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Around SBN: Trent Richardson Interviews Fellow Brown Brandon Weeden

12-18

A fable:

"Once upon a time there was this guy who watched a lot of baseball. He was a big fan of one pitcher in particular, but his expectations were so high that he inadvertently created a lose/lose scenario for himself in which only complete and utter domination by the pitcher could make him satisfied. Anything less left him feeling distraught and anxious that something must be horribly wrong. Before too long, he found his life spiraling out of control, living out an intoxicated, solitary existence because he could no longer trust anyone he thought he knew. Soon thereafter he would die quietly and unnoticed, a broken shell of the man he used to be. 25 years later, the pitcher was voted into the Hall of Fame on the first ballot."

(You see what I did there? It's all about symbolism.)

Biggest Contribution: Adrian Beltre, +13.7%
Biggest Suckfest: Felix Hernandez, -19.4%
Most Important Hit: Beltre double, +9.0%
Most Important Pitch: Thome homer, -13.8%
Total Contribution by Pitcher(s): -14.9%
Total Contribution by Hitters: -36.0%

(What is this?)

It certainly didn't take long to figure out how this one was going to go. Three batters into the bottom of the first, the Mariners were down 3-0, with Contreras looking okay and Felix looking like crap. It was one of those starts that made you want to just forget about the game and crawl back into bed, because the tone had been set pretty quickly, and the only thing more unpleasant than watching the M's lose for three hours while getting harassed by Hawk Harrelson and Darrin Jackson ("Did you know that I used to play baseball? I used to play baseball! Ask me about what it was like when I played baseball") is doing the same thing while Felix scuffles on the mound. Seeing him struggle conjures up a range of emotions different from those which you experience during Gil Meche's weekly abortions - it's a deeper, more personal kind of hurt, like the way God must've felt when Jesus lost the elementary school spelling bee. You don't know if you should sympathize with Felix, or be mad at him, or be mad at yourself for never seeing this coming because you expected so much, and the end result is that you just sit there with a blank stare on your face for a little while trying to figure out a more appropriate way to react. I think Mariner fans everywhere are still a little stunned. I know I am. This whole "Felix is human" thing kind of snowballed on all of us.

I could sit here and tell you that Felix's indicators still look good, that he's still getting groundballs, he's still missing bats, and he's a real good bet to look a hell of a lot better from here on out, but the fact of the matter is that he's a different pitcher than the one we saw blaze through lineups for two months last summer. What's more frustrating than that is that I have absolutely no idea why, which makes it a difficult problem to address. I wouldn't be nearly as concerned if I could just forget about those two months and pretend like this is his first exposure to the Majors, but it's both stupid and bad form to ignore that kind of successful adjustment to the highest level of competition. Felix pitched very well in AAA, but he posted a pretty high walk rate. Then he got promoted and started throwing strike after strike, keeping all the positive attributes while eliminating all the bad ones. Now it's 2006 and he's back to the command problems again (with a little gopheritis thrown in for good measure).

I have no idea what happened, but theories abound. He's not ready for the Majors. He's too immature. He's hurt. He's fat. He's not as good as we thought. The league is getting used to him the second time around. It's the catchers' fault. It's Hargrove's fault. It's God's fault. And on and on and on. Everyone's got their own idea, and everyone's got a suggestion for how to go about fixing what's wrong. What I think it'll come down to in the end, though, is how badly Felix wants to succeed. He gets visibly irritated on the mound when he gets hit or allows a walk; it's on him to figure out how to minimize the frequency with which he gets thusly irritated. It sort of touches on Bavasi's whole opinion that young players should be pushed instead of coddled so that they experience adversity early in their careers rather than getting surprised the first time they encounter it later on. The bad times are when you really get to see how committed a player is to becoming as good as possible. Now it's Felix's turn. If he works hard enough and gets back to last year's level of dominance, then that's a huge stepping stone in his career, and we should be thankful that he was able to learn from his mistakes and develop into a better player instead of pretending like he was invulnerable. And if he doesn't, and it remains a struggle for the long-term, then...then, well, I guess that's what we deserve for setting the bar so high. Right now, we can't say which is more likely. All we can do is watch and hope.

