M's trade for Jason Davis

Do I think the Indians got the better deal in the Cabrera/Perez and Broussard/Choo trades?? Yes I do, but I wouldn't call it a robbery in any way.

Cabrera was blocked, Lopez and Betancourt are going to be here for many years..so I don't see where he was going to play?  I think we could of gotten more than Eduardo Perez, but I also doubt that Cabrera was ever going to break through in Seattle.

What has Choo done? He's been back and forth from the big leauge club to the minors a few times already.  I doubt he's really even considered a prospect anymore to be honest.  If Choo ever becomes more than a league average hitter/outfielder I'll be surprised.

I do think the Indians got the better end of the deals, but I would not call them steals by any means, however I have been wrong before, so I could easily be wrong here.

I used to have a lot of respect for Indians fans, but if the kids at LGT and Sickel's blog are any indication, they're idiots.

Right, Indian Fans, Bavasi is not a good GM. That doesn't mean you're getting Jones or Tillman.

btw, like another poster said, I saw what you wrote at Sickel's site, Goose. Way to represent.

Like any team, we're going to have some very knowledgable fans, many deeply ignorant fans, quite a few who know just enough to be dangerous, a few overly optimistic fans and a small nation of fans who are deeply, deeply pessimistic to a degree that, frankly, a Mariners fan can't really even imagine.  (Joey Cora crying in the dugout, are you kidding me?  That's your big heartbreak moment?  That wouldn't crack a Cleveland fan's top 20.)

In any event, don't bother to paint a broad brush based on one or two posts on a blog.  Adam Jones, of course not.  But given last year's trades, there is little else that either you or we could put past Bavasi.  And that is what has got everyone's panties in a bunch, and that is the frustration a few of you are misdirecting at Indians fans.

Jason Davis actually is a lot like Ben Broussard, in that they're both "the kind of player that can get a manager fired."  That is, a lot of talent is visible to the eye, but the results tend not to ever show up.  I personally would rate Davis higher -- Broussard's "sweet swing" I think has bamboozled evaluators (ours and yours) more than Davis' raw stuff.  Davis could still be a very effective player, whereas nobody really believed that about Broussard a year ago.

Davis is held in high regard personally by both Wedge and Shapiro, and that's the reason he lasted this long.  He essentially was squeezed out by an overrun of K-popping relief prospects in Triple-A, and a panic-induced raft of offseason veteran reliever signings in Cleveland.  Lacking Fernando Cabrera's tools and Rafael Betancourt's track record, Davis was on a short rope, and it went quickly.  That doesn't mean he doesn't have talent.

Bottom line, if Bavasi confused the above attributes with being worthy of a top low-minors prospect, well, it wouldn't make the list of dumbest things he's ever done.  And you know that.

I think part of the reason the commenters at LGT thought/hoped we might get some sort of prime prospect is based on the injuries and general lack of pitching some teams are suffering from throughout the league. We don't have to look back that far to remember when Davis made some spot starts for the Indians, so I think some of us may have either overestimated Davis, or at least overestimated his market value.

That said, I have to back up what Jay said re: Davis's talent, which is that he has some. I'll be at least mildly surprised if the Indians don't get something out of this trade, although the PTBNL will probably not be any of the names we were throwing around (mostly as pipe dreams) at LGT. Davis is not without value, especially given all the pitching-poor teams out there this year. This isn't just a matter of how badly Seattle wants Davis, it's also keeping in mind that Seattle had to have outbid other teams that might also have looked at Davis and said, "Well, he's better than this other spare part we have right now." Or at least that he could take the place of an injured player.

In any case, I'm fairly sure that yesterday, our TV guys said that the PTBNL is expected to be named by May 20, so hopefully we'll find out which side of the Davis debate is right more quickly than not. :) (And really, that close of a "later" makes me wonder what all is really going on that makes the player not to be named right now. Just indecisiveness on Shapiro's part, or is there something going on in your farm system that might explain the need for a delay? I'm genuinely curious here.)

Look, first off, as a acquirer of MLB ready talent, Bavasi is a failure.  But that does not mean that every move he makes is an instant failure.  Let's at least see who the PTBNL is first before we melt down about how Bavasi has fucked this team over again and how every GM has his number.

Secondly, remember that PsTBNL in trades are by and large marginal prospects at best but more like minor leaguers of little consequence.  Those of you flipping because LGT even fathomed for two seconds that they might get Adam Jones or WLAD need to calm the fuck down, because that doesn't even make sense.  Even our anointed moron GM has enough sense not to include Adam Jones or WLAD on a PTBNL list without at least getting something like Casey Blake or Paul Byrd in return.  Bavasi has made horrible MLB player for MLB player moves but he's not functionally retarded.  Good lord.

Thirdly, lay off the LGT guys already.  They're just speculating, and if they want to think they might get a high end prospect or call our GM an idiot, let them.  Time and actual circumstances will tell if they are right, though this trade is not going to be the make-or-break factor.  They're not gonna call Mark Shapiro and Bill Bavasi up, put guns to their heads and demand the Mariners ship over Jeff Clement and WLAD.  They're just trying to make sense of the move, just as we are.

Also, get over AsCab and Shin Soo Choo already.  They're gone and maybe Bavasi could have gotten something better for them, MAYBE.  But he got what he got, Choo is a AAAA who MAYBE has a future as a 4th OF and AsCab bit it so hard in AAA that he's repeating AA right now.  MAYBE he has a future, but they're prospects.  Most prospect don't pan out.