hear an opposing argument, as long as it's logical and reasonable.

by Graham MacAree on Aug 1, 2007 2:47 PM PDT up reply actions

Geofff might be off-base on this one

but I think we are fortunate to have him. Cut him some slack.

by JI on Aug 1, 2007 2:44 PM PDT reply actions

Could be worse

Finnegan could still be "reporting" on the M's.

Nice Guys Finish Third - Hopelessly lost, but makin' good time.

by pdb on Aug 1, 2007 2:47 PM PDT up reply actions

Gagne was

..the hyped-up, sexy potential trade acquisition before the non-waiver deadline for this year. In 2010, when Gagne is out of the major leagues for good (prediction), there'll be another guy who gets hyped up and whpm the media goes gaga over because he's trade fodder for a non-contending team, and has been heard of because he had a run of success for a big market team.

by buckwheat on Aug 1, 2007 3:22 PM PDT reply actions

I agree we shouldn't praise Bavasi for anything

he did before the trade deadline. Just because he didnt make a move doesn't mean we should be happy about it.

Many GM's know how to fleece teams, some don't have a clue. The fact that we happen to have on that doesn't really have a clue isn't reason to celebrate anything.

by TheMarinator on Aug 1, 2007 4:06 PM PDT reply actions

EXTREMELY Low Expectations...

I mean, yeah, in Bavasi's case, it's a HUGE step forward when he actually stops himself from making a panic move.

Look. I think everyone's disappointed that the M's didn't change the team by making a trade. There are lots of guys that could help the M's make a serious run at the playoffs. However, a lot of those people were not available in the trade market, let alone for any of the prospects we may have been willing to surrender.

It was a pretty crappy trade market anyway, and I, for one, am certainly very happy Bavasi didn't make a move just because he felt like he had to.

That, to me, is definitely praiseworthy, and actually somewhat NEWS worthy. Bavasi NOT being an idiot is definitely something to celebrate!

As weird as that sounds...

RAUL HURTS THIS TEAM BY NOT PLAYING DRUMS FOR SPINAL TAP Oh, and Free Kam Mickolio!

by PositivePaul on Aug 1, 2007 4:23 PM PDT up reply actions

He's right - in a sense

A pitcher would have made the M's better this year. As bad as Willis, Morris, etc are going forward, they're better than Ho and probably Weaver right now. But I'm still happy no move was made. I don't think the M's have a realistic shot at the playoffs, and I don't think Morris or Willis would have made the difference. And, especially in the case of Morris, he's going to be a problem going forward.

So I'm happy the M's didn't trade a prospect who could be used in the offseason to actually improve the team for the long run, and more importantly, for next year when it might matter.

by billT on Aug 1, 2007 4:27 PM PDT reply actions

He's dead to me too...

I haven't agreed with 99% of the stuff he's said in the past few months. It's sad.

*Call up Wladam Jonentien!!!*

by SethGrandpa on Aug 1, 2007 4:38 PM PDT reply actions

This is a silly, silly diary entry.

Wow, Baker disagrees with most M's fans (myself included) on this one point. MAY HE BE SMOTE BY A VENGEFUL GOD!!!11eleven1!!

Seriously, Baker is a smart guy who gives M's fans TONS of blog content (he's waaay ahead of most beat writers in that regard except Joe Posnanski in KC and Barry Svrluga in Washington), responds to input and questions, and generally has his head screwed on straight. This sort of snitty, foot-stomping excommunication is just wrongheaded.

Yes, I think Baker is wrong about the M's bullpen issues. But given the general quality of coverage in the print MSM it's remarkably ungrateful to not embrace him.

by esoteric on Aug 1, 2007 5:59 PM PDT reply actions

Didn't read this before posting

Well said, much better than I did.

by Dylan @ Lookout Landing on Aug 1, 2007 6:25 PM PDT up reply actions

Then don't read it.

by hcoguy on Aug 2, 2007 12:01 AM PDT up reply actions

Furthermore

Its not disagreement that irked most people with his recent post, it is his direct attacks at the blogosphere in general that were snooty and condescending.

by hcoguy on Aug 2, 2007 12:03 AM PDT up reply actions

Seattle Fans

have got to be the most wishy washy finnicky fans in baseball. A month ago everyone loved Baker. He disagrees with not trading for someone and he's the devil.

by Dylan @ Lookout Landing on Aug 1, 2007 6:24 PM PDT reply actions

What is hyperbole?

by hcoguy on Aug 2, 2007 12:01 AM PDT up reply actions

i believ that hyperbole is an old, old wooden ship

used in the civil war

by thenatural on Aug 2, 2007 12:32 AM PDT up reply actions

No, my comment was not

hyperbole. Go back and look at any archives held here or at USSM. The tone of the general public who posts on these boards is all over the place. One minute the M's are great, the next minute there is no point watching them.

by Dylan @ Lookout Landing on Aug 2, 2007 6:12 AM PDT up reply actions

most, everyone, he's the devil

right.

You take the game thread stuff too seriously.

by hcoguy on Aug 2, 2007 11:38 AM PDT up reply actions

game thread emotion

by Eldukey on Aug 2, 2007 11:54 AM PDT up reply actions

I'm glad...

That we have a guy like Baker, who even though he has an opinion that I don't agree with, I respect the fact that he has his reasons and his reasons don't consist of... "ooh, that guy is SOOO clutch"

I disagree with him, but it actually raises my respect for him because at least he comes to his bad conclusions in a good way, which bodes well for his overall decision making process.

by jullberg on Aug 1, 2007 11:12 PM PDT reply actions