Where do we go from here?

by Majic on Aug 10, 2006 7:13 PM PDT

Who can we blame for such incompetent manegement of our beloved hometown 9? Hargrove? Sure, we could, but his incompetence is a known quality at this point. We KNOW he's going to give Mateo high leverage innings. We KNOW he's going to mismanage the bench. We KNOW he's going to do his best to be Tonya Harding to Snelling's Nancy Kerrigan. Tons of things, from his long-standing quiet fued with Ichiro to unflagging loyalty given to undeserving players. We know this, baseball knows this, microbes on Neptune's moon Titan know this. So now it's a matter of figuring out who's currently at fault. Is it Bavasi sticking it out for his manager? Is it the ownership group forcing personnel issues? Who knows? But something's got to give.

What can we do? Is it feasable to form a protest? Would any of you show up? I work right next to Safeco and can be there for any kind of orginazed public statement to be made after work hours either weekdays or anytime on weekends. I'm sick of this shit. Someone has to hear how the fanbase feels about this. Fire. Mike. Fucking. Hargrove.

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No one's getting fired

this late in the season. This season is over if the M's don't make a good showing within the next two weeks. After that, Hargrove's managing won't matter. Julio Mateo coming in to inherit runners won't matter. Pineiro stinking up the join won't matter (although we actually got a good start while it lasted today).

The time for change is long gone. Either the M's storm back and make a serious run at the division title or they lumber on to the finishline. Only then will changes be made.

Buckle your seatbelts.

by ThundaPC on Aug 10, 2006 7:50 PM PDT reply actions

We can blame the team...

for winning the last game of the Texas series back in May. At that point, they had lost 6 straight and that was the final game on the trip and if he had lost, there's no doubt in my mind, he would've been fired. But they won and every other time there might be a "last straw" game, the team would win. Now it's too late in the season, and I don't think there's anything we can do this year. He's finishing the season unless someone caps him before then.

by basebliman on Aug 10, 2006 7:52 PM PDT reply actions

I wrote a letter....

which I will also be sending in paper letter form.

To Whom it may Concern,

Tonight I watched an absolute sham of a game. There were a few things that popped out at me. Namely, why was Pineiro left in for the 7th, given his poor showing in the last half of the 6th, and in the same line, why was Mateo brought in for such a vital situation, given we have three great pitchers ready and rested. This says to me that there is a lack of common sense on the managerial staff.

Far from being an isolated incident, I have seen this type of lack of baseball IQ cost us at least 5 games this season, by turning good leads to sure losses with a series of bad decisions.

On that note, until you fire that incompetent, asleep at the wheel, lousy excuse for a Little League Coach Hargrove, I refuse to watch any more games, attend any games the Mariners participate in, or buy any more Mariners products.

You will not hear from me again, until Hargrove is gone. You may want to check out www.lookoutlanding.com, you will find quite a few (former) fans that feel quite the same way I do, albeit less fed up.

-Chris Davidson

by Faux on Aug 10, 2006 9:32 PM PDT reply actions

Heard it before

I think the "I'm not going to attend any more games or buy any more merchandise" threat is a little tired by now.

You should send this to the papers, without that threat. And even though the plug for lookout landing is a nice gesture, it will look like shameless advertising to a newspaper editor. But the paper is going to be read by far more folks than anything you send directly to the club, and like it or not, popular opinion is a big determining factor in whether managers get fired or not.

by poorartists on Aug 11, 2006 5:37 AM PDT up reply actions

Well

I'd feel a lot worse about Joel coming out in the 7th and then being relieved by Mateo if the frickin' batters had done anything, but they didn't. While soul-crushing, nothing that happened in the 7th made any difference whatsoever to the outcome of the game. Joel turned in a surprisingly good outing for 5 innings. Yeah, I'd have pulled him after the 6th...and probably put Mateo in. Lowe was still unavailable tonight and there's no point wearing out Soriano. But the reality is, even if we'd gone Lowe/Soriano/Putz for the 7/8/9th, we'd still have lost because nobody pushed a run across. The pitching has been infuriating at times, but it isn't the root of the problem. The Mariners just don't hit for shit.

by Greybear on Aug 10, 2006 9:55 PM PDT reply actions

I'd have to disagree.

When you're looking at probabilities in baseball, there's a lot of wiggle room for intangible things like momentum and morale. That's why the WPA almost never hits 100%, and even then that should be considered a fluke. In a one run or two run game, I would say there are a lot more players going to say let's do this, instead of looking up at the score being 8-2 in the 7th and saying fuck it, especially when you look at the younger players.

Yea, we don't score many runs as it is, but having that kind of shit thrown in your face probably isn't going to make you want to try any harder. I can see us getting a couple runs on Tex's shitty bullpen.... but not if everyone gives up on the game.

For the record, I blame Hargrove for that as well. if you go out in the 7th, and don't see any good pitcher come out in the pen for the bottom half, you have to think to yourself, well fuck what the hell am I doing here when he's going to blow it anyways.