There was a bit of a scare in the second inning today, when the trainer had to come out and visit Felix on the mound, but it turned out to be nothing. If you go back to the archived MLB.tv feed and watch Felix's delivery immediately prior to the trainer's visit, you can see his right cleat momentarily getting caught in the groove in front of the rubber instead of coming up and around like usual. When the rest of your body is rapidly moving forward, that's enough to make anyone lose their balance, which is precisely what happened to Felix. He had to swing his leg around real quickly and land on it pretty hard just to keep from falling, and that can hurt for a little while. No big deal there. What's really troubling about this afternoon's game is that, for as long as I was paying attention, Felix never exceeded 92-93mph with his fastball, where he's normally able to get into the high-90s. I'm not going to jump the gun and declare a disaster scenario just yet, as this is the kind of thing that needs to repeat itself a few times before you should really start worrying that something's wrong, but Felix's delivery puts a lot of stress on his throwing shoulder, and there's no better indicator of shoulder problems than a dip in velocity, so you do the math. Keep a close eye on the radar gun going forward. If he hits 97 in the first inning the next time he pitches, then we won't have to think about this stuff, at least not yet. Let's try not to think about what we'll do if he doesn't.

In terms of handedness, velocity, and delivery, Bobby Livingston is pretty much Felix's polar opposite. I haven't seen him pitch nearly enough to decide whether or not I think he'll have success in the Majors, but what I can say is that his mechanics look pretty solid from an injury-avoidance point of view. The only thing I'd try to clean up in that respect is the way his lead glove pulls off to the third base side before release, but that's not really a big issue, as he doesn't follow it up by throwing across his body too much. Apparently it's not affecting his command, either, since all he ever does is throw strikes. Just watching his follow-through today, I could tell that he was trying to overthrow a few pitches, but this was only the second appearance of his Major League career, so I'll cut him some slack. Mechanics: good. Stuff: we'll see.

According to some research done by Nate Silver for the book Baseball Between the Numbers: Why Everything You Know About the Game is Wrong, Matt Lawton ranks as baseball's fifth-most clutch hitter since 1972. According to other research detailed in a 2005 issue of Psychological Science, smart people are more likely to choke under pressure. I guess Lawton's pop out with the bases loaded and two down in the sixth inning today is evidence that he's been reading a few too many encyclopedias this year. Eddie Guardado must be a friggin' genius. This team needs dumber players. Remember when Kaz Sasaki hurt himself carrying luggage that one time? That's the kind of flagrant idiocy that wins big ballgames.

Seattle - Top of 9th
Neal Cotts pitching for Chicago.
W Bloomquist hit for R Petagine.
B Jenks relieved N Cotts.
W Bloomquist fouled out to right.

Back home to face the Indians tomorrow, as Jamie Moyer goes up against Jake Westbrook. I'll be in Boston all weekend, therefore presumably unable to post game recaps, but I'll be watching in spirit. Which is too bad. For my spirit.

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This team needs dumber players. Remember when Kaz Sasaki hurt himself carrying luggage that one time? That's the kind of flagrant idiocy that wins big ballgames.

Maybe that's why complete morons like Ozzie and Scoiscia win world titles.  They don't beat themselves, because they don't know how to.

by Gomez on May 4, 2006 8:50 PM PDT reply actions  

Just for the sake of honest discussion...
here it is again:

Here's a few things to consider about predictive stats and their relationship to individual pitchers:

"Predictive stats have a limit to their utility in that they treat all pitchers the same. They're good in that they recognize that there are many roads to success: strikeouts can lead to good pitching, but so can groundouts and low walk rates. What they don't take into account are changes in pitching strategy that would result from pitching in front of a good defense. They also don't take into account the fact that the pitcher in question might have something exceptional to their pitching that causes them to break the rules. These exceptions can be in pitching style or in the pitches themselves. Greg Maddux, for one, has incredible intelligence on the mound that has allowed him to beat PECOTA for years. He also pitches better than his predictive (also known as peripheral) statistics would indicate. Jon Garland has maintained a .270 BA/BIP throughout his career, which is significantly less than the .300 standard for ML pitchers. For some reason, hits against him get turned into outs at a higher rate than league average. It's a skill that allows him to beat predictive stats like DIPS and xFIP. On the "stuff" side, Jose Contreras has a dominating forkball that's one of the best pitches in baseball. This, along with having a great defense behind him, may allow him to continue his pitching despite not having the component statistics to support it. Mark Buehrle has combination of both pitching style and stuff that allows him to beat his projections based on component statistics every year in his career. I believe, though I may be mistaken on this, that Buehrle has beat his component statistics by more than 1 Earned Run per nine innings several times in his career. The reason for this is that he has an incredible cut fastball that helps him against right handed hitters. He also works very quickly on the mound, which may benefit him somewhat.