I'd like some backup on this, but my gut feeling is a lot more runs have been scored by the losing team in the later innings of closer games as opposed to blowouts. It just makes sense, because it's more mentally competitive as the score is closer.

by Faux on Aug 11, 2006 5:20 AM PDT up reply actions

FWIW

A certain Japanese catcher didn't give up. Base hit in the 8th.

by Gomez on Aug 11, 2006 9:06 AM PDT up reply actions

Hell yes I'd show

So long as it's on a weekend.

by Garces on Aug 10, 2006 10:24 PM PDT reply actions

I'd be there to protest.

We'll Always Have the Kingdome: Because I'll actually update it now, and I promise it's not that bad.

by BrettJMiller on Aug 10, 2006 10:38 PM PDT reply actions

Bring it on.

Lets get this piece of poop of a manager fired.

by nnnick on Aug 11, 2006 12:06 AM PDT reply actions

He needs to go...

Grover needs to be fired. Aside from his poor decision making (sending the same guy out there time after time and expecting different results is nuts), he has disenfranchised Ichiro. Ichiro's numbers suck the last three weeks. It is apparent he won't play for the idiot. They have had an ongoing, low level fued for some time. You fire the manager for blowing the season, making poor personel decisions and for pissing off the face of the franchise. You fire him so you can resign Ichiro during the off season and not have him go at the end of his contract, or have to trade him at the deadline because you cannot sign him and you have to get something for him....God forbid we are in a pennant race and have to face that decision. You fire him because after all his stupidity...it will feel good.

Let Rohn manage out the season. See how the players respond to him and how he does. Then either make it permanent or go get someone else in the off season.

Fire the moron now!

I killed a 12 pack just to watch it die...

by Dollar97 on Aug 11, 2006 9:10 AM PDT up reply actions

You can count me in

on any public protest.

by Corco on Aug 11, 2006 9:48 AM PDT reply actions

me to

and I will bring a couple friends

I will come at you like a spider monkey

by Scruffy Lefty on Aug 11, 2006 9:53 AM PDT reply actions

how about we get

100-200 or even more people to show up - all wearing 'fire hargrove t-shirts' ???

by switch11 on Aug 11, 2006 12:12 PM PDT reply actions

i would show

if i lived in seattle. but do the protest after august 25th, and i might be able to make it.

by jimmimoose1 on Aug 11, 2006 12:44 PM PDT reply actions

It needs to be done during a game...

more people to see it, more people might join you. More people to say, "Right on! Where can I get that shirt?" I will go if it becomes well organized.

by basebliman on Aug 11, 2006 2:36 PM PDT reply actions

by during a game, I do mean outside the gates

by basebliman on Aug 11, 2006 2:36 PM PDT up reply actions

Is it really necessary?

He'll be gone in two months.

by Jeff Sullivan on Aug 11, 2006 2:44 PM PDT up reply actions

Necessary, probably not...

but it would be nice to send a message, that fans are united on this and we're sick of it. If fans are passionate enough to "picket" a game because they all despise the team' manager, that's a pretty bold statement that a change must be made.

by basebliman on Aug 11, 2006 2:53 PM PDT up reply actions

What if he isn't....?

The M's seem content fielding a "competitive" team....not a winner.

I killed a 12 pack just to watch it die...

by Dollar97 on Aug 11, 2006 3:18 PM PDT up reply actions

Feh.

I hate these comments.

Any team that has high level Microsoft officers as owners will NOT be content with being competitive.

Not gauging risk correctly, however, is another story.

by rtang on Aug 11, 2006 3:33 PM PDT up reply actions

What about high level

Nintendo owners?

by Corco on Aug 11, 2006 3:45 PM PDT up reply actions

HIGH LEVEL

I own many Nintendo systems and am incredibly competitive. I'll whoop you at Tetris Attack, yo.

Marinerds - a different daily dose of baseblog.

by Deanna on Aug 11, 2006 3:52 PM PDT up reply actions

I'll take that challenge

I can whoop anyone at TA. I'll make you wish you never even discovered the game.

Bring it on.

by JLC on Aug 11, 2006 5:38 PM PDT up reply actions

He will be.

There's like a 0.1% chance that Mike Hargrove is still around in 2007. The team pretty much has to win the World Series if he wants to keep his job.

by Jeff Sullivan on Aug 11, 2006 3:35 PM PDT up reply actions

Are we really so sure?

I'm sure not -- not after what we've seen this organization do over the last few years. Keeping Hargrove around would be just the sort of mindless, infuriating, do-nothing non-action that's defined the Howard Lincoln Mariners. In fact, I'll put my money where my mouth is: I'll bet $10 -- yes, ten American dollars -- that, if the Mariners win 80 games or more, Hargrove will still be manager on Opening Day 2007.

Anyone want to take that bet? If I lose, I'll either mail you a check or, if you prefer, meet you at the bar of your choice* to spend those ten bucks on beer, where together we can raise our glasses in celebration.

*Seattle bars only. Sorry, Jeff. And you two guys in the UK can just forget about it.

Pregnancy takes nine months, no matter how many women you put on the job.

by zagreusmd on Aug 11, 2006 4:24 PM PDT up reply actions