All in all, I'd like to a study done about how often, and to what degree, certain pitchers outperform their projections. That would lead to a better understanding of the value that these component/peripheral/predictive statistics have to all pitchers. They might just work well for some of the guys, and require an adjustment for others. In Garland's case, lower his predicted BA/BIP to .270 in the projection. Yes, it's unusual, but he's been unusual for his entire career. In Contreras' case you can't program into the model the fact that he has a dominating pitch (unless you actually can do that). Rather, modify his projections to show that he's had one of the best Line Drive rates in the league over his pitching career. That guys don't hit line drives off him could be due to the presence of one excellent pitch."

I'd bet on Contreras having less than a 4 ERA from here on out, and finishing the season at sub-3.

by Stealfirstbase on May 4, 2006 9:09 PM PDT reply actions  

Man, I'm quick with replies tonight.
Anyway, the main thing I want to respond to is this:
In Contreras' case you can't program into the model the fact that he has a dominating pitch (unless you actually can do that). Rather, modify his projections to show that he's had one of the best Line Drive rates in the league over his pitching career. That guys don't hit line drives off him could be due to the presence of one excellent pitch.

League average line drive rate: 20.3%
Contreras 2003: 22.0%
Contreras 2004: 16.1%
Contreras 2005: 20.1%
Contreras 2006: 9.6%

You tell me which one doesn't belong.

Besides, it's been shown that pitchers have practically zero control over line drive rate anyway, so to pretend that Contreras will be able to keep this up for the next month, let alone the rest of the season, would just be you kidding yourself.

He's a fine pitcher, but he's nowhere near as good as people are making him out to be right now.

by Jeff Sullivan on May 4, 2006 10:55 PM PDT up reply actions  

Just for the sake of full disclosure
This year, Contreras has made only six starts, four of which were against the four worst hitting teams in the league (Mariners team OPS .702; Angels .700; Twins .671; Royals .655).  It is not only a small sample size, but a skewed sample size.  

by G_ on May 5, 2006 10:49 AM PDT up reply actions  

Re the speed gun
During yesterday's game, the speed gun being used on the FSN telecast was clearly slow.  According to FSN, Meche's fastball was consistently his fastball 84-86.

Don't know if that's was the same gun you saw in the telecast today.

by Steve Nelson on May 4, 2006 9:21 PM PDT reply actions  

Today was the Chicago feed.
Have no reference, but I'm guessing it wasn't off by the 5mph I wish it were.

by Jeff Sullivan on May 4, 2006 9:24 PM PDT up reply actions  

Actually
I don't know why I'd think that FSN and the Chicago feed use different radar guns.

Maybe it was slow. Here's hoping. At least that would do away with one concern.

by Jeff Sullivan on May 4, 2006 9:38 PM PDT up reply actions  

Went back to the game
hampered by the fact that showed the gun approx whenever the hell they felt like it, which turned out to be very few times (maybe once every 7 pitches or so, seriously, wtf guys, show it or don't, don't candyass):

Contreras fastball, which is supposed to be in the 94-5 range was never clocked higher than 92 and was usually at 89-90.

Livingston, who in first appearence at SafeCo was clocked by the SafeCo gun at 91-92 was now at 87.

I think the gun was slow, not by as much as we'd like, but ~3 mph seems reasonable.

by Matthew on May 4, 2006 10:53 PM PDT up reply actions  

i was at the game
gun for Meche said 92 on the heater yesterday, Felix looked like he was hitting 94 today but I wasn't looking at every fastball for Felix.

by phil333 on May 5, 2006 6:30 AM PDT up reply actions  

FSN vs Stadium guns
That, of course, is what I would expect.  That's why the 84 to 86 speeds shown by FSN caught my attention.

by Steve Nelson on May 5, 2006 6:55 AM PDT up reply actions  

Well
If it remained that slow, then Felix was touching 100-102.

by Gomez on May 4, 2006 9:25 PM PDT up reply actions  

Felix's Problem
Me thinks that its his shins that are still bothering him and effecting his performance. Could it be him trying to avoid putting to much pressure on them, that's causing him to stumble towards off the mound. When Griffin went to mound, Dave and Rizz commented that they were looking at his legs. There defiantly seems to be a Good Felix and Bad Felix this year. He'll be fine, but damnit will be hell till then

by Robert on May 4, 2006 9:37 PM PDT reply actions  

He's always fallen off the mound towards first.
Seriously, this isn't a new thing. It's still a problem, but it shouldn't be the reason why he looks so much worse now than he did last August.

Also, I assume they were looking at his right leg because that's the one he "jammed" during the one pitch where he got his cleat caught on the mound. Keep in mind that, when the trainer first came to the top step of the dugout, Felix shooed him away like nothing was wrong. I don't think his lower body is the trouble spot.

by Jeff Sullivan on May 4, 2006 9:43 PM PDT up reply actions  

That's reassuring
I was listening to it on the radio on the way home from school and they weren't as descriptive, thus making me almost drive off the road at the time. Seriously he needs to avoid a sophomore slump this year, as I have a bet going with my bandwagon jumping friend. If he ends the year with an era under 3.25 I get to cock-punch him during Felix's last home start.

by Robert on May 4, 2006 10:04 PM PDT up reply actions  

Bloomquist for Petagine...
That is a firable offence. I was a big Grover fan, but if he's too big of an idiot to see the stupidity in that move, he needs to be gone.

by PLU Tim on May 4, 2006 9:59 PM PDT reply actions  

not just Blloomquist for Petagine ...
Hargrove had his choice of matchups - Petagine vs. Cotts or Bloomquist vs. Jenks.  Hargrove opted to face Jenks rather than Cotts, while sending out the lesser of the two bats to get that matchup.

by Steve Nelson on May 4, 2006 11:09 PM PDT up reply actions  

pushing players
It sort of touches on Bavasi's whole opinion that young players should be pushed instead of coddled so that they experience adversity early in their careers rather than getting surprised the first time they encounter it later on. The bad times are when you really get to see how committed a player is to becoming as good as possible.

FWIW, I've mentioned this before, but Moyer voiced the same thought at the start of the year:

"Jamie Moyer, whose professional career began in 1984 -- two years before Hernandez was born in Valencia, Venezuela: "I've seen him on airplanes, in hotels, on the way to the ballpark, at the ballpark. His demeanor doesn't look like it ever changes. Which is a little scary. But you know what? He's a diamond in the rough. Once in a blue moon, a special player comes along."

Moyer, who has been around long enough to see many a phenom flame out, is quick to inject some caution into his assessment of Hernandez.
"I don't mean this in a bad way, but I think it will be good at some point to see him struggle," Moyer said, articulating a common sentiment among the Mariners' hierarchy. "It's going to happen; it happens to everyone. The sooner he deals with that, it will allow him to take that next step forward."

by msb on May 5, 2006 8:07 AM PDT reply actions  

Does anyone else...
hate Crede for making that play so that sportscenter showed it all damn night, then they would cut to Raul who just looked confused as to what happened.  I hate the White Sox.

by Ichiro for Pres on May 5, 2006 9:25 AM PDT reply actions  

I don't hate Crede
but just because he's on my fantasy team.
Don't bother me, I'm hustling.

by Phil Hatzenbuehler on May 5, 2006 9:35 AM PDT up reply actions  

Once again,
Jeff's posts > the games themselves

As always, well done. I personally think that God hates Felix. It started the day Felix signed a contract with the Seattle Mariners.

by jtopps on May 5, 2006 9:47 AM PDT reply actions  

